The Boys

[Darkeon]

Last episode was definitely the weakest.

Overall, pretty good season though. All the not-so-subtle foreshadowing of the Boys' deaths kept me on edge during the entire season [SIZE=1][I](I have no prior knowledge of the comics and whether they die anytime soon or not)[/I][/SIZE]. Was sorta bitter-sweet to have none of them dying.

[Daedius]

Watch Black Noir survive too come next season.

[Xilurm]

Why did Ryan have a little psycho grin there at the end? He should be terrified of what Homelander did.

[Vilendor]

For me the season finale made a 10/10 show instantly jump the shark

They turned the final episode into a "family" parody, half the characters act against their core values and nature, Starlight should be renamed Flashlight after going full power and managing to push Soldier Boy 3 meters back, Mothers Milk the biggest badass and leader is turned into a crybaby, they threw away the whole Black Noire plotline after ALL that buildup, Frenchie cooks the worlds most dangerous gas in a hobby lab under 2 minutes, Kimiko goes Madonna while soldiers aiming at her boyfriend, suddenly everyone develops a plotarmor, the writers are afraid to kill characters (Atrain should be dead instead of Noire) and the worst of it all how they turn a soulless merchenary Butcher into a cuckold simp ("my wife's kid" is literally out of the simp memes)

[Endus]

Except Ryan has been shown to be terrified of Homelander, even having nightmares about him. He just 180s because Homelander shows up and compliments him on his throw while threatening the woman who has been looking after him for a year? Are you saying that Malory hasn't been showing him love and caring for him? He lived most of his life with Becca and you would think that she would have rubbed off on him.

Malory's a guardian, not a parent. Like a foster parent, who does their job but doesn't have that much of an emotional connection.

Also, children aren't completely blank slates, and choosing badly is a thing that happens all the time.

Why wasn't Grace's love enough?

Where did we ever get told that Grace loved Ryan?

She agrees Ryan needs to be kept safe from Homelander, because she opposes Homelander. She's got the skills to do so, as well as anyone (which means not well at all, through no fault of her own).

If Homelander got gibbed and Butcher was gonna take Ryan as his adoptive kid, do you really think Grace would stick around? Beyond checking in now and then, given that Ryan's powered?

Why weren't Homelander's outside actions enough to deter Ryan from trusting him?

Kids trust abusive parents all the time, and Homelander wasn't even particularly abusive to Ryan. The closest you get is tossing him off the roof, and that was legitimately Homelander trying (incompetently) to be a good dad, rather than intentionally harming his son.

If you mean Homelander's actions against other people, you're missing a really big factor; why would Ryan give a shit?

"Basic human empathy" is a good reason, but why are we presuming Ryan's less of a sociopath than his dad?

The reason Homelander's so deeply broken may really not have anything at all to do with how he was raised. Hell, Soldier Boy wasn't raised that way, and he's nearly as bad, right? Sure seems like sociopathy runs in that genetic line.

Why is Ryan's first question to Homelander "Aren't you mad at me?" when the person he lasered was a Nazi. Are they still withholding informaiton about the outside world from Ryan? If so, why? I literally couldn't comprehend that this was his first question.

My reading on that was he knew his mom would've been mad at him. So he's curious why Homelander isn't. I think that's an early red flag.

Why didn't Grace explain/why didn't Ryan understand that Butcher was keeping him at arm's length to protect his feelings in case Butcher got killed, and that he didn't really mean the part about hating him?

None of that might have made a difference. Intellectual arguments often fail to solve emotional problems.

These are all questions that arise because of poor, sloppy writing. Like someone pointed out, Ryan was literally having nightmares about Homelander early in the season, he and Grace have to run from location to location to keep safe from him, and then he just flips the moment Homelander says some bullshit? The character they built up about Ryan was seemingly utterly destroyed by one, singular act by Butcher, and now he's a full on psycho like his dad? Come off it.

Or the red flags were there early on, as above. He was also constantly being told he should be afraid of Homelander. But Homelander's also the only one willing to let Ryan make choices for himself, who tells him how special Ryan is, who's repeatedly telling Ryan he loves him. Sure, there's a nearly abusive level of narcissism in there, but still; kids pick abusive parents in custody battles all the time, and there's plenty of forms of abuse that involve unhealthy attachments. It's definitely the wrong choice, from the audience's point of view, but that doesn't mean it doesn't feel right, to Ryan.

Who's also a kid. And who apparently enjoys the idea of eye-lasering people he doesn't like, as we saw at the end.

Why did Ryan have a little psycho grin there at the end? He should be terrified of what Homelander did.

He's literally Homelander's son. Why are people so quick to assume the apple falls that far from the tree? That he isn't just a little Homelander, himself?

and the worst of it all how they turn a soulless merchenary Butcher into a cuckold simp ("my wife's kid" is literally out of the simp memes)

Man, get this "simp" nonsense out of here. All you're describing is your own personal deep and unhealthy insecurities.

[Jotaux]

Why did Ryan have a little psycho grin there at the end? He should be terrified of what Homelander did.

To be honest I think Homelander should be terrified of Ryan. That kid is not right.

[Kumorii]

To be honest I think Homelander should be terrified of Ryan. That kid is not right.

Wouldn't surprise me if Ryan becomes popular and Homelander become jealous of him.

[Endus]

Wouldn't surprise me if Ryan becomes popular and Homelander become jealous of him.

Like, THE central theme of The Boys is that everyone is awful and self-interested and heroics can only ever happen despite that. Even the "heroes" are terrible people most of the time.

Why on Earth would anyone presume that Ryan is gonna be the exception to that rule?

I won't be shocked if you've gotten it backwards, and Homelander eventually gets gibbed for good by a Ryan who wants the spotlight his dad won't give up.

[Kumorii]

Like, THE central theme of The Boys is that everyone is awful and self-interested and heroics can only ever happen despite that. Even the "heroes" are terrible people most of the time.

Why on Earth would anyone presume that Ryan is gonna be the exception to that rule?

I won't be shocked if you've gotten it backwards, and Homelander eventually gets gibbed for good by a Ryan who wants the spotlight his dad won't give up.

Not sure how the first bit is relevant to what I said. I agree with it though. Ryan will most likely become just like everyone else.
And him wanting Homelanders spotlight doesn't mean Homelander can't get jealous of his sons spotlight either. In fact, Homelanders influence is probably why Ryan would become as such.

So I agree with that too. Certainly possible.

[Sting]

The my wife's kid line cracked me up, 100% put in there intentionally. The humor is on point for most of the season, as is the portrayal of how society functions in modern day America (or atleast what it looks like to myself as European). Can't wait for the next season.

[cubby]

Terrific series with another great season under their belt. Just unbelievable character development - STILL. The ending with Ryan fucking everyone's plans up was nicely done. That grin at the end was perfect - we can already see Homelander's effects on him. It would be interesting if Homelander and Butcher had to somehow team up to "defeat" Ryan down the road.

I'll be curious if they can keep the same creativity and newness with Season 4. I don't have any knowledge of the book so I don't know how far it originally went. The head-popper being the new VP definitely brings the stakes up a few - especially when the President is killed (I'm assuming he will be popped) and she is running the country.

And Starlight flying...cool.

Do we think Butcher and the others will get permanent V and go head-to-head?

- - - Updated - - -

The my wife's kid line cracked me up, 100% put in there intentionally. The humor is on point for most of the season, as is the portrayal of how society functions in modern day America (or atleast what it looks like to myself as European). Can't wait for the next season.

They certainly did a nice job of channeling some of the issues we've been facing.

[Skizzit]

I thought for sure they were going to go for some version of "V makes you an asshole" storyline with the way Butcher and Hughie both acted on the 24 hour stuff. Maybe next season.

Also, Ryan is going to be the one to kill Homelander, right? I mean, that has seemed like the direction since last season but the ending of this one really made it seem obvious to me. Then it will either be that Butcher is forced to kill Ryan or Ryan becomes the first big, non-asshole super.

[cubby]

I thought for sure they were going to go for some version of "V makes you an asshole" storyline with the way Butcher and Hughie both acted on the 24 hour stuff. Maybe next season.

Also, Ryan is going to be the one to kill Homelander, right? I mean, that has seemed like the direction since last season but the ending of this one really made it seem obvious to me. Then it will either be that Butcher is forced to kill Ryan or Ryan becomes the first big, non-asshole super.

Hughie wasn't an asshole on V, he was just different, stronger, etc - and it was never entirely clear in some scenes if he was still under the effects of temp-V.

Ryan is being set up as another asshole Supe - that grin at the end said it all. I could see Homelander and Butcher having to team up to stop him. Or something outside of that trifecta when Ryan starts to demonstrate control over his power and exhibits assholeness.

[Eapoe]

BN will be back, but it’s a different supe that comes along to take up the mantle.
As for next season, I’m thinking there will be a nod to the comic books with either a major scene, or the ending of the series, taking place in the White House with the VP.
Could be interesting.
As for this last season, feeling kind of just let down. Herogasm was a decent episode, but the cast hyped it up so much that it came off pretty tame for what they made you expect.
The final episode was alright for the spectacle, but Starlight had so much build up just for not much to happen. It could have been amazing to see her put some burns on him or something, just to accentuate his durability further while also showing how strong she could become.
I’ve seen people talk about Butcher and how he was stupid to throw everything away to protect Ryan, but Maeve holding up Homelander instead of letting him and SB fight it out, or even picking to help one end the other, makes just as little sense.
Keeping A Train alive also kind of upsets me. I’m really worried they are going to try and make him more sympathetic or a redemption of some kind, even though everyone who knowns him best even points out he’s basically irredeemable.
I still don’t understand how Maeve lived after getting nuked, stripped of her power, and then falling the rest of the way. There wasn’t even anything shown with Kimiko to show that the powers disappeared slowly or anything.
Overall though, I did enjoy the season, and even some of the things I didn’t like or question too much aren’t enough to ruin it for me.
I’d give it a 7/10 overall.

[Relapses]

The final episode was alright for the spectacle, but Starlight had so much build up just for not much to happen. It could have been amazing to see her put some burns on him or something, just to accentuate his durability further while also showing how strong she could become..

This was another thing that kind of irked me. I got some real CW Network level special effects vibes from a lot of the "big fight scene" at the end there, especially with Starlight's part. (Maybe they spent the whole season's budget on MM's scene in Herogasm?) I had to rewatch the scene a second time before I even realized that Hughie was amplifying her powers because so much was going on at once and most of it happened without any explanation whatsoever.

[cubby]

This was another thing that kind of irked me. I got some real CW Network level special effects vibes from a lot of the "big fight scene" at the end there, especially with Starlight's part. (Maybe they spent the whole season's budget on MM's scene in Herogasm?) I had to rewatch the scene a second time before I even realized that Hughie was amplifying her powers because so much was going on at once and most of it happened without any explanation whatsoever.

I thought they made the amplification issue pretty clear, but I was watching pretty closely as well. There really wasn't a need for big effects in that scene, it was about end-season choices and how they affect both the big picture and the continuing story line for each character.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

I thought for sure they were going to go for some version of "V makes you an asshole" storyline with the way Butcher and Hughie both acted on the 24 hour stuff. Maybe next season.

They've had 3 seasons of "V makes you an asshole"

[Lorgar Aurelian]

They've had 3 seasons of "V makes you an asshole"

I don’t know feels a lot more like 3 seasons of capitalism and fame make you an asshole not the V it self as there have been abunch of one episode or less important people who had V but generally still seem to want to do actual good just none of them get a focus other then starlight.

[Skizzit]

They've had 3 seasons of "V makes you an asshole"

But I meant more in a direct way, not the abstract having power brings out the darkest parts of people way. I meant more like if you use powers, it actually lowers your empathy. I thought for sure when Butcher was yelling at the kid that's where it was headed. I mean Butcher is an asshole but that was next level stuff.

There is a similar story in the novel series The Reckoners by Brandon Sanderson and this season just really seamed to be leaning there.

[Ophenia]

I thought for sure they were going to go for some version of "V makes you an asshole" storyline with the way Butcher and Hughie both acted on the 24 hour stuff. Maybe next season.

But, V doesn't make you an asshole. It's just that most people taking V are asshole to begin with, and as explained by Butcher, V only emphasizes what you are inside. It's just that most of the Vought Supes were grown/developed within Vought influence (so obviously becoming assholes), and from the few people taking V at adult age (Kimiko, Butcher, Hughie), one is an asshole, one is a coward desperate to finally be useful, and another one is by her own word "a monster" but she's kinda good inside, even though her character development in the last episode was weird af.

And I think Starlight is the perfect example of "V doesn't make you an asshole".

So, I'm pretty sure Ryan will grow to become an asshole because he is one, but not solely because of V. Feeling immortal is probably what makes most supes become asshole in the end, so that's more something akin to a side-effect.

Why is Ryan's first question to Homelander "Aren't you mad at me?" when the person he lasered was a Nazi. Are they still withholding informaiton about the outside world from Ryan? If so, why? I literally couldn't comprehend that this was his first question.

Let's not forget that Ryan is what, 8, 9 ? And he was grown in complete lockdown in a Vought facility, where it's extremely likely the "Nazi" aspect was not taught the correct way (considering Vought's origin). The only time Ryan was outside of this Vought facility, it was with Mallory, moving from house to house. It's very likely they didn't really teach him about all of the world's history in less than one year hiding from Homelander.

So, in Ryan's eyes, he has lasered his mom + his dad's girlfriend. He doesn't know (or does he care) on which end of the political spectrum Stormfront was.