Reasoning for it?

[Nathanyel]

Gazlowe was historically neutral as leader of the Town of Ratchet while officially part of an entirely DIFFERENT cartel

Gazlowe has been leaning towards the Horde ever since he was introduced. He built Orgrimmar, he built the Draenor Garrison. Most of the Goblins we see in the War Campaign and especially Mechagon are his employees, not (necessarily) Bilgewater members. Considering that timeframe, he took a reasonable amount of time to fully turn to the Horde. And Ratchet will likely still remain neutral, under another Goblin appointed by the Steamwheedle Trade Prince and/or Noggenfogger.

Gazlowe turning full Horde has been a long time coming, is what I'm saying.

Which you should be familiar with because it was written by you.

Yeah people love to portray their own opinion as something shared by "a lot of people".

Even more devious are "just asking questions!" threads like this one.

Watch me try to flood the suggestions threads with Alteraci Human for the Horde

I still think it's a silly idea, but I'm still for it just to fuck with people that whine about virtual characters not monolithically following their divinely appointed king.

[Ardenaso]

I still think it's a silly idea, but I'm still for it just to fuck with people that whine about virtual characters not monolithically following their divinely appointed king.

They don't have any king, best they could have is a regent lord named Jorach Ravenholdt, or probably Kira Iresoul; or probably the missing Isiden Perenolde, or maybe even Lord Blackthorn from Warcraft 3

[Nathanyel]

They don't have any king, best they could have is a regent lord named Jorach Ravenholdt, (or probably Kira Iresoul); or probably the missing Isiden Perenolde, or maybe even Lord Blackthorn from Warcraft 3

Wasn't talking about the Alteraci in particular, although I can imagine there are people that want them to swear fealty to Anduin, just because they're Humans.

[Ardenaso]

Wasn't talking about the Alteraci in particular, although I can imagine there are people that want them to swear fealty to Anduin, just because they're Humans.
I was jabbing more at how (of course understandable in a Fantasy setting) most races/nations are lead by a monarch.

I see, I guess the Alteraci or anti-Alliance Humans (like the Defias and the Fogsail) will need to go some physical changing therapy and transformation like the Nightborne did (or High Elves refusing to have green eyes and golder hair and fel affinity) to officially veer away from the Alliance and the "binding" contract

[Minikin]

Because they are wholly ignorant of her lore.

That and tRaITOR is their favourite word this expansion right along with BLoOD OaTH

[Nathanyel]

Wasn't talking about the Alteraci in particular, although I can imagine there are people that want them to swear fealty to Anduin, just because they're Humans.

I was jabbing more at how (of course understandable in a Fantasy setting) most races/nations are lead by a monarch - even Velen is a kind of 'Pope King' - the Draenei's exodus could be construed as a kind of separatism from the former quasi-representative/oligarchic system that, by chance, left Velen as the solitary Supreme Leader.
I kid, of course, Warcraft player race leaders are beenvolent, for the most part (recent oustings prove the rule) and mostly, they're selfish at worst, with Moira's attempted coup that nearly turned into a civil war being the largest unpunished "evil" action.

[Thage]

So I see a lot of horde people calling valeera a traitor on the official forums, why do people think that is true? Because she is a Horde race?

A lot of people hadn't read the comics that introduced her (where she is portrayed as a teenager, with many characters referring to her as a child) as one of Varian's teammates in the gladiatorial ring, and her only appearances ingame prior to Legion were small bit parts in the WotLK invasion event, the Battle for the Undercity, and another small cameo I can't remember offhand. So most players don't know why this blood elf is all buddy-buddy with Varian, or why she's working with the Alliance afterwards. The fact that most characters are affiliated by racial lines doesn't help matters--I would expect that if Vanessa VanCleef joined the Horde, players who don't keep up with the lore and only remember her as a helper NPC in Legion would also call her a traitor.

[Alanar]

Basically. Just because she is a Blood Elf means she needs to be loyal to the Horde. She was never aligned with the Horde though. She was raised with Varian in the Gladiators pit. So she was loyal to him

Ye such a shit story I know.

Well yea she is handing out quests in dazar alor and seconds later she teleports out to stormwind to joke with anduin giving horde fake quest letters..

Ofc people dont like her on the horde side and the horde knows she is bff with anduin now soo... any questions?.

[Thage]

I was jabbing more at how (of course understandable in a Fantasy setting) most races/nations are lead by a monarch - even Velen is a kind of 'Pope King' - the Draenei's exodus could be construed as a kind of separatism from the former quasi-representative/oligarchic system that, by chance, left Velen as the solitary Supreme Leader.
I kid, of course, Warcraft player race leaders are beenvolent, for the most part (recent oustings prove the rule) and mostly, they're selfish at worst, with Moira's attempted coup that nearly turned into a civil war being the largest unpunished "evil" action.

To be fair, Moira's coup led to Ironforge's government being restructured at swordpoint, so it's not really unpunished. She lost her monarchy and has to rule in a representative triumvirate.

[Ardenaso]

I would expect that if Vanessa VanCleef joined the Horde

Yes! Defias Brotherhood + Fogsail Pirates + Ravenholdt + Blackthorn Bandits to make Alteraci Human for the Horde

[Feanoro]

Because a LOT of Hordies only see things through the lens of race and ignore any other motivations or situations, and as another poster said, they love to shriek tRaItOr over any Horde racial character that doesn't want to swim in a lake of Alliance blood.

[Nnyco]

Valeera never was horde.

[Nathanyel]

To be fair, Moira's coup led to Ironforge's government being restructured at swordpoint, so it's not really unpunished. She lost her monarchy and has to rule in a representative triumvirate.

True, but she didn't get punished personally. She's still the leader of the Dark Iron, she has influence over Ironforge, and her son is still in line for the Bronzebeard throne for when Muradin and Brann are... "out of the picture".

[Mehrunes]

That and tRaITOR is their favourite word this expansion right along with BLoOD OaTH

Because a LOT of Hordies only see things through the lens of race and ignore any other motivations or situations, and as another poster said, they love to shriek tRaItOr over any Horde racial character that doesn't want to swim in a lake of Alliance blood.

Or, you know, they love to "shriek" that over any Horde character that doesn't want to follow Horde and teams up with the Alliance, because words mean things. In that vein, weird usage of "shrieking" there. Not that it's relevant to Valeera as she hasn't really ever been Horde so you're just projecting (and derailing) here, because people properly describing Saurfang et all offend you or something.

[Minikin]

Or, you know, they love to "shriek" that over any Horde character that doesn't want to follow Horde and teams up with the Alliance, because words mean things. In that vein, weird usage of "shrieking" there. Not that it's relevant to Valeera as she hasn't really ever been Horde so you're just projecting (and derailing) here, because people properly describing Saurfang et all offend you or something.

its interesting that you say we are offended yet someone in the multitudes of posts find time to quote me and rant about it XD. im sure you arent offended........like at all....

[derpkitteh]

any thalassian elf that dwells in or tolerates the presence of humans for more than long enough to negotiate, is a traitor.

she, along with every other thalassian, should still hate humanity.

- - - Updated - - -

Gazlowe has been leaning towards the Horde ever since he was introduced. He built Orgrimmar, he built the Draenor Garrison. Most of the Goblins we see in the War Campaign and especially Mechagon are his employees, not (necessarily) Bilgewater members. Considering that timeframe, he took a reasonable amount of time to fully turn to the Horde. And Ratchet will likely still remain neutral, under another Goblin appointed by the Steamwheedle Trade Prince and/or Noggenfogger.

Gazlowe turning full Horde has been a long time coming, is what I'm saying.

to add to this, in the cataclysm barrens questing, gazlowe also has you blow up an alliance boat.

[Newname1234567890]

Varian's carbon copy Thrall story has way more issues with it than that....

Note that gladiator slave fighting pits only existed as part of Orgrimmar AFTER they wrote Varian's story

- - - Updated - - -



Well recent story leader options don't help there. Gazlowe now Leading the Bilgewater Cartel and Voss on the Forsaken... pushed into their positions seemingly because they are a goblin and undead respectively... Gazlowe was historically neutral as leader of the Town of Ratchet while officially part of an entirely DIFFERENT cartel and prior to the BFA bullshit Voss was just another undead that left after waking up.

Valeera? She's just another Elf trophy for a human to keep around because an author thought every human figurehead needs an elf with them.

Gazlowe has always showed Horde leanings. Goblins are corporate as fuck, he got offered a promotion and took it changing companies as well. Just like irl humans do.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

If you had had, say, a dwarf who has been working for Sylvanas since at least WotLK, you could really tell that he is a traitor, couldn't you?

Was that Dwarf part of the Alliance originally? Because Valeera was never once a member of the Horde.

[DemonHunter18]

Why just the official forum? Here's a post from this one:


Which you should be familiar with because it was written by you.

WoW what a burn xd

nice one /thumbs up

[Naramag]

I blame Garithos. If that monkey was dropped on his head when he was born, High Elves (Blood elves) would still be part of the Alliance. God knows how would their path develop then... If Kael stayed in the Alliance and had help from humans (instead of nagas >>>> connected to Illidan)

Nope. While Garithos really killed it by trying to get the elves killed, that's not the reason. The High elves left the Alliance earlier, before the third war. Garithos just really blew any chance for the elves to return to Alliance.
And the blood elves are quite angry about every elf who stayed with the alliance. Because being patriotic and putting your people and your homeland above is the greatest thing an elf can do. By renaming themselves bloodelves, they wanted to remember all those who died to defend their home. And every high elve that refuses that is not only a traitor, but is disregarding the sacrifices. Not only were they those elves not there to protect their ancestral home, but in the end they are pissing on the graves of the victims.