Is Superman super intelligent?

[Shelly]

Spider-Man? Nope
Wolverine? Nah
Captain America? Nuh uh
Iron Man? Nah Brah

Spidey - This one I'd say is pretty original just because he's part of the original "heroes with problems" Marvel ethos. For inspiration though I'd point to Robin.
Wolverine - Wildcat is probably the closest example, although since Wolverine started as a hulk villain you'd be better off citing characters like Cheetarah.
Captain America - Golden Age Superman
Iron Man - definitely Batman.

Really though the main source of overlap between the two franchises is Jack Kirby. His art style defined both businesses for decades and he's responsible for the New Gods as well as Thor which are both takes on each other along with countless other characters. Hulk - Solomon Grundy, Thanos - Darkseid, Asgardians - New Gods, and so on.

[Fencers]

Friedman and Starlin created Thanos, taking the basic inspiration from Kirby's Darkseid.

I just think it's important to note Starlin and Friedman were the creators of Thanos. In case anyone gets it mixed up with Kirby as is often the case.

[Beloren]

Could be that Supes just leaves Bats to do his thing, cos he respects him and isn’t insecure or egotistical to feel he has to do everything.

But it’s likely Superman could do all the tech things Bats does and more with his knowledge.

Bats though needs to be that savvy. He doesn’t have super powers so relies on using all his wits and gadgets to do what needs to be done.

Bats also understands certain elements of humanity much more. And is street smart. Supes is a farm boy country boy. With that same persona. Bats might be a rich boy but he knows city streets well and corporate crooks.

[Shadowferal]

"Street smart" translates to someone that needs that kind of awareness, which isn't something Superman needs.

An alternate Hyperion from Marvel;


Hyper-intelligence: Hyperion has been able to calculate the impact point of one of Ex Nihilo's Origin Bombs when Avengers Tower's computers could not, even noting specific flaws in the computers' design while doing it. He is capable of interpreting DNA code at a glance, accurately enough to determine parentage. His mind itself is a nonlinear photonic array, storing his memories in light, with virtually instantaneous recall: his mind is structured in such a manner that memories are to him as 'real' as the present, his most vivid memory dominating his perceptions.

[Egomaniac]

He was trapped on Earth while growing up. Its not much of a trap but he was more or less confined if only out of inexperience.



Name one advantage that Superman has over Surfer. Its not strength, speed or durability.



Batman
Plus one for Len Wein
Sure
Batman

Daredevil? Batman
X-men? Doom Patrol
Deadpool? MOOHAHA

Spider-Man is nothing like Batman.

Iron Man has a passing similarity to Bruce Wayne in the fact that they are both Rich...but the similarities fade quickly after that. Stan Lee's goal with Iron Man was to take an unlikable character and make him a hero anyway.

Doom Patrol is mentioned in the article I linked. The Publication Dates make it very difficult to believe that the X-Men were created as a ripoff of Doom Patrol. Maybe Marvel Ripped off the marketing. And the same applies to DC ripping off Man-thing with Swamp Thing. The closeness of their publications makes it seem like it's more just a really strange coincidence.

Deadpool...sure. He's a Deathstroke Ripoff in character design(though Liefeld will still deny it to this day). The Characters themselves couldn't be more different though.

Daredevil and Batman...sure...similarities are there...but, once again, the characters are completely different. What they have in common is they go out at night and beat up criminals. Which is kind of the whole gig of being a vigilante.

And, as the article I linked showed, DC rips off Marvel just as much.

Aquaman? Namor.
Mr. Terrific? Mr. Fantastic

[Ivanstone]

Spider-Man is nothing like Batman.

Iron Man has a passing similarity to Bruce Wayne in the fact that they are both Rich...but the similarities fade quickly after that. Stan Lee's goal with Iron Man was to take an unlikable character and make him a hero anyway.

Doom Patrol is mentioned in the article I linked. The Publication Dates make it very difficult to believe that the X-Men were created as a ripoff of Doom Patrol. Maybe Marvel Ripped off the marketing. And the same applies to DC ripping off Man-thing with Swamp Thing. The closeness of their publications makes it seem like it's more just a really strange coincidence.

Deadpool...sure. He's a Deathstroke Ripoff in character design(though Liefeld will still deny it to this day). The Characters themselves couldn't be more different though.

Daredevil and Batman...sure...similarities are there...but, once again, the characters are completely different. What they have in common is they go out at night and beat up criminals. Which is kind of the whole gig of being a vigilante.

And, as the article I linked showed, DC rips off Marvel just as much.

Aquaman? Namor.
Mr. Terrific? Mr. Fantastic

A troubled but intelligent youth with a deceased parental figure is inspired to be a crime fighter with an animal based name? Said hero is a strong, agile and capable fighter. Some gadgetry is involved. Yep, Spider-Man is nothing like Batman

You can always spot the Marvel Zombie. Just admit that Marvel shamelessly rips off DC. The ripoffs aren’t clones and there are differences between the two. Those differences are worthwhile and too be appreciated.

PS The Fantastic Four is a ripoff of the Challengers of the Unknown. Mr Fantastic is also a ripoff of Plastic Man. Mr Terrific dates back to the 40s and is a ripoff of Batman and other pulp crime fighters from the 30s.

[qwerty123456]

According to Red Son Superman is smarter than Luthor, but Luthor is more ruthless. Even when compared to evil soviet superman.

Basically though it's not even smarts so much as training. Superman has access to and has been instructed by the libraries of Krypton that were left to him by his father. So that gives him a pretty big leg up and allowed him to create robot supermen and helpers in the fortress of solitude.

Of course Superman is smarter. Just think of all the women Superman has in his spank bank after hearing a woman scream bloody murder only to arrive on the scene and find out its because she saw a spider in the shower or crazy yet hot chicks who want a chance at superman so put themselves in dangerous situations half naked/naked. Meanwhile Lex has a chauffeur/bodyguard he pays that bones him.

[Egomaniac]

Am I wrong here? Is he definitely a weaker grade Superman or is that purely a speculation thing/up to each person to decide and imagine for themselves ??

Yes, you are wrong here. He's a weaker grade of Superman. Still the most powerful being on Earth...but lesser than other incarnations.

BvS shows that exposure to Kryptonite leaves Superman so weak that he gets easily manhandled by Batman (to the point where, If Superman's mother had any other name than "Martha"...Bruce would have killed him right then). Superman Returns has Clark fly an entire Island of Kryptonite into space. These two things just are not compatible.

Man Of Steel also establishes that Clark was sick as a baby...because he had to adapt to Earth's Atmosphere. This is something unique to this incarnation of Superman. This is mostly used as Zod's justification for Terraforming Earth instead of sharing it with humanity. It's also pretty much completely ignored after Zod himself is exposed to Earth's Atmosphere. It takes him a couple minutes to adjust...but as soon as he seems to be just as impervious as Clark is and, despite that Jor-El told Clark earlier that the only way to increase his powers was to constantly press the limits of what he can do, Zod seems to be just as Powerful as Clark is.

Reeve/Routh Superman also has Ice Breath. Cavill Superman has never displayed this ability.

[Vakna]

Technically he is, because he can perceive time at a vastly slower rate than us. So he could go through an incredibly long and complex math equation in what we would consider a nanosecond, but for him he is just working through it in his head at a "normal" rate. But I suppose it also depends on what you consider to be intelligence, he can think at the speed of a computer, in my eyes that makes him a super-intelligence.

[Egomaniac]

A troubled but intelligent youth with a deceased parental figure is inspired to be a crime fighter with an animal based name? Said hero is a strong, agile and capable fighter. Some gadgetry is involved. Yep, Spider-Man is nothing like Batman

Really stretching here.

Can Batman climb walls? Does Batman have a Danger Sense? Can Batman lift a Truck?

Peter Parker is a poor kid from Queens. A picked on Nerd that got his powers accidentally and used them selfishly until his own arrogance and irresponsible behaviour created a situation that led to the death of his uncle. He's a chatterbox that rattles on constantly during fights because it is an excellent distraction. His use of gadgets is mostly limited to his webs and spider-tracers. In his civilian life he makes his living selling photographs of himself (as Spider-Man)...and even then he still struggles just to make ends meet.

Bruce Wayne is a rich kid from Gotham. His parents were killed during a mugging and he dedicated his life from that point on to ridding the world of crime (which is a goal that can only be imagined by a child). He's usually very laconic in his fights...preferring silent intimidation. He utilizes an entire arsenal of gadgets and vehicles. In civilian life he is a billionaire industrialist that has never had to worry about where his next meal is coming from.

Spider-Man is also a terrible fighter. He gets by because of Spider-Sense and his agility...but, until recently, he never actually learned how to fight. And even that is mostly ignored by the writers.

Dead parents are a trope of Heroes. Have been since before Batman. Superman has dead Parents too. I guess Batman is just a ripoff of Superman?

You can always spot the Marvel Zombie. Just admit that Marvel shamelessly rips off DC. The ripoffs aren’t clones and there are differences between the two. Those differences are worthwhile and too be appreciated.

You just argued against yourself here. A shameless ripoff would be a clone with very little differences. All of the things you claim are "rip-offs" are based on mostly superficial aspects of the characters themselves. I've also stated, multiple times now, that DC and Marvel both rip each other off. You're the one pretending that it only works one way...so which of us is really the Zombie here, eh?

PS The Fantastic Four is a ripoff of the Challengers of the Unknown. Mr Terrific dates back to the 40s and is a ripoff of Batman and other pulp crime fighters from the 30s.

The original Mr. Terrific dates back to the 40's. The Current Mr. Terrific (Michael Holt) is a different character that is a clear "ripoff" of Mr. Fantastic. Even his team is "The Terrifics"...it doesn't really get much more blatant than that. Also, since Challengers of the Unknown and The Fantastic Four are both Jack Kirby creations...it's really just another example of Kirby ripping himself off. He did that a lot during his career.

[Ivanstone]

Really stretching here.

Can Batman climb walls? Does Batman have a Danger Sense? Can Batman lift a Truck?

Peter Parker is a poor kid from Queens. A picked on Nerd that got his powers accidentally and used them selfishly until his own arrogance and irresponsible behaviour created a situation that led to the death of his uncle. He's a chatterbox that rattles on constantly during fights because it is an excellent distraction. His use of gadgets is mostly limited to his webs and spider-tracers. In his civilian life he makes his living selling photographs of himself (as Spider-Man)...and even then he still struggles just to make ends meet.

Bruce Wayne is a rich kid from Gotham. His parents were killed during a mugging and he dedicated his life from that point on to ridding the world of crime (which is a goal that can only be imagined by a child). He's usually very laconic in his fights...preferring silent intimidation. He utilizes an entire arsenal of gadgets and vehicles. In civilian life he is a billionaire industrialist that has never had to worry about where his next meal is coming from.

Spider-Man is also a terrible fighter. He gets by because of Spider-Sense and his agility...but, until recently, he never actually learned how to fight. And even that is mostly ignored by the writers.

Dead parents are a trope of Heroes. Have been since before Batman. Superman has dead Parents too. I guess Batman is just a ripoff of Superman?



You just argued against yourself here. A shameless ripoff would be a clone with very little differences. All of the things you claim are "rip-offs" are based on mostly superficial aspects of the characters themselves. I've also stated, multiple times now, that DC and Marvel both rip each other off. You're the one pretending that it only works one way...so which of us is really the Zombie here, eh?



The original Mr. Terrific dates back to the 40's. The Current Mr. Terrific (Michael Holt) is a different character that is a clear "ripoff" of Mr. Fantastic. Even his team is "The Terrifics"...it doesn't really get much more blatant than that. Also, since Challengers of the Unknown and The Fantastic Four are both Jack Kirby creations...it's really just another example of Kirby ripping himself off. He did that a lot during his career.

No, I'm really not.

Batman can climb walls. Batman is highly intuitive and very aware of his surroundings. Yes, Batman can lift a truck. How he does these things are different from how Spider-man does these things.

Spider-man is an incredible hand-to-hand combatant with a variety of gadgets at his disposable. Even his car climbs walls! How he does these things are different from how Batman does these things.

Both Marvel and DC do rip each other off a lot. Marvel's ripoffs are just more blatant because they're the younger company (sort of) and they're ripoffs are more successful sometimes even passing the originals. Deadpool is the most glaring example but the character has since taken a life of its own. As a reformed Zombie, I made peace with it decades ago. Its a natural byproduct of both companies using the same creative teams and the need to create fresh content for a monthly schedule. I'm really failing to grasp why you're so butthurt about it.

PS Michael Holt is a genius, athlete and martial artist who was despondent and suicidal until an intervention showed him a different path. Much like Terry Sloane, the original Mr Terrific. The Terrifics are just an updated version of the Justice Society. Dude, srsly, you can look this shit up on the interwebs.

PPS You should read Marshall Law. A vicious satire of superheroes that mocks both DC and Marvel with equal vigour helps snap things into focus.

[ProphetFlume]

A troubled but intelligent youth with a deceased parental figure is inspired to be a crime fighter with an animal based name? Said hero is a strong, agile and capable fighter. Some gadgetry is involved. Yep, Spider-Man is nothing like Batman

Wow.

This is the point in the conversation when everyone should stop bothering with this person. It’s like when people jokingly explain how Disney villains are the real heroes, except he’s serious.

[Ivanstone]

Wow.

This is the point in the conversation when everyone should stop bothering with this person. It’s like when people jokingly explain how Disney villains are the real heroes, except he’s serious.

So which are you? A butthurt Spidey fan or butthurt Batman fan?

Think about how the characters are alike. The differences are what you do so you don't end up like Fawcett Comics.

[Beloren]

Yes, you are wrong here. He's a weaker grade of Superman. Still the most powerful being on Earth...but lesser than other incarnations.

BvS shows that exposure to Kryptonite leaves Superman so weak that he gets easily manhandled by Batman (to the point where, If Superman's mother had any other name than "Martha"...Bruce would have killed him right then). Superman Returns has Clark fly an entire Island of Kryptonite into space. These two things just are not compatible.

Man Of Steel also establishes that Clark was sick as a baby...because he had to adapt to Earth's Atmosphere. This is something unique to this incarnation of Superman. This is mostly used as Zod's justification for Terraforming Earth instead of sharing it with humanity. It's also pretty much completely ignored after Zod himself is exposed to Earth's Atmosphere. It takes him a couple minutes to adjust...but as soon as he seems to be just as impervious as Clark is and, despite that Jor-El told Clark earlier that the only way to increase his powers was to constantly press the limits of what he can do, Zod seems to be just as Powerful as Clark is.

Reeve/Routh Superman also has Ice Breath. Cavill Superman has never displayed this ability.

Thanks for the clarification, I always did recognise your argument does have merits to it.

I like how they did the Man of Steel baby thing and adapting ot the atmosphere, it seems to have a little bit more realistic science or explanation.

But Zod didn't take two minutes to adapt, remember by the time of the fight scene, Zod has been on earth a while, but I chalked his acclimatisation to being a genetically born and bred warrior, so optimised for stuff like that, and that his decades of training, far greater than Clarke's better prepared him to adapt and learn - like any apex warrior would. In fact, I was surprised he didn't give Clarke more of a run - which to me just told me how amazing Clark is as himself, overcoming the odds, the weakned state, recovering faster, and able to best Zod like he did. I suspect Clark to be both genetically superior to Zod and better acclimatised to the earth and so better maximised by the yellow sun, but also quite intelligent and able to think on his feat too.

He beats Zod cos he's awesome.

[Egomaniac]

No, I'm really not.

Batman can climb walls. Batman is highly intuitive and very aware of his surroundings. Yes, Batman can lift a truck. How he does these things are different from how Spider-man does these things.

Yeah, let me know when Batman can do this:



or this:



Batman can push a truck off of himself. Actually lifting it up over his head is well beyond his strength level.

Spider-man is an incredible hand-to-hand combatant with a variety of gadgets at his disposable. Even his car climbs walls! How he does these things are different from how Batman does these things.

He never uses the car. He hates the car.

Up until Shang Chi invented a style of Kung Fu specifically for Spider-Man...his fighting style was entirely instinctual. He was not a trained fighter.

Batman, on the other hand, has studied every single form of martial arts known to man. Claiming that Spider-Man is a ripoff of Batman based on fighting ability is ridiculous.

Batman can climb walls the way any normal human can climb walls...with equipment and hand holds. Spider-Man forms a molecular bond with the wall that can not be severed. You will tear the wall off of the building long before you ever tear Spider-Man off the wall.

Here's Iron Man questioning the things that Spider-Man can stick to:

Both Marvel and DC do rip each other off a lot. Marvel's ripoffs are just more blatant because they're the younger company (sort of) and they're ripoffs are more successful sometimes even passing the originals. Deadpool is the most glaring example but the character has since taken a life of its own. As a reformed Zombie, I made peace with it decades ago. Its a natural byproduct of both companies using the same creative teams and the need to create fresh content for a monthly schedule. I'm really failing to grasp why you're so butthurt about it.

I'm not butthurt at all. I've been saying the entire time Marvel and Dc rip each other off. All you're saying is that Marvel is better at it than DC is.

As for Deadpool, i have always maintained the Rob Liefeld ripped off Deathstroke and Spider-Man with equal measure. The character that evolved after Rob Liefeld left is a much more unique individual that just happens to look like Deathstroke and Spider-Man had a baby.

DC Ripoffs are just as blatant as Marvel's and, as both of us have mentioned, they are often a result of one creative team moving from one company to another.

PS Michael Holt is a genius, athlete and martial artist who was despondent and suicidal until an intervention showed him a different path. Much like Terry Sloane, the original Mr Terrific. The Terrifics are just an updated version of the Justice Society. Dude, srsly, you can look this shit up on the interwebs.

I am familiar with Michael Holt's resume. On the grounds by which you are accusing Iron Man and Spider-Man of being ripoffs of Batman....Michael Holt is every bit as much a rip off of Reed Richards.

PPS You should read Marshall Law. A vicious satire of superheroes that mocks both DC and Marvel with equal vigour helps snap things into focus.

I'm well aware of the mocking both Marvel DC receive and deserve. Marshall Law is but one example. One can also cite The Boys. Or for somewhat lighter fare, One can even go with The Tick.

[Beloren]

Technically he is, because he can perceive time at a vastly slower rate than us. So he could go through an incredibly long and complex math equation in what we would consider a nanosecond, but for him he is just working through it in his head at a "normal" rate. But I suppose it also depends on what you consider to be intelligence, he can think at the speed of a computer, in my eyes that makes him a super-intelligence.

Mine two. There are many aspects to intelligence, but if you can think much faster, you will reach solutions quicker.

However creative genius is not based on your ability to store information perfectly and recall it , nor is it based on how fast you can process the information.

Wisdom, another aspect of intelligence, also does not depend on these things, that's the ability to properly or cleverly use the information you know to achieve your goals or even more astoundingly, create something.

Wisdom and Creative genius are the most valuable facets of intelligence, and it's funny, any of us can have those regardless of how fast we can process info or recall it independent of our intelligence quotient - at least by todays measuring standard of that quotient.

However being able to deduce quickly, process quickly and recall perfectly can increase or at least to both wisdom and creative genius.

[Egomaniac]

I like how they did the Man of Steel baby thing and adapting ot the atmosphere, it seems to have a little bit more realistic science or explanation.

i mean, not really. It's just a different variety of Made up science. And again, one they abandon as soon as it is no longer convenient. Realistically, Zod should have had to spend much more time on Earth to be an equal to Clark. As I said, Zod's justification for terraforming Earth and destroying humanity is that he doesn't want his people to be sick for years while they adapt. But Zod is never sick... he gets slightly overwhelmed by all the powers at first...but he adapts very quickly.

But Zod didn't take two minutes to adapt, remember by the time of the fight scene, Zod has been on earth a while, but I chalked his acclimatisation to being a genetically born and bred warrior, so optimised for stuff like that, and that his decades of training, far greater than Clarke's better prepared him to adapt and learn - like any apex warrior would. In fact, I was surprised he didn't give Clarke more of a run - which to me just told me how amazing Clark is as himself, overcoming the odds, the weakned state, recovering faster, and able to best Zod like he did. I suspect Clark to be both genetically superior to Zod and better acclimatised to the earth and so better maximised by the yellow sun, but also quite intelligent and able to think on his feat too.

Zod had been on Earth...but most of the time he was wearing his breather. There were only a few moments where he was completely exposed.

Jor-El explicitly states that the only way for Clark to get stronger was to push his liits. Zod never had to push the limits. When he started fighting Clark he was pretty much his equal.

He beats Zod cos he's awesome.

By the logic you are using...he never should have been able to beat Zod.

[Ivanstone]

Batman can push a truck off of himself. Actually lifting it up over his head is well beyond his strength level.

He never uses the car. He hates the car.

Up until Shang Chi invented a style of Kung Fu specifically for Spider-Man...his fighting style was entirely instinctual. He was not a trained fighter.

Batman, on the other hand, has studied every single form of martial arts known to man. Claiming that Spider-Man is a ripoff of Batman based on fighting ability is ridiculous.

Batman can climb walls the way any normal human can climb walls...with equipment and hand holds. Spider-Man forms a molecular bond with the wall that can not be severed. You will tear the wall off of the building long before you ever tear Spider-Man off the wall.

Which is why he'll spend some money and think of a way to move large, heavy objects. I'm sure he already has something in his belt of Deus Ex Machina.

He still has a car that can climb walls. His or your feelings on the subject are irrelevant. A weird gadget is still a gadget even if its rotting away in some warehouse.

I never claimed Spider-man was a trained fighter. He's a great fighter because of other reasons. Batman is also a great fighter.

Other humans don't have a specialized costume and a Belt of Deus Ex Machina that helps them climb walls. Or have this super-compact swing line device. Or a specialized cloak to arrest their falls. My utility belt has a wallet and my Iphone. I don't have as much forethought as Batman.

Really the only appreciable difference between the two is that one has a Superpower from a spider-bite. The other has a Superpower from having a lot of money and an infinite amount of time to learn a shit ton of skills to make up for not having a spider-bite. He probably had a Groundhog's Day experience. I blame Batmite.

I'm not butthurt at all. I've been saying the entire time Marvel and Dc rip each other off. All you're saying is that Marvel is better at it than DC is.

As for Deadpool, i have always maintained the Rob Liefeld ripped off Deathstroke and Spider-Man with equal measure. The character that evolved after Rob Liefeld left is a much more unique individual that just happens to look like Deathstroke and Spider-Man had a baby.

DC Ripoffs are just as blatant as Marvel's and, as both of us have mentioned, they are often a result of one creative team moving from one company to another.

They're less blatant because they're less successful. DC's biggest success in that area is Aquaman. He's a much better known character than Namor but also a much more frequently derided character. Again its pretty easy to just acknowledge what it is.

I am familiar with Michael Holt's resume. On the grounds by which you are accusing Iron Man and Spider-Man of being ripoffs of Batman....Michael Holt is every bit as much a rip off of Reed Richards.

Reed Richards is a ripoff of Terry Sloane. But not really. Lotsa heroes are geniuses. Including Superman. Batman has significant amount of overlaps with a lot of different characters. That's what happens when you're the most popular superhero of all time.

[ProphetFlume]

i mean, not really. It's just a different variety of Made up science. And again, one they abandon as soon as it is no longer convenient. Realistically, Zod should have had to spend much more time on Earth to be an equal to Clark. As I said, Zod's justification for terraforming Earth and destroying humanity is that he doesn't want his people to be sick for years while they adapt. But Zod is never sick... he gets slightly overwhelmed by all the powers at first...but he adapts very quickly.




Zod had been on Earth...but most of the time he was wearing his breather. There were only a few moments where he was completely exposed.

Jor-El explicitly states that the only way for Clark to get stronger was to push his liits. Zod never had to push the limits. When he started fighting Clark he was pretty much his equal.

Not gonna super defend this, but the logic is that Zod was literally bred to be an adaptable super soldier and that's why he was able to recover so fast. I say literally because people on krypton were genetically modified as early as a fetus for certain tasks. That's why Jor-El in mos saying they had a natural birth was such a big deal.

[Egomaniac]

Which is why he'll spend some money and think of a way to move large, heavy objects. I'm sure he already has something in his belt of Deus Ex Machina.

Sounds like something that would be ripping off Iron Man

He still has a car that can climb walls. His or your feelings on the subject are irrelevant. A weird gadget is still a gadget even if its rotting away in some warehouse.

That's a weak argument. The Spider-Mobile was never intended to be an actual addition to Spider-Man'sarsenal. It was always intended to be a joke.

I never claimed Spider-man was a trained fighter. He's a great fighter because of other reasons. Batman is also a great fighter.

But he's not a great fighter by any stretch of the imagination. He has powers that help him cheat.

Other humans don't have a specialized costume and a Belt of Deus Ex Machina that helps them climb walls. Or have this super-compact swing line device. Or a specialized cloak to arrest their falls. My utility belt has a wallet and my Iphone. I don't have as much forethought as Batman.

I like how your logic is that Spider-Man is a copy of Batman because Batman can find ways to copy what Spider-Man does naturally.

Really the only appreciable difference between the two is that one has a Superpower from a spider-bite. The other has a Superpower from having a lot of money and an infinite amount of time to learn a shit ton of skills to make up for not having a spider-bite. He probably had a Groundhog's Day experience. I blame Batmite.

By that logic Batman and Superman are as "identical" as Spider-Man and Batman. Your arguments are awful.

They're less blatant because they're less successful. DC's biggest success in that area is Aquaman. He's a much better known character than Namor but also a much more frequently derided character. Again its pretty easy to just acknowledge what it is.

The acknowledgement is that both companies "ripoff" each other.

Reed Richards is a ripoff of Terry Sloane. But not really. Lotsa heroes are geniuses. Including Superman. Batman has significant amount of overlaps with a lot of different characters. That's what happens when you're the most popular superhero of all time.

Wow, you just crippled your own argument. Good job. Lotsa heroes are geniuses. Lotsa heroes use gadgets. Lotsa heroes are "great fighters". Etc.

- - - Updated - - -

Not gonna super defend this, but the logic is that Zod was literally bred to be an adaptable super soldier and that's why he was able to recover so fast. I say literally because people on krypton were genetically modified as early as a fetus for certain tasks. That's why Jor-El in mos saying they had a natural birth was such a big deal.

Yeah, he was...but so was his entire crew. The only people Zod had were from the military caste. So if he's super-adaptable...so are they.