Who should be the next Warmonger?

[Varodoc]

I'd have used the term Fifth War if that's what I was proposing. Really what I mean is even without proper War taking place, the franchise needs characters who actually want War.

Someone on the side to bubble up the tensions and keep things feeling somewhat akin to IRL Human History, where we were notoriously shitty to certain others for thousands of years.

On the note of Turalyon and Danath specifically, I'd prefer if they started small scale and then the masses fighting their battles are the ones who build resentment for the faction they're warring against. Have the named characters hand the soldiers the torch, but let the soldiers set the fires.


Let the Humans be racist, and let the Horde respond in a justified, nasty way, that basically justifies the Alliance's pitch to keep retaliating.
Don't clip either team's wings.


Characters like Jaina and Anduin becoming the standard for what Humans are in Warcraft is killing their intended role within the story.

There's nothing special about these two peace-striving characters if every Human is just a peach now. They used to be the outliers in a very hateful landscape.

There should be no battles and no Warfronts.

At best there should be skirmishes and stealth operations.

For that Turalyon is in a prime position to stir some tensions in Lordaeron, if Calia has a problem with Alliance forces reoccupying some former holdings of Lordaeron. There can also be stealth missions and skirmishes in Quel'Thalas, as the Ren'dorei attempt to undermine Theron's dictatorship.

But No large battles, because that's already Faction War territory and frankly I think everyone is tired of it, Blizzard included.

[Dellis0991]

I'm hoping for a zealot Turalyon & Yrel going down the scarlet path, perhaps with some behind the scenes dreadlording.

If anyone had any common sense they kill that bitch ON SIGHT! I mean you would assume that the Horde shared that whole situation with the Alliance just incase she decided to show up thinking everything was peachy and the Alliance would welcome her.

[Zuben]

There should be no battles and no Warfronts.

At best there should be skirmishes and stealth operations.

For that Turalyon is in a prime position to stir some tensions in Lordaeron, if Calia has a problem with Alliance forces reoccupying some former holdings of Lordaeron. There can also be stealth missions and skirmishes in Quel'Thalas, as the Ren'dorei attempt to undermine Theron's dictatorship.

But No large battles, because that's already Faction War territory and frankly I think everyone is tired of it, Blizzard included.

Void elves would be objectively stupid to do that, since they must know their connection the void is literal venom to Quel'thalas's most sacred fount of power. Best I'd consider for them is securing a sanctum in the Ghostlands, provided they are able to handle it themselves. Blood elves certainly aren't bothering to cleanse the land of the Scourge, so it's technically up for the taking.

Overall I was first considering a major overhaul to northern EK to form an expansion base in itself, but thinking about it they can once more divide the focus like they have in the past. Make that part of the world about the skirmishes, requiring less revamping than what I had in mind, then create another fresh continent to be about something else. Intertwine as needed. I think after all this tiring cosmic stuff we could all use a bunch of down-to-earth stories.

[Archmage Xaxxas]

because that's already Faction War territory and frankly I think everyone is tired of it, Blizzard included.

I suppose I just question whether or not involving our IRL boredom/exhaustion and letting that impact the flow of storytelling is the right way to move forward.

In a way, it forces me to detach any empathy I build towards these fictional characters and plop my 4th Wall Breaking Knowledge of the context/story down instead.

Is it really a responsible move of Blizzard to go,
'Here we got this endless story potential, buuuttt we're just getting tired of our own failures to make this work, and because of us, we think you are too. So why don't we just ditch that part of the story all together?'

Giving up IRL where the fictional characters would not.
It's borderline disrespectful to the ideas of the characters, to the ideas in real life History that their stories are based on.

I guess I just feel that there's some sort of responsibility to pick up the pieces and make it work in the way it would if the characters weren't at the behest of a writer's pen, but living and breathing in their own world.



edit: And I'd say that if Blizzard wanted to be finished with HvA conflict storytelling, they would not/should not have torched Teldrassil.
We can't write unforgiveable scenarios and have the entirety of the cast and setting brush it off in the span of 1 year ingame time.

Teldrassil wasn't a case of 'Sargeras is manipulating these poor Orcs, it's not their fault they're invading!'
It was a deed completed with Free Will intact, from all who participated.

[VladlTutushkin]

I suppose I just question whether or not involving our IRL boredom/exhaustion and letting that impact the flow of storytelling is the right way to move forward.

In a way, it forces me to detach any empathy I build towards these fictional characters and plop my 4th Wall Breaking Knowledge of the context/story down instead.

Is it really a responsible move of Blizzard to go,
'Here we got this endless story potential, buuuttt we're just getting tired of our own failures to make this work, and because of us, we think you are too. So why don't we just ditch that part of the story all together?'

Giving up IRL where the fictional characters would not.
It's borderline disrespectful to the ideas of the characters, to the ideas in real life History that their stories are based on.

I guess I just feel that there's some sort of responsibility to pick up the pieces and make it work in the way it would if the characters weren't at the behest of a writer's pen, but living and breathing in their own world.



edit: And I'd say that if Blizzard wanted to be finished with HvA conflict storytelling, they would not/should not have torched Teldrassil.
We can't write unforgiveable scenarios and have the entirety of the cast and setting brush it off in the span of 1 year ingame time.

Teldrassil wasn't a case of 'Sargeras is manipulating these poor Orcs, it's not their fault they're invading!'
It was a deed completed with Free Will intact, from all who participated.

Well shit, they pretty much cucked night elves as a race to sweep Teldrassil under the rug. I dont really care if they want to make Turalyon evil or whatever, they forced Alliance to step on our own throat to "move past" the genocide.

So yeah, its too late to try and hype anybody up for faction war, all "participants" are done with it. And i mean players, but NPCs were written this way too, at least in Alliance. So yeah, if they wanted to keep the faction war going they made a shitty job showing it, since Alliance looked about 100% peace oriented outside of Tyrande and now she also in that camp.

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Then he will be:
1) Deemed crazy
2) Villain batted, either
2a) leaving the Alliance to lead a cult against the Horde
2b) planning 2a until we go beat "sense" back into him
3) Lobotomized into mumbling "not all orcs" and drooling on himself
4) All of the above

"Victims should not seek justice." has been THE message to the Alliance for nearly thirty real world years.

And not just message to the Alliance. Alliance was heavily punished and crushed to force it down our throats. Nobody wants to fight anymore because we all know how it will end.

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The next warmonger will obviously be from Red Team, because Blue one is of course a collection of unassailable saints that can do no wrong. So let us make a quick recapitulation:

• Orcs have been pretty much demolished from MoP onwards, to the point that not a single named Orc remains aside from Thrall, and maybe Eitrigg. I will go on a limb and assume that these two are safe from the villain bat.
• the Forsaken are led by the frontwoman of Anduin's BFF, so they're safe for the time being.
• Goblins are just a joke. Raiding one of Gallywix's brothels sounds funny af, and given how terrible the current writers are at humour (among many other things), I don't see this happening anytime soon.
• Tauren are led by the biggest Alliance sycophant Azeroth has ever known Heart of the Horde™, so they're safe.
• Belfs. Here there might be something. They haven't done a lot since BC, which might imply a lot of Story Focus™, which we know how it usually ends. There are several important names among them, so you have several possible raid bosses. More importantly, Bob has been sitting on his ass for far too long, and the Horde can't have that aside from Alliance (especially Human) genitalia-craving Thrall. However, we've had 2 expansions in a row with an elven baddie (3 if you count Elisande in Legion), so... Still, the villain bat is certainly lurking nearby.
• Trolls, i.e. Rokhan/Talanji, especially the latter. Imagine having a legit reason to be upset at the Alliance and not being depicted as a raging moron, we can't have that in Warcraft, can we? Furthermore, troll dungeons/raids are a staple of WoW, so maybe we'll be soon raiding the Echo Isles or something. Maybe ZG 3.0 too?

Trolls can go eat shit, honestly. After what night elves got to swallow they should be happy their aztec pyramid is still standing and not converted into a taco place by Alliance or someone else. They can live with some humble pie for dinner.

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@sighy Imagine any Alliance character doing anything less than pure and heroic (or even misguided), and having to go through the consequences of his/her actions. Morally grey world and what not

Imagine thinking horde had faced any consequences of their actions outside of ousting singular scapegoat.

[Varodoc]

Void elves would be objectively stupid to do that, since they must know their connection the void is literal venom to Quel'thalas's most sacred fount of power. Best I'd consider for them is securing a sanctum in the Ghostlands, provided they are able to handle it themselves. Blood elves certainly aren't bothering to cleanse the land of the Scourge, so it's technically up for the taking.

Overall I was first considering a major overhaul to northern EK to form an expansion base in itself, but thinking about it they can once more divide the focus like they have in the past. Make that part of the world about the skirmishes, requiring less revamping than what I had in mind, then create another fresh continent to be about something else. Intertwine as needed. I think after all this tiring cosmic stuff we could all use a bunch of down-to-earth stories.

The Sunwell is literally just one location in the northernmost region of the kingdom. They can't even corrupt the Sunwell from Silvermoon, as there's an entire sea separating the northern tip of the EK from Quel'Danas. Alleria was standing and talking inside the Sunfury Spire just fine.

The Ren'dorei excel at subterfuge thanks to their Void powers, which allow them to instantly tear open rifts of the Void to teleport to any location they want. Instant teleportation with no limitation is the strongest ability a spy/assassin could ever have.

Magister Umbric of the Ren'dorei was also capable of concocting a Blood Troll disguise that the player used to transform into a Blood troll and deceive the Horde; so they can potentially create disguises of any race. I'll let you figure out the full potential of this ability. Imagine if a Ren'dorei abducted Rommath then disguised themselves as him. The possibilities are endless.

I suppose I just question whether or not involving our IRL boredom/exhaustion and letting that impact the flow of storytelling is the right way to move forward.

In a way, it forces me to detach any empathy I build towards these fictional characters and plop my 4th Wall Breaking Knowledge of the context/story down instead.

Is it really a responsible move of Blizzard to go,
'Here we got this endless story potential, buuuttt we're just getting tired of our own failures to make this work, and because of us, we think you are too. So why don't we just ditch that part of the story all together?'

Giving up IRL where the fictional characters would not.
It's borderline disrespectful to the ideas of the characters, to the ideas in real life History that their stories are based on.

I guess I just feel that there's some sort of responsibility to pick up the pieces and make it work in the way it would if the characters weren't at the behest of a writer's pen, but living and breathing in their own world.



edit: And I'd say that if Blizzard wanted to be finished with HvA conflict storytelling, they would not/should not have torched Teldrassil.
We can't write unforgiveable scenarios and have the entirety of the cast and setting brush it off in the span of 1 year ingame time.

Teldrassil wasn't a case of 'Sargeras is manipulating these poor Orcs, it's not their fault they're invading!'
It was a deed completed with Free Will intact, from all who participated.

Yep, they shouldn't have had the Horde torch Teldrassil. The Horde literally did what Archimonde failed to do. There should be no turning back from that.

But since the Horde is, sadly, a playable faction, they kind of need to forget Teldrassil ever happened.

Hence why maybe they should just stop with these faction stories because there can never be serious consequences for either faction. You can't have the Alliance win the war and dismantle the Horde because then what will happen to all the Horde players? Do they just faction change to Alliance?

[Darth-Piekus]

The way I see it is that the Alliance as a faction has plenty of reasons to go to a 5th war.

1)The Horde has supported two genocidal Warchiefs who spearheaded a campaign against Alliance and Neutrals alike
2)All this lead to events of an Iron Horde invasion and messing up another timeline.
3)Almost caused another Cataclysm through Garrosh's use of dark shamanism.
4)Indirectly helped the Legion find a foothold to Azeroth.
5)Helped the Jailer through Sylvannas in his plan to unmake reality.
6)Finally they completely changed the lives of many changing them psychologically.

Can we say that Anduin might be changed permanently after all this ordeal like Arthas? What about Tyralyon? What's stopping him from doing what Yrel did and start a crusade against the Horde with the same ultimatum Join the Light or die. Even without that reason the Alliance leaders considering the reasons above may finally decide to really decide to dismantle the Horde as a faction.

Personally it would be interesting to see the Horde running for their lives feeling true fear from the consequences of 40 years.

[VladlTutushkin]

The way I see it is that the Alliance as a faction has plenty of reasons to go to a 5th war.

1)The Horde has supported two genocidal Warchiefs who spearheaded a campaign against Alliance and Neutrals alike
2)All this lead to events of an Iron Horde invasion and messing up another timeline.
3)Almost caused another Cataclysm through Garrosh's use of dark shamanism.
4)Indirectly helped the Legion find a foothold to Azeroth.
5)Helped the Jailer through Sylvannas in his plan to unmake reality.
6)Finally they completely changed the lives of many changing them psychologically.

Can we say that Anduin might be changed permanently after all this ordeal like Arthas? What about Tyralyon? What's stopping him from doing what Yrel did and start a crusade against the Horde with the same ultimatum Join the Light or die. Even without that reason the Alliance leaders considering the reasons above may finally decide to really decide to dismantle the Horde as a faction.

Personally it would be interesting to see the Horde running for their lives feeling true fear from the consequences of 40 years.

Blizz dont have the balls to write the horde being kicked instead of kicking. And horde playerbase dosent have the balls to take the punch.

[Zuben]

The Sunwell is literally just one location in the northernmost region of the kingdom. They can't even corrupt the Sunwell from Silvermoon, as there's an entire sea separating the northern tip of the EK from Quel'Danas. Alleria was standing and talking inside the Sunfury Spire just fine.

The Ren'dorei excel at subterfuge thanks to their Void powers, which allow them to instantly tear open rifts of the Void to teleport to any location they want. Instant teleportation with no limitation is the strongest ability a spy/assassin could ever have.

Magister Umbric of the Ren'dorei was also capable of concocting a Blood Troll disguise that the player used to transform into a Blood troll and deceive the Horde; so they can potentially create disguises of any race. I'll let you figure out the full potential of this ability. Imagine if a Ren'dorei abducted Rommath then disguised themselves as him. The possibilities are endless.

You're thinking of it practically, which in itself isn't bad. But consider this: Every adult blood elf remembers what it was like to be cut off from the Sunwell and the hardships that came after. The ren'dorei as they are represent an existential threat to the life-line current Sunwell is, so Lor'themar's ban on Void magic isn't dictatorship, it's the popular policy of the sin'dorei. Void elves will never be accepted into their society because of that.

So if they wish to return they do so either small scale in Ghostlands or aim to grumble the very sin'dorei society to impose their own rule in its place. In that case they wouldn't just dispose Lor'themar, but all blood elves. It's unthinkable if they still consider them their people, which Alleria and Umbric do.

Should they choose Ghostlands, over time Quel'thalas could consist of a dual-society, which isn't healthy, but at least the Thalassian elves would be united. Note that in this context I'm ignoring the Horde and Alliance connections, which would impose their own problems.

Yep, they shouldn't have had the Horde torch Teldrassil. The Horde literally did what Archimonde failed to do. There should be no turning back from that.

But since the Horde is, sadly, a playable faction, they kind of need to forget Teldrassil ever happened.

Hence why maybe they should just stop with these faction stories because there can never be serious consequences for either faction. You can't have the Alliance win the war and dismantle the Horde because then what will happen to all the Horde players? Do they just faction change to Alliance?

An ultimate conclusion to a war is impossible under current setting, as you say, but repercussions can still happen. The old world holdings could see some shuffling through out the war (I actually expected this to happen in BFA after the trailer painted EK and Kalimdor blue and red respectively). Horde driven out of old holdings, which are then repurposed for Alliance use, and vise-versa. Lordaeron in-lore is so fractured right now that it would only be logical.

Orgrimmar's canyons would be perfect for dwarven architecture.

[mickybrighteyes]

Blizz dont have the balls to write the horde being kicked instead of kicking. And horde playerbase dosent have the balls to take the punch.

Having two alliance victories where their leader parades around Orgrimmar kind of implies the reverse is true.

Also the fact that these forums will never stop talking about things like theramore and teldrassil and how the orcs invaded as proof of the horde's evil.

[Kyphael]

Gey'arah would make sense.

[Varitok]

They're forcing this "MORALLLY GREEEY" shit on everything, so yeah, ruin a long time Alliance hero who did absolutely nothing upon their return until this point. I think the Horde have been done dirty too, The writing for them is lackluster at best.

[VladlTutushkin]

Having two alliance victories where their leader parades around Orgrimmar kind of implies the reverse is true.

Also the fact that these forums will never stop talking about things like theramore and teldrassil and how the orcs invaded as proof of the horde's evil.

If walking into horde city to praise a horde general and then politely leaving it is “parading” now then you sure have shitty parade experience.

And Varian’s threats rang more hollow still with that.

So, where are the “parades”? If Alliance truly shown its power then it might have worked. But it didnt.

[Soon-TM]

Well shit, they pretty much cucked night elves as a race to sweep Teldrassil under the rug. I dont really care if they want to make Turalyon evil or whatever, they forced Alliance to step on our own throat to "move past" the genocide.

So yeah, its too late to try and hype anybody up for faction war, all "participants" are done with it. And i mean players, but NPCs were written this way too, at least in Alliance. So yeah, if they wanted to keep the faction war going they made a shitty job showing it, since Alliance looked about 100% peace oriented outside of Tyrande and now she also in that camp.

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And not just message to the Alliance. Alliance was heavily punished and crushed to force it down our throats. Nobody wants to fight anymore because we all know how it will end.

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Trolls can go eat shit, honestly. After what night elves got to swallow they should be happy their aztec pyramid is still standing and not converted into a taco place by Alliance or someone else. They can live with some humble pie for dinner.

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Imagine thinking horde had faced any consequences of their actions outside of ousting singular scapegoat.

Still it's more than what any Alliance character has had to go through. And there will be no more burned cities, not racial capitals, anyway, so your dream of seeing Dazar'alor in ruins... will remain a dream.

And frankly speaking, I'm getting tired of all the nelf qq. They've always been the biggest losers Warcraft has ever seen, and it seems that nothing has changed in that regard. No, you won't get to steamroll the Horde, much less when you belong to a faction of pure, angelic beings - which you certainly do like

[VladlTutushkin]

Still it's more than what any Alliance character has had to go through. And there will be no more burned cities, not racial capitals, anyway, so your dream of seeing Dazar'alor in ruins... will remain a dream.

And frankly speaking, I'm getting tired of all the nelf qq. They've always been the biggest losers Warcraft has ever seen, and it seems that nothing has changed in that regard. No, you won't get to steamroll the Horde, much less when you belong to a faction of pure, angelic beings - which you certainly do like

Wrong here. I dont like Alliance. Its a fucken abomination of a faction. Night elves were not “sold” to players as “loser hippie race that always gets trashed for shitty reasons and then forgotten”.

Also… you know, maybe true pain is allowing you to rot in your imperfection. Imagine not being a paragon of all good personal qualities. Imagine being you.

But all sarcasm aside, you make no sense. NOBODY enjoys current Alliance. Literal zero percent does it. On all forums there were THREE people who liked it. One unsubbed long ago. The fact that “bad horde” and “good horde” have an even split at least shows how people enjoy both of those.

[thegoodbroham]

I appreciate your thoughts here, and I can certainly agree with the reflections you have on how things definitely went with previous stories, especially Brennedam.

Though I must point out that your projection of the next Warmonger story assumes/asserts as much as I have, which I indeed have, in my post.

This isn't a given. Is it likely? Ya maybe, but just as it's not a given the Faction War -should- continue, as I feel it ought to, it's not a given that if a competent storyteller wanted to turn the current setting into a 'naturally occuring, consistent, sensible, etc etc etc.' story, that they wouldn't be able to.

I get that faith isn't all around high in this regard, but sometimes miracles happen. :'( Maybe Danuser is granted a lunch with Metzen and they just hit all the right marks again like the good old days, put out something that resonates. Maybe some new blood at Blizz has all the ideas and hasn't been given a voice just yet.

You're right, it's not impossible for a warmonger story to still turn out good by a miracle. It's just difficult to imagine, but I also think its a natural progression for people to bond over the many world-ending conflicts they've quelled. If there was a warmonger driving the plot, I only hope their motives wouldn't feel like it invalidated recent history, kind of like a sitcom where a dysfunctional husband and wife suffer the same misunderstanding but make up by the end of the episode, only to forget the next episode? If they can avoid that feeling, then it'd be serviceable enough for a game like WoW to reinforce its factions.

I mained a Paladin throughout most of WoW and I remember the whiplash following Legion, when our class hall had NPC's speaking with excitement about "all the words paladin's united under one roof! Nothing can stop us now!" Just to then battle one another in BFA. It felt immersion breaking, I was kind of digging the order halls and hoped more "new" factions would continue to spring up that didn't feel limited by the faction barrier. Covenants sort of have that advantage too, though they're not in any way tied to Azeroth so it makes sense. The Order halls felt like the "best of" album of character archetypes from all classes, regardless of faction, banded together to double down on their expertise and tell different stories than repeating old hatreds.

[Archmage Xaxxas]

I mained a Paladin throughout most of WoW and I remember the whiplash following Legion, when our class hall had NPC's speaking with excitement about "all the words paladin's united under one roof! Nothing can stop us now!" Just to then battle one another in BFA. It felt immersion breaking, I was kind of digging the order halls and hoped more "new" factions would continue to spring up that didn't feel limited by the faction barrier. Covenants sort of have that advantage too, though they're not in any way tied to Azeroth so it makes sense. The Order halls felt like the "best of" album of character archetypes from all classes, regardless of faction, banded together to double down on their expertise and tell different stories than repeating old hatreds.

Well said. Perhaps they ought to have had a few specific characters in our Order Halls that were noticeably apprehensive about working with the enemy faction.

Legion might have played the 'finale' card a little too early in that regard, with MoP as the set-up for that, and so following it with BFA I can also agree that it wasn't handled too well.

Funnily enough, I'd go ahead and say Shadowlands having us all working together again after BFA is what makes that pattern you pointed out seem so immersion breaking this time. If they had at least kept the tension high, instead of 'breaking the cycle' in BFA, then going into Shadowlands could have felt less jarring. Kind of seems like the scales need to be tipped heavily either way for a certain amount of time each, for them to feel earned or realistic.

I think moving forward, as others have said, for sure they need to have the outlets for players who really don't want to feel like they have to partake in the faction war.

Let's say Jaina, Baine, Thrall and Anduin create an official new sort of 'Defenders of Azeroth' kind of faction. Not a playable faction, just a new quest/rep/honor faction, that will essentially serve as the source of the main campaign going forward. Think of this as what's already happening in Shadowlands and parts of BFA.

Thing is, it's easier to pretend my characters are still Horde/Alliance biased while I begrudgingly work alongside a few main heroes who are blatantly passive, rather than having to pretend my character is still a middle-ground-seeking good guy as I murder my way across an enemy territory like some drone.

I'd agree that the questing probably can't be forcing players into HvA conflict. That said, I certainly want the option as a longtime originally Horde Troll player, to go stir some nonsense against the Alliance for encroaching on Troll land.
The same way on my Human mage, I want to go burn some dirty Trolls as a reverence to the ancient human magi during the Troll Wars.

That kind of optional HvA conflict disappearing is what I fear. At least it'll be in Classic-WrathClassic forever to go back to.

[sighy]

I mained a Paladin throughout most of WoW and I remember the whiplash following Legion, when our class hall had NPC's speaking with excitement about "all the words paladin's united under one roof! Nothing can stop us now!" Just to then battle one another in BFA. It felt immersion breaking, I was kind of digging the order halls and hoped more "new" factions would continue to spring up that didn't feel limited by the faction barrier. Covenants sort of have that advantage too, though they're not in any way tied to Azeroth so it makes sense. The Order halls felt like the "best of" album of character archetypes from all classes, regardless of faction, banded together to double down on their expertise and tell different stories than repeating old hatreds.

That's kind of the reason Order Halls didn't work for me, where It stifled and squandered the last vestiges of unique class subgroups like the Blood Knights. Generally speaking it was an odd mishmash of groups, who are supposed to have vastly different viewpoints, MOs and even hate each other. At times only really being the same class, because they have vaguely similar abilities. I found it especially bad, in the Paladin, Priest, Mage, Hunter and Rogue ones. Warrior one was just wierd and didn't really fit into anything outside the superficial "Valhalla is warrior heaven, right?!"

[Soon-TM]

Wrong here. I dont like Alliance. Its a fucken abomination of a faction. Night elves were not “sold” to players as “loser hippie race that always gets trashed for shitty reasons and then forgotten”.

Nelfs were almost trashed during the First War, they got their asses handed to them by the Qiraji during the War of the Shifting Sands, exiled like half of their kind for their stupid anti-arcane bias, and went to live like literal hippies during 10k years in order to be better prepared for the next Legion invasion - and guess what, the Legion would have completely wiped the floor with them if it hadn't been for the fortunate (and most opportune) but unforeseen presence of Jaina's and Thrall's forces.

And nelfs were never sold as the ultimate Mary Tzu nation capable of defeating everyone by themselves. They look cool, and that's it, but don't pretend they should be something akin to the last boss of an arcade game.

Also… you know, maybe true pain is allowing you to rot in your imperfection. Imagine not being a paragon of all good personal qualities. Imagine being you.

What does this even mean...?

But all sarcasm aside, you make no sense. NOBODY enjoys current Alliance. Literal zero percent does it. On all forums there were THREE people who liked it. One unsubbed long ago. The fact that “bad horde” and “good horde” have an even split at least shows how people enjoy both of those.

Look at all the Ally fans ITT wringing their hands and tearing their hair out at the mere thought of Turalyon being something more than Super Duper Good Boi #56327804

[sighy]

You're thinking of it practically, which in itself isn't bad. But consider this: Every adult blood elf remembers what it was like to be cut off from the Sunwell and the hardships that came after. The ren'dorei as they are represent an existential threat to the life-line current Sunwell is, so Lor'themar's ban on Void magic isn't dictatorship, it's the popular policy of the sin'dorei. Void elves will never be accepted into their society because of that.

Actually the reason for the ban is Dar'khan more so than them being a threat to the Sunwell(which they still are). Even Umbric upon finding Dar'khan's notes was like "Oooh, now i get it..."