Texas Elementary School Shooting, as many as 22 dead, including Children

[Edge-]

Man, so was the shooter wearing body armor or not? I keep seeing cops saying he was but then reports saying he wasn't. We should at least have this figured out by now.

The copaganda is unreal through.

[Deus Mortis]

https://twitter.com/MikeSington/stat...11322731532289

Man, this is a good point. Why not approach guns like Texas approaches abortions? I mean, they care about kids, right?

Naw, instead just talking more about "it's a mental health problem" despite the shooter not having any mental health diagnosis, and despite Republicans never proposing serious funding and plans to address the actual mental health crisis in this country, which includes a lot of children with PTSD and longterm trauma from seeing their friends and classmates killed around them.

That is the thing that gets me about the Republicans they want to talk all this game about mental health but they then cut funding
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...pend-rcna30557

yet in April he slashed $211 million from the department that oversees mental health programs.

[Zan15]

dont worry PhaelixWW will be by soon to tell us how wrong we are

Apparently pointing out failures of the police make you anti-cop and cop-haters.

[Endus]

Man, so was the shooter wearing body armor or not? I keep seeing cops saying he was but then reports saying he wasn't. We should at least have this figured out by now.

What I read somewhere and can't be arsed to check was that he had a vest on, but it was a vest that's supposed to use replaceable ceramic plates, and he didn't actually have the plates in. So it would've looked like he was wearing body armor, but the vest wouldn't have done much if anything to serve as body armor.

[Zan15]

Man, so was the shooter wearing body armor or not? I keep seeing cops saying he was but then reports saying he wasn't. We should at least have this figured out by now.

The copaganda is unreal through.

Last checked he was wearing body armor but armor without plates. So it depends on what you consider body armor i think that is why there is different reports since some people don't consider regular vest actual body armor.

[Deus Mortis]

Man, so was the shooter wearing body armor or not? I keep seeing cops saying he was but then reports saying he wasn't. We should at least have this figured out by now.

The copaganda is unreal through.

Sounds like he had a bulletproof vest without plates in it. We will see once more information comes out what is actually true.

[Edge-]

That is the thing that gets me about the Republicans they want to talk all this game about mental health but they then cut funding
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...pend-rcna30557

Because. They. Don't. Care. About. The. Problem. And. Do. Not. Want. To. Solve. It.

They're fine with dead kids as long as NRA and donor money keeps pouring in and they keep winning elections with their "pro-guns" stance.

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Sounds like he had a bulletproof vest without plates in it. We will see once more information comes out what is actually true.

So...a vest, then. Because without the plates it would have been largely ineffective, no? I mean, I can get that cops might not have noticed that immediately (the lack of plates), but man...given other recent shootings involving body armor maybe it's time to like, I dunno, start limiting civilian access to it so that maybe mass-shooters are a bit less deadly?

Or can we get federal funding to provide every American with body armor?

[Gelannerai]

Apparently pointing out failures of the police make you anti-cop and cop-haters.

Like, this is one of the strongest arguments for nationwide reform and standardization of police hiring/training practices I’ve ever seen. The ostensible incompetence displayed by the local PD in this situation is staggering.

[Deus Mortis]

Because. They. Don't. Care. About. The. Problem. And. Do. Not. Want. To. Solve. It.

They're fine with dead kids as long as NRA and donor money keeps pouring in and they keep winning elections with their "pro-guns" stance.

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So...a vest, then. Because without the plates it would have been largely ineffective, no? I mean, I can get that cops might not have noticed that immediately (the lack of plates), but man...given other recent shootings involving body armor maybe it's time to like, I dunno, start limiting civilian access to it so that maybe mass-shooters are a bit less deadly?

Or can we get federal funding to provide every American with body armor?

Yup it is sad and disgusting, like you said they don't care, they may act like they do, but they really don't. On the topic of body armor, body armor is the reason a lot of cops starting carrying long guns in their cars. This happened after the North Hollywood shootout. I would say a reasonable start would be a background check for body armor. From my 2 seconds of googling it looks like they don't even do a background check.
https://bulletsafe.com/pages/bullet-proof-vest-laws

There is no background check, waiting period, or federal registration required to buy a bulletproof vest. You can order a vest on BulletSafe.com, and have it delivered to your home or office without asking permission or reporting to anyone. You do not need to register it with authorities and we do not share your information with anyone.

[Edge-]

Yup it is sad and disgusting, like you said they don't care, they may act like they do, but they really don't. On the topic of body armor, body armor is the reason a lot of cops starting carrying long guns in their cars. This happened after the North Hollywood shootout. I would say a reasonable start would be a background check for body armor. From my 2 seconds of googling it looks like they don't even do a background check.
https://bulletsafe.com/pages/bullet-proof-vest-laws

I very much remember that shootout and the cops having to legit go to gunstores to try to get weapons that would actually be effective.

I was pretty young then, so it was a fairly formative experience about the arms war of our police state in this country. And it's why I continue to be uncomfortable when I saw the cops in the quiet little town I used to live in (and am still close to) where there's next to no violent crime (outside the time cops shot a Black guy who was known to have mental health problems while he was having an episode in the street, and they've since settled the wrongful death suit) driving around in shiny new SUV's with AR-15's in the center console, magazine in and ready to go at a moments notice.

That's an implicit threat of violence towards the community, not something necessary given that officers might draw their service weapons once a year at most with the rate of crime.

It's all kinds of fucked up.

But if body armor is increasingly the problem, and there's no Constitutional right to it, either we should all be getting our free federally provided body armor or maybe we should look into stricter limits on civilian access to it.

[PhaelixWW]

I mean, that's technically what happened

No, it's not "technically what happened" at all. The ArmaLite AR-15 didn't "replace" the ArmaLite AR-10. The ArmaLite AR-10 was never adopted as a US battle rifle. While the ArmaLite AR-15 was adopted by the military as the M16, the Colt AR-15 is a different, civilian version of the model; they're not the exact same firearm, despite Colt keeping the name for the civilian version.

The Colt AR-15 and its various subsequent clones were never designed for war. They were designed as a more basic version of the M16 that was suitable for civilian use, rather than military use. They are fundamentally no different from any other semi-automatic rifle, the likes of which have existed and been used by civilians for over a hundred years. They are not the select-fire-capable firearms that were designed for military use.

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Similarly the court affirmed the right to gay and inter-racial marriage, it didn't create that right. Those rights were acknowledged by the 14th Amendment.

And both those rights are currently in jeopardy by the current court who cares nothing for the 14th Amendment.

The Supreme Court could reverse its decision, sure. It has in the past. But in general the trend has been towards enshrining rights rather than abrogating them.

I'd consider SCOTUS wrong to do that with the 14th just as much as with the 2nd; there's no logical inconsistency there for me.

[Poopymonster]

That is the thing that gets me about the Republicans they want to talk all this game about mental health but they then cut funding
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...pend-rcna30557

They should just pray about it.

Because when a voice in your head is saying "Kill them all" the exact thing you need is another saying "It's your fault, you're bad because reasons, and you can only be good if you listen to me."

[Ivanstone]

The Colt AR-15 and its various subsequent clones were never designed for war. They were designed as a more basic version of the M16 that was suitable for civilian use, rather than military use. They are fundamentally no different from any other semi-automatic rifle, the likes of which have existed and been used by civilians for over a hundred years. They are not the select-fire-capable firearms that were designed for military use.

They are fundamentally different from other semi-automatics in that they have utility that mimics a military weapon. The M16 is lightweight and uses ammunition that is also lightweight so a magazine can have a higher capacity. Its still a rifle cartridge so it has good stopping power against people. I don't see hunters carrying AR15 with 100 round drums for hunting deer.

The Supreme Court could reverse its decision, sure. It has in the past. But in general the trend has been towards enshrining rights rather than abrogating them.

I'd consider SCOTUS wrong to do that with the 14th just as much as with the 2nd; there's no logical inconsistency there for me.

Its almost like we have a huge thread already dedicated to the SCOTUS planing to do exactly that.

The key difference between the 2nd and 14th amendments is that only one of those amendments actively hurts other people. An M16 is pretty challenging to get due to regulations. Why is an M16 regulated but an AR15 is not?

[Deus Mortis]

The key difference between the 2nd and 14th amendments is that only one of those amendments actively hurts other people. An M16 is pretty challenging to get due to regulations. Why is an M16 regulated but an AR15 is not?

Most likely because the M16 is fully automatic whereas the AR15 is not.

[Slant]

Also coming out that the police barred parents from rushing the school to try and save their kids.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/harrow...hool-in-uvalde

That shit's acting as an accessory to the crime, frankly. Officers should be fuckin' charged. If you're too much of a goddamned fuckin' weenie-ass chickenshit to do your job, hand your weapons and body armor to the parents who're clearly willing to do so.

Absolutely shocking and shameful.

Uh, I'll disagree with you there. Civilians should be kept out of harm's way.

The foul play wasn't refusing parents from going in, it was not doing their damned jobs so parents wouldn't feel the need to do it themselves. Every single LEO on that scene needs to get fired. They are a waste of tax money.

[Edge-]

Most likely because the M16 is fully automatic whereas the AR15 is not.

While a factual point, it ignores that shooter can and frequently do kill large numbers of people with semi-automatic weapons to the point where you'd be hard pressed to differentiate between semi and full automatic weapons used.

I mean hell, the LV mass shooter had semi-auto weapons legally modified to act as fully automatic weapons, reportedly.

[jonnysensible]

Uh, I'll disagree with you there. Civilians should be kept out of harm's way.

The foul play wasn't refusing parents from going in, it was not doing their damned jobs so parents wouldn't feel the need to do it themselves. Every single LEO on that scene needs to get fired. They are a waste of tax money.

'A mom of two children at Uvalde was put in handcuffs after urging police and law enforcement to enter the school.

Once freed from her cuffs, she jumped the school fence, ran inside and sprinted out with her kids.'

lol ACAB

[PhaelixWW]

dont worry PhaelixWW will be by soon to tell us how wrong we are

Only when you're making shit up that's not supported by reports and passing it off as indisputable truth.

Then... yeah.

I mean, I've been pretty damn clear that I'm trying to keep things factual, whatever those facts are.

Just 'cuz you're getting your knickers in a twist about it doesn't change things for me.

Apparently pointing out failures of the police make you anti-cop and cop-haters.

Apparently failing to read posts properly makes you... you.

All I've called out are people making things up based on nothing more than unsubstantiated assumptions and pretending that they're truth. I'm not interested in defending the police with regards to actual, documented failures.

But... yeah, if you're so predisposed to believe the worst about any situation involving a police officer that you misinterpret vague information in the most unrealistic way and then not only convince yourself that it's true, but attempt to convince others that it's true... then you're anti-cop and a cop-hater.

I would say a reasonable start would be a background check for body armor.

That doesn't really make any sense. A potential mass shooter would have to pass a background check to get a firearm, so passing two background checks wouldn't be an issue. Or if they were a prohibited person but were able to obtain a firearm anyway, there's very little reason to assume that they couldn't likewise do the same with body armor.

Seems a poor tradeoff to make it more difficult for people to buy a piece of gear that's ultimately defensive in nature.

[Slant]

https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreak...g_and_arguing/

Keep seeing videos like this popping up. I hope folks start asking why we keep paying cops who aren't doing their jobs.

Same reason you pay orderleys to monitor the stands during a football match, just to see if there's some fatto having a heart attack and crowd control. After all, nobody wants their entertainment ruined by unsportsmanlike conduct like crying parents running onto the field, er school grounds...

Honestly, I'm surprised nobody put a gun in those officers' faces and told them to move inside the school or aside. I mean, they established that they have no spine and are scared of guns... might as well, eh?

[Nymrohd]

Because. They. Don't. Care. About. The. Problem. And. Do. Not. Want. To. Solve. It.

They're fine with dead kids as long as NRA and donor money keeps pouring in and they keep winning elections with their "pro-guns" stance.

I mean every time kids die this way, Media goes all "They'll take our guns" which leads to more votes for the GOP and more guns sold for the NRA.