Oh Blizzard, how you have fallen (Diablo Immortal).

[crusadernero]

It's a business. Of course they will have a PAY strategy.
If you want welfares, go elsewhere.

Little did I know that the only business practice is obnoxious p2w mechanics that prey on the playerbase. Damn, what do you recon? This has been going on since gaming started eh?

[Elim Garak]

Little did I know that the only business practice is obnoxious p2w mechanics that prey on the playerbase. Damn, what do you recon? This has been going on since gaming started eh?

Not the only one, just the best one. Add salty tears to taste.

[TriHard]

yo this game kinda lit, we should all spend more money on it

[Lolites]

i got to lvl 32 and still waiting to get "bombarded" by all the shop offers some people claim to encounter right from the start...
so far there has been small red dot that i barely noticed teling me theres something new on shop, if thats what you call "bombardment" i can only assume you never played any "free" game, be it mobile or pc...

[crusadernero]

It's actually great! The markets are growing so fast that mobile games are coming to PC as cross-platform. There is no longer a divide. Even consoles and PC are one now, sans a few old time exclusives. Now you can make a game and publish it EVERYWHERE. Game industry reached Music/Film industry level of penetration.

People who complain about mobile games being p2w probably are too young to remember that f2p and p2w originated on PCs, when first mobile games were premium. And then circa 2010 the mobile market exploded with f2p games ported from PC (Web games and Facebook games. Zynga? Farmville? Rings any bells? The game that brought women into gaming! Mostly middle-aged housewives but HEY! Oh those were the times, the trendy word was "virality" - you know the predatory mechanism of using your FB friends to lure you into playing games they are playing - demons!)

Oh please, theres no reason for the simple lecture of how gaming came to be. Im old enough to remember the time were you bought the game and that was that. Were every game came as it was. The minus back then was that many games should have had more than delivered, but thats kind of besides the point.


Oh and no - its not great. Its not like it will become any better in the coming years. Its only going to get worse. Once someone sold a horse in a game for real money and got bullied. Today suckers demand to throw money and pixels instead of getting a good game.

Also, just because its happend before and/or is done by others, doesnt mean its a healthy approach.

The gaming world has for to long done whatever they wanted to do, especially sucking money out of people. Much more than they should have. Sooner or later the old farts in govs around the world will start acting on this. In several parts of the world they already are.

Also, I see no plus in having mobile games & PC games becoming one thing. DI is a shit game on PC, but good on mobile. Its only on PC to reach out to more dollar. Imagine if D4 was supported for mobile to, the game would have to be gutted. Like DI.

[DarkAmbient]

You have to wonder at the psychology of people who are happy to defend P2W systems. There are the full-time contrarians/baiters etc (which is its own kind of weird), but then you have people who actually think it's good that a developer would gimp the gameplay acquisition of player power purely to encourage you to spend money. I don't see anything positive about that at all.

[crusadernero]

Not the only one, just the best one. Add salty tears to taste.

If revenue is your only focus here, sure. What Blizzards(or any other gaming companys) revenue got to do with you, is beyond me. You dont earn anything from it. BlizzKotic is swimming in record revenue year in year out, yet we, the gamers, get worse and worse games. On top of that, we get below par games that tempts players to spend money on it.

So whats even your argument here? You are the proud defender of these practives that you in no shape or form get anything out of?

- - - Updated - - -

You have to wonder at the psychology of people who are happy to defend P2W systems. There are the full-time contrarians/baiters etc (which is its own kind of weird), but then you have people who actually think it's good that a developer would gimp the gameplay acquisition of player power purely to encourage you to spend money. I don't see anything positive about that at all.

Probably because if they do defend it, they are on "the side" of those that make record profits and thus belong to the "cool crowd". Those that focus on individualization, greed and money beyond everything else. Yet still, they never profit from it. What they get are shite games were they can spend money.

That or a grand delusion were they get satisfaction from using real money in a virtual game(that will be forgotten in a short time), thinking if they spend this money in the game and become "cool/powerful", they are happy. In essence, they live theyre lifes through these kind of games.

[Funkyjunky]

Losing resources of course. Why develop an AAA game when I can make yet another mobile game with a cash shop that makes millions of profit?

Does a company gain resources by not making profit?

And yes, I know that are different teams and all that, but there are a LOT of people involved in DI. If half of those people would have been working on Diablo 4 for years now, would not Diablo 4 be released today? Would not WoW had better content with a better cadence?

I know that developing a game is not as easy as throwing more people to it, but we are talking about years of development. Those people that are working on a shitty Diablo money grabbing game could be trained and contributing to Diablo 4 and WoW.

Does that involve the people working at Netease?

You wan't a AAA game developed by people not specialized in their field?

[chiddie]

Can someone tell me when exactly the game becomes p2w?

Late endgame? Because I’m 30 atm and besides some advertising here and there I’m totally ignoring the shop and I’m not feeling I have to buy something to proceed.

[Funkyjunky]

Can someone tell me when exactly the game becomes p2w?

Late endgame? Because I’m 30 atm and besides some advertising here and there I’m totally ignoring the shop and I’m not feeling I have to buy something to proceed.

It appears to be endgame related. I have read a few comments about some legendary gems not being available to f2p players. But I have no personal experience.

[Vasilisa]

You have to wonder at the psychology of people who are happy to defend P2W systems. There are the full-time contrarians/baiters etc (which is its own kind of weird), but then you have people who actually think it's good that a developer would gimp the gameplay acquisition of player power purely to encourage you to spend money. I don't see anything positive about that at all.

Logically thinking I would say they are working in the mobile gaming industry themselves. However I've been on these forums long enough that I'm not so sure if you can apply simple logic here.

[Elim Garak]

Oh please, theres no reason for the simple lecture of how gaming came to be. Im old enough to remember the time were you bought the game and that was that. Were every game came as it was. The minus back then was that many games should have had more than delivered, but thats kind of besides the point.

That wasn't a lecture of how gaming came to be. It was about F2P.
Gaming came to be with the arcades - where p2w was invented. The one with the most quarters dominated the leaderboard.

And today you still normally just buy the game and that's that. But just like you could borrow a game from a friend and play for free - now you can just play for free some of the games.

- - - Updated - - -

If revenue is your only focus here, sure.

Since it was about business practices. That's the only focus.

[ImpalerEU]

"you must have pay2win and microtransactions or you are welfare!"
Tell me you're an underage zoomer without telling me you're an underage zoomer.

- - - Updated - - -



It's because normies and casual phone gamers make up a majority of the market now.

No, you can play to win and pay to win if you can't be bothered playing. Both options are there.
Don't twist things to serve your simple minded purpose.

Clearly you're too brainless to realize that social media has brainwashed you to the gills.

[Elim Garak]

You have to wonder at the psychology of people who are happy to defend P2W systems.

Gladly there's no need to wonder at the psychology of people who complain about p2w in f2p.
It's mostly insecurity about their finances and life choices.

They see a guy who dropped $1k on the game and got the shiny armor. But they can't afford to drop $1k on shiny armor. They feel envy, then anger, then they cope by calling the guy stupid for dropping $1k on a silly game WHILE WASTING THEIR TIME GRINDING PIXELS IN THAT VERY GAME.
Time > Money.
The guy who has money and values time more than money is automatically smarter.

So then they go on forums and complain about the game they don't have to play (and shouldn't) because it makes them realize how inferior they are.

[ImpalerEU]

Little did I know that the only business practice is obnoxious p2w mechanics that prey on the playerbase. Damn, what do you recon? This has been going on since gaming started eh?

Then don't play it. No one will "prey" on you then.

[everydaygamer]

Can someone tell me when exactly the game becomes p2w?

Late endgame? Because I’m 30 atm and besides some advertising here and there I’m totally ignoring the shop and I’m not feeling I have to buy something to proceed.

Apparently in the endgame you can spend money to max out your gear. But since maxing out your gear is the entire point of the game I'm not sure what scenario would require you to spend money outside of maybe dominating pvp or leaderboards.

But since the game has been out for only a few days it's hard to draw any real conclusions so it's mostly just people complaning over what they think is a problem even though nobody actually knows for sure if it will be a problem.

The good news is most of the people making noise should lose interest after a few weeks by which point real conversations based on real data can be started.

[DarkAmbient]

Gladly there's no need to wonder at the psychology of people who complain about p2w in f2p.
It's mostly insecurity about their finances and life choices.

They see a guy who dropped $1k on the game and got the shiny armor. But they can't afford to drop $1k on shiny armor. They feel envy, then anger, then they cope by calling the guy stupid for dropping $1k on a silly game WHILE WASTING THEIR TIME GRINDING PIXELS IN THAT VERY GAME.
Time > Money.
The guy who has money and values time more than money is automatically smarter.

So then they go on forums and complain about the game they don't have to play (and shouldn't) because it makes them realize how inferior they are.

That was a good attempt Elim, but when you know someone's trying it doesn't really have the same effect, you know?

[Elim Garak]

That was a good attempt Elim, but when you know someone's trying it doesn't really have the same effect, you know?

Then why the snide remark? That's a defense mechanism. The truth can be gleaned from it. That's psychology. You'd been better off just ignoring (that's hard I guess). Like the saying goes, better to stay silent than to open your mouth and dispel any doubts.

[crusadernero]

Then don't play it. No one will "prey" on you then.

Yet again someone who cant look beyond themself. This isnt about me and my gaming habits. Its about the direction of were gaming is going. But then again, its a difficult task for many of these forums to think beyond themself.

[Elim Garak]

Yet again someone who cant look beyond themself. This isnt about me and my gaming habits. Its about the direction of were gaming is going. But then again, its a difficult task for many of these forums to think beyond themself.

You don't like where the gaming is going? Or do you worry about all the people in the future who will have to deal with the gaming when it arrives there?

The former I can understand - and if that's the case - just don't play the games you don't like

The latter I cannot understand.