Why doesnt the horde use the iron horde technology?

[Super Dickmann]

The AU Mag'har also has Light users in their midst, as well as Shaman and just regular people who probably wouldn't really enjoy the ambience. I also don't recall it being remodeled in any real fashion during the Baine scenario? IIRC Sylvanas moved a few props and equipment in but little else.

I mean they changed the doodads and I'm pretty sure some of the Forsaken assets there are exclusive to that one scenario. As for Light users, is that canonical or just gameplay convenience? We know they have major issues with the Light because of Yrel and company. Now the Shamans being in a place where the elements were tortured is an iffy point, but for civilians it'd really vary. Blackrocks are fine with living underground, Warsongs and Thunderlords probably less so.

This kind of thread annoys me because there's so much they can do with the Mag'har just internally, let alone in the context of the larger Horde.

[Orisai]

It took 35 years to get the raw materials, production machinery, and facilities the Iron Horde had in Draenor. Not to mention the Iron Horde had a HUGE army, probably the size the Alliance and Horde ones combined, plus Draenei slaves.

[Traveler Voltin]

It took 35 years to get the raw materials, production machinery, and facilities the Iron Horde had in Draenor. Not to mention the Iron Horde had a HUGE army, probably the size the Alliance and Horde ones combined, plus Draenei slaves.

it was 2 years after garrosh's arrival that they attacked azeroth.

[DeltrusDisc]

Always wanted an actual Iron Star mount, reminds me of the Buzz Boar from GIJoe.

You will take your Iron Star pet that you hopefully got and like it!

[MikeBogina]

Yeah not really. Horde shouldn't even have an army anymore at this point. Horde has been broken down soo many times last expansions. Yet you guys are apperently just as strong as the alliance still.

Logically you should be stomped over by us Alliance by now.

Yeah it's crazy how we're still up there with the Alliance who keep getting wrecked. Like how do we even match their infinite farm boys that they keep recruiting!

Seriously hit me with some facts, how do you think the Alliance should be stronger? I'm sure you're including things like the Horde's victories in Cataclysm, Bombing of Theramore, wiping out the Night Elves and using Undercity to wipe out the Alliance's army, and the Alliance's 2 major naval losses.

Logically the Alliance has infinite farm boys to recruit for all these wars, against not just the Horde but the Scourge, Burning Legion, Old Gods and others who've they've thrown themselves.

But really all that nonsense aside, look at who both sides have recruited. The Blood Elves, Goblins, NightBourne, Highmountain and Zandalari have bolstered the Horde like crazy. The few Draenei, Worgen, Lightforged, Void Elves dont bolster the alliance numbers like the Horde ones do. The Kultirans are the first new Alliance race that actually has a sizable population and they're matched by a few Horde ones.

Logically.. your statement is just wrong lol

[Gurahk]

Remember, the base back in Draenor for the Mag'har still utilized Iron Horde tech, and you even man a cannon and shoot small iron stars at the draenei.
Not to mention they somehow built a train track.

[Aucald]

I mean they changed the doodads and I'm pretty sure some of the Forsaken assets there are exclusive to that one scenario. As for Light users, is that canonical or just gameplay convenience? We know they have major issues with the Light because of Yrel and company. Now the Shamans being in a place where the elements were tortured is an iffy point, but for civilians it'd really vary. Blackrocks are fine with living underground, Warsongs and Thunderlords probably less so.

According to the Mag'har recruitment scenario the Mag'har and Draenei enjoyed a bit of a cultural exchange, with many Orcs being trained in the ways of the Light as Priests before AU Xe'ra arrived and the Draenei went all fanatical and created the Lightbound. This is the reason why the Mag'har have playable Priests, as they represent the Light-users who didn't join the Lightbound and so turn against the Mag'har. So those Light-users who remain, as well as the Shaman and most individuals not accustomed to Void/Death essences would likely have the normal odium towards such energies you see in the mainstream. Structurally and aesthetically they'd be fine with the Underhold as a refuge, I'd say; but fundamentally the place is probably haunted by the past and the many horrible things done there.

[Utrrabbit]

it was 2 years after garrosh's arrival that they attacked azeroth.

It was actually 35 years for garrosh being their. 2 years the players time.

[Lixaris]

The same reason Draenei did not obliterate us with their spaceship

[Thage]

It's probably a logistical issue. At this point, we're on the third back-to-back war where the Alliance and Horde have completely exhausted their militaries to the point that the Alliance was down to conscripting any random asshole who could be taught where the pointy end of the spear goes and can be trusted with marching in formation for longer than an hour (and in the most previous war, was still within weeks of a resounding victory as estimated by both factions, before both factions' navies got decimated by the naga working with Sylvanas). Even taking into account early lore that the orcs apparently grow up fast even without being artificially aged by warlocks and have an extremely high birth rate (in The Last Guardian Garona explicitly mentions orcs being fecund and able to rapidly replenish their ranks just by fuckin'), the Horde probably has a serious labor shortage during peacetime, ditto the Alliance.

I brought up the situation in the Fourth War specifically, because if the Alliance was down to throwing any able-bodied man and woman they could find into the meat grinder, but were still a hair's breadth from winning, the Horde logically was in worse shape even before Saurfang made his move and began amassing dissidents and malcontents to his banner. And both are in even worse shape after the hit they took from Nazjatar opening up beneath their navies. edit: And this, of course, doesn't take into account the inevitable losses suffered both during the awakening of Nya'lotha and the Scourge running rampant after the Helm of Domination was shattered.

Seeing what we saw of the Blackrock manufacturing processes, and those in the Underhold, that's an awful lot of moving parts that likely require a lot of trained engineers and smarter-than-average peons to keep functioning. The Horde very likely doesn't have the bodies to spare on that when they've got so much else on their plate and an ever-expanding list of shit going wrong in rapid order.

[Traveler Voltin]

It was actually 35 years for garrosh being their. 2 years the players time.

no. it was 2 years.

players were only there for a year.

[Thage]

no. it was 2 years.

players were only there for a year.

You misunderstand him. The flow of time was different because of where in the timeline Kairoz took Garrosh to. Kairoz took Garrosh back thirty-five years so Garrosh would have ample time to industrialize the Iron Horde using Blackfuse's schematics and recipes, but from the time between Garrosh and Kairoz making good their escape and the Dark Portal linking to Draenor, it only took two years' time on Azeroth.

From there, the heroes of Azeroth dismantled the Iron Horde and fought back the Legion incursion in a year. Another few decades passed between the end of WoD and the Mag'har scenario, long enough for another generation to come of age and for the draenei to radicalize and begin their crusade against the Mag'har.

[Hugnomo]

According to the Mag'har recruitment scenario the Mag'har and Draenei enjoyed a bit of a cultural exchange, with many Orcs being trained in the ways of the Light as Priests before AU Xe'ra arrived and the Draenei went all fanatical and created the Lightbound. This is the reason why the Mag'har have playable Priests, as they represent the Light-users who didn't join the Lightbound and so turn against the Mag'har. So those Light-users who remain, as well as the Shaman and most individuals not accustomed to Void/Death essences would likely have the normal odium towards such energies you see in the mainstream. Structurally and aesthetically they'd be fine with the Underhold as a refuge, I'd say; but fundamentally the place is probably haunted by the past and the many horrible things done there.

I think the reason Mag'har are able to be priests is because of the shadowmoon clan. Not really a "cultural exchange". Is there any evidence to it?

[Nynax]

I don't think the Mag'har refugees had anything in common with the Iron Horde when they escaped, they were basically the next generation of a long-defeated power. The reason they're so boring is because they're just uncorrupted orcs who banded together after being thoroughly defeated by Yrel and her light-forces. The clans and their traditions are probably a distant memory.

Not entirely. The Horde quests leading to Mechagon involve a goblin and Mag'har teaming up to combine Mag'har tech with Goblin..."ingenuity." Point is, there are clearly some that still remember how the Iron Horde built things.

[Super Dickmann]

According to the Mag'har recruitment scenario the Mag'har and Draenei enjoyed a bit of a cultural exchange, with many Orcs being trained in the ways of the Light as Priests before AU Xe'ra arrived and the Draenei went all fanatical and created the Lightbound. This is the reason why the Mag'har have playable Priests, as they represent the Light-users who didn't join the Lightbound and so turn against the Mag'har. So those Light-users who remain, as well as the Shaman and most individuals not accustomed to Void/Death essences would likely have the normal odium towards such energies you see in the mainstream. Structurally and aesthetically they'd be fine with the Underhold as a refuge, I'd say; but fundamentally the place is probably haunted by the past and the many horrible things done there.

They were allies for a bit to clean up the Legion, but we don't ever see any holy Mag'har priests, what we do see are Shadowmoon void ritualists, who are represented by shadow priests because it's the closest to that effect. I won't discount them being somewhat more open to the Light before Xe'ra showed up, but we don't really see it in evidence, they mostly seem unhappy with the Light and associate it with the draenei and their control. We see the Shadowmoon orcs do the same thing Ner'zhul's did on Draenor and while they're shamanistic, I don't think they'd be automatically anti-void, indeed, the opposite. The Death thing I can more readily see.

In general Ihe out of story reason is obviously cost-saving, but in-story I can also buy that it's a large space and since only some clans would be up for it, it'd not be settled.

[Traveler Voltin]

You misunderstand him. The flow of time was different because of where in the timeline Kairoz took Garrosh to. Kairoz took Garrosh back thirty-five years so Garrosh would have ample time to industrialize the Iron Horde using Blackfuse's schematics and recipes, but from the time between Garrosh and Kairoz making good their escape and the Dark Portal linking to Draenor, it only took two years' time on Azeroth.

From there, the heroes of Azeroth dismantled the Iron Horde and fought back the Legion incursion in a year. Another few decades passed between the end of WoD and the Mag'har scenario, long enough for another generation to come of age and for the draenei to radicalize and begin their crusade against the Mag'har.

check again. he said garrosh was there for 35 years.

[MikeBogina]

They were allies for a bit to clean up the Legion, but we don't ever see any holy Mag'har priests, what we do see are Shadowmoon void ritualists

Yeah when I saw that Mag'har could be priests, my first thought was Shadowmoon Orcs, not that these Orcs who were resisting the Light were wielding the light.
These Mag'har to my knowledge are resisting the Draenei and the Light heavily, doesn't make sense that they're light using Priests, since Light requires faith and how do you have faith when you're fighting against it.

[Aucald]

I think the reason Mag'har are able to be priests is because of the shadowmoon clan. Not really a "cultural exchange". Is there any evidence to it?

Geya'rah refers to it a few times in gossip quotes, such as:

"As a child, draenei scholars taught me to read and write. I liked them. Respected them."
"After Archimonde's fall, the orcs and draenei worked together to drive the Legion from Draenor. Those were good years."

It was some time before the coming of Xe'ra and the formation of the Lightbound, and in that time it seems there was an abiding peace and trust between the AU Draenei and Mag'har - a peace broken only when Draenor began to fade for some reason (most likely it finally being consumed as a temporary timeway), and the Draenei embraced fanaticism and zealotry.

[Razion]

According to the Mag'har recruitment scenario the Mag'har and Draenei enjoyed a bit of a cultural exchange, with many Orcs being trained in the ways of the Light as Priests before AU Xe'ra arrived and the Draenei went all fanatical and created the Lightbound. This is the reason why the Mag'har have playable Priests, as they represent the Light-users who didn't join the Lightbound and so turn against the Mag'har. So those Light-users who remain, as well as the Shaman and most individuals not accustomed to Void/Death essences would likely have the normal odium towards such energies you see in the mainstream. Structurally and aesthetically they'd be fine with the Underhold as a refuge, I'd say; but fundamentally the place is probably haunted by the past and the many horrible things done there.

Geya'rah refers to it a few times in gossip quotes, such as:

"As a child, draenei scholars taught me to read and write. I liked them. Respected them."
"After Archimonde's fall, the orcs and draenei worked together to drive the Legion from Draenor. Those were good years."

It was some time before the coming of Xe'ra and the formation of the Lightbound, and in that time it seems there was an abiding peace and trust between the AU Draenei and Mag'har - a peace broken only when Draenor began to fade for some reason (most likely it finally being consumed as a temporary timeway), and the Draenei embraced fanaticism and zealotry.

Huh? Wait, shouldn't Mag'har have Paladins then?

[Cyclone Duke]

Isn't the iron horde technology just... current-age horde technology that garrosh brought back to AU draenor in the past? So just like going back to world war 1 and showing them today's weapons from 2020?

So isn't Iron Horde tech just.... basic Azeroth tech? I guess btw, it was trumped by azerite