Another "I can't breath" death: Police Reform & Protests in the USA

[szechuan]

But not vice versa, since corruption doesn't automatically result in systemic racism

Yet it clearly has

so your point is null and void.

Not at all.

[Themius]

https://www.ohchr.org/Documents/Coun...sionReport.pdf

Maybe this will get your attention, probably not, can't wait how you're going to dismiss it.

The parts about law enforcement and racial discrimination start on page 12 with the interesting bits in paragraphs 45-49.

Italy is the only country without racist cops, sure.

When Italy had their first female black politician all hell broke loose and she faced a large amount of racism.

[Grapemask]

When Italy had their first female black politician all hell broke loose and she faced a large amount of racism.

It's like when the US had its first black president and conservatives all lost their minds, and now insist he escalated racial tensions to a point not seen in decades... by existing and being black, presumably.

[Yadryonych]

@Rozz Shouldn't this thread be renamed into American unrest Megathread and moved to politics section? To pretend this all is related exclusively to "another 'I cant breathe' death" is like saying World War I was a struggle to avenge Franz Ferdinand's murder.

Mod Edit: Discussion is still centered over the original topic is fine where it is.

[Coolthulhu]

Italy is the only country without racist cops, sure.

I've never said that. I said it's not a systemic issue within LE. There's quite a bit of a difference there, but by all means, keep putting words in my mouth.
The OHCHR and their buddies at the UNHCR reports have always been murky and methodologically questionable, doesn't take a genius to see through the lack of sources and their dismissal of whatever the government's (be it left or right wing) says to address their concerns. Those paragraphs are extremely anecdotal, and in my personal experience, false. I visit the Questura very often due to gun-related stuff and there are always throngs of migrants applying for asylum, at all hours. The typical scenario in a Questura or Commissariato is a waiting room with 70% migrants requesting asylum, and 30% Italians there to report crimes or get their passports renewed and the like.
There have been probes on lawyers making money out of migrants (money obtained how?) in order to obtain permits under false pretenses, both through instructing them to lie about their age, sexual orientation and making up stories of abuse in the countries they came from (which is unverifiable because they lack documents), so measures had to be taken, but that document conveniently omits that, and I'd also would want to see sources for migrants not being allowed to see lawyers inside LE buildings (but again sources must remain confidential, how convenient for making up stuff), especially given the fact that it's not rare for migrants who commit crimes to receive a much more lenient treatment than an Italian would, and they're processed much more quickly, too (which explains the many instances in which the police had to arrest the same person for the same crime repeatedly over the course of 24-72 hours, because many judges are either politicized or scared of being branded as racists, so they don't apply the law as they would in Italian nationals).
The most hilarious part of that document and you posting it, however, is that the sourced parts are those acknowledging Italy's many laws and systems in place to prevent discrimination. Are you sure you've read through it? If you did, you could've cherry-picked the points better, in the hopes that I wouldn't read it. Perhaps that could've won you some points, but alas...

Yet it clearly has



Not at all.

Ok.

[Levelfive]

I mean this ends instantly if they swap rubber bullets for real ones.

Anyone who actually believes this has grievously misread the moment.

[Mayhem]

I've never said that. I said it's not a systemic issue within LE. There's quite a bit of a difference there, but by all means, keep putting words in my mouth.
The OHCHR and their buddies at the UNHCR reports have always been murky and methodologically questionable, doesn't take a genius to see through the lack of sources and their dismissal of whatever the government's (be it left or right wing) says to address their concerns. Those paragraphs are extremely anecdotal, and in my personal experience, false. I visit the Questura very often due to gun-related stuff and there are always throngs of migrants applying for asylum, at all hours. The typical scenario in a Questura or Commissariato is a waiting room with 70% migrants requesting asylum, and 30% Italians there to report crimes or get their passports renewed and the like.
There have been probes on lawyers making money out of migrants (money obtained how?) in order to obtain permits under false pretenses, both through instructing them to lie about their age, sexual orientation and making up stories of abuse in the countries they came from (which is unverifiable because they lack documents), so measures had to be taken, but that document conveniently omits that, and I'd also would want to see sources for migrants not being allowed to see lawyers inside LE buildings (but again sources must remain confidential, how convenient for making up stuff), especially given the fact that it's not rare for migrants who commit crimes to receive a much more lenient treatment than an Italian would, and they're processed much more quickly, too (which explains the many instances in which the police had to arrest the same person for the same crime repeatedly over the course of 24-72 hours, because many judges are either politicized or scared of being branded as racists, so they don't apply the law as they would in Italian nationals).
The most hilarious part of that document and you posting it, however, is that the sourced parts are those acknowledging Italy's many laws and systems in place to prevent discrimination. Are you sure you've read through it? If you did, you could've cherry-picked the points better, in the hopes that I wouldn't read it. Perhaps that could've won you some points, but alas...

And dismissed without sources but personal anecdotes while saying the paragraphs are extremely anecdotal.

Why should I cherry-pick? You have your anecdotes I have a report, of course, just question their methods or findings because who would want to acknowledge problems in their country, better to ignore things and hope for the best.

Look, it's easy, either there are no racist cops in Italy, or there are racist cops that are protected by the system, which makes it systemic racism. If you acknowledge there being racist cops in Italy without providing evidence that the system is especially cautious and keen on making examples out of them then you have systemic racism.

No one thinks that makes Italy a hell hole or worse than the US it's just in line with every other European country and change needs to be made. Considering though your anecdotal stories paint a rather clear picture of what you think of migrants let's just say I think you're more likely to find excuses for the police than siding with people who risk their lives and spent their livelihood for a chance in life.

[Edge-]

https://www.foxnews.com/media/antifa...dercover-video

Despite the god damned FBI confirming that there is no antifa presence at the protests, Project Veritas, known liars and pieces of shit who suck at their jobs but still manage to fool a bunch of rubes, totally interviewed a real life, actual antifa member to made outrageous claims.

Of course, Fox News picked it up because why wouldn't they? They have no other way of tying actual antifa bogeymen to these events, so just report on some made up shit and call it a day.

Fuck all these people for exploiting this shit to spread lies.

[Deja Thoris]

...
[Infraction]

Haha, one post and banned for peddling this shit again. Score one for the mods here.

[Muzjhath]

There are about 18k of them. We should only have one per state.

You could argue one per county.

[Dug]

Kokolums is unique I'll give him that. I've not read anywhere else from boogaloo lunatics that Russia and China are joining forces with Republicans lmao

[s_bushido]

Shouldn't this thread be renamed into American unrest Megathread and moved to politics section? To pretend this all is related exclusively to "another 'I cant breathe' death" is like saying World War I was a struggle to avenge Franz Ferdinand's murder.

I know people want desperately to believe this isn't about his murder and what it represents, but man, this is some next level head in the sand shit.

[Edge-]

Kokolums is unique I'll give him that. I've not read anywhere else from boogaloo lunatics that Russia and China are joining forces with Republicans lmao

It always amuses me to see the "patriotic" Americans giddy at the prospect of murdering their fellow Americans to save the country, eager to join forces with our hostile adversaries to "murder the libs".

[-aiko-]

https://twitter.com/i/status/1268095379515617280

Supposedly leaked police radio scanner audio.
"Run them over"
"Shoot those motherfuckers"

[Edge-]

https://twitter.com/i/status/1268095379515617280

Supposedly leaked police radio scanner audio.
"Run them over"
"Shoot those motherfuckers"

That...sounds edited, especially the "Shoot those motherfuckers" part. I'll wait for confirmation on that, but it's depressing that I don't instantly believe that it can't be true.

[Felya]

https://twitter.com/i/status/1268095379515617280

Supposedly leaked police radio scanner audio.
"Run them over"
"Shoot those motherfuckers"

Don’t put that over the air... wtf?

[s_bushido]

https://twitter.com/i/status/1268095379515617280

Supposedly leaked police radio scanner audio.
"Run them over"
"Shoot those motherfuckers"

eh...I'd take stuff like that with a huge grain of salt. I don't even know how you'd go about verifying it.

[Aurgjelme]

https://twitter.com/i/status/1268095379515617280

Supposedly leaked police radio scanner audio.
"Run them over"
"Shoot those motherfuckers"

Are moderators sharing conspiracy theories from activists on twitter the new standard on this page?

I mean, we are ok with them circle jerking each other with people who call the entire police force pigs and call for abolishing the system.

[Thekri]

Are moderators sharing conspiracy theories from activists on twitter the new standard on this page?

I mean, we are ok with them circle jerking each other with people who call the entire police force pigs and call for abolishing the system.

Notice how this alleged "Circle Jerk" is hugely skeptical of it? This is the flaw with a lot of claims that it is all an echo chamber, most people on here actually do question sources all the time, even if they fit the narrative. The ones that don't are mostly Trump supporters.

And I don't trust that recording at all. It sounds like what somebody imagines the police sound like.

[-aiko-]

eh...I'd take stuff like that with a huge grain of salt. I don't even know how you'd go about verifying it.

Yeah, no idea how verification would be done, hence 'supposedly'. Kind of my problem with a lot of this tbh, it's a huge mess. Still, that I immediately didn't dismiss it is kind of scary. It's easy to believe this kind of thing when you have videos of cops pushing old people to the ground etc.