[Prot] WoD/Legion Alpha Discussion

[Deleted]

/popcorn

Harsh Words is a dps gain, but I would never use it on a fight like Mythic Butcher cause he just wrecks my face. Harsh Words is a dps gain in the same sense Death Knights can press Blood Boil 6 times if they want to, you can do more damage if you dont need the mitgation.

Harsh words has is not the sole reason that makes Prot Paladin burst high. It is high but they have a pretty big case of CD stacking. On the pull I will have Execution Sentence, 2k Bonus Armour from my Imperator trinket, 1.5k Bonus Armour from Pot, 1k Bonus Armour from Seraphim (plus all the other lovely stats) and an increase an AP % from my other Twin Ogron trinket. I will also be using Holy Avenger which makes Holy Power generating abilties do 30% additional damage and generate three Holy Power that lets me spend it on Harsh Words or Shield of the Righteous between GCD's

Now yeah, Harsh Words has a spellpower coeffecient of 276.3% and Shield of the Righteous has an attackpower coeffecient at 192% so Harsh Words does more damage, but you do not gain the ~40% Physical damage reduction which is deadly on some encounters. A good Paladin knows when not to use Harsh Words just as a good Blood DK will know when to save a set of runes for death strike instead of spamming blood boil. A big difference is we can choose to use our Holy Avenger as a pure dps CD or as a defensive depending on what we require

[Termintaux]

This isn't relevant to the DK looking for compassion in a Pally thread but I was hoping for some help on trinkets especially following the haste buffs.
I'm watching Towellie clear mythic atm and he was just given Tectus' Beating Heart (he also commented on how he'd like Bottle of Infesting Spores), which he used straight away.

My guild is on Mythic Bracken atm and when using SW_Sera which are the best trinkets? I have Pol's Blinding Eye HC, Mythic Warforged Bottle of Infesting Spores (GG Cache) 3/3 Skull of War, Scabbard, and Pillar of the Earth Normal.
Side question, enchant/gem to Haste now?

[Krekko]

Alright guys.

Keep the topic on PROTECTION Paladins, keep any discussion relevant to that, and be respectful towards other posters. If you're going to carry out an attitude, take it elsewhere.

Thanks and happy posting!

[zloitima]

anyone ran numbers on new Alabaster Shield? how does it stand in comparison with other glyphs? what's everyone's choice now?

[Deleted]

lol@ban

What level 100 talents did you guys use, or plan to use, for Mythic Impregnator, and with how many tanks?

[Xfighter]

Last week raided with a Kirin Tor ring, this week forget to start logs on Mythic Kargath

R.I.P. 46.9k log, you will be missed.



Looked at logs, and it seems theres a pretty good representation of tanks in the top 10 on every fight, so it really doesnt seem like anything need be done @ previous discussion.

<edited out useless post>

Tried harsh words in heroic tonight, and you do notice the loss of mitigation a decent bit, and think it caught some healers off guard in a few bursty situations, which partially ended up my fault for having a poor keybind swap making SotR harder to access thinking I wouldn't need it at all. After fixing that, things evened out. The survival loss for using it for anything remotely relevant WHILE tanking is 100% not worthwhile. Weaving is certainly decent enough, just didnt overly care to focus enough for that later into the night.


P.S. The warrior buffs seem to be doing pretty well, boosted my co-tanks DPS a fair bit from pre-buff numbers, and it surely was needed.

[Snuzzfizzle]

lol@ban

What level 100 talents did you guys use, or plan to use, for Mythic Impregnator, and with how many tanks?

We used three tanks.
I progressed with both Holy Shield (with the ToT 2p set bonus and Harsh Words) and Seraphim.
If you have survivability issues in p3, take HS but your damage in all other phases will suck. If you manage to stay alive during p3, definitely take Seraphim.
I also used SoI during p3 because fuck those remnants.

[Lide]

It looks like they fixed Lay on Hands healing through the Brackenspore breath.

Incoming more mushroom healing.

[Xfighter]

It looks like they fixed Lay on Hands healing through the Brackenspore breath.

Incoming more mushroom healing.

Was fixed since Wednesday last week I believe, whenever they had the hotfix about %-based heals being able to be affected by healing modifiers again.

[Deleted]

We used three tanks.
I progressed with both Holy Shield (with the ToT 2p set bonus and Harsh Words) and Seraphim.
If you have survivability issues in p3, take HS but your damage in all other phases will suck. If you manage to stay alive during p3, definitely take Seraphim.
I also used SoI during p3 because fuck those remnants.

Did you not have more suitable tank for the remnants? The only thing we have that we can use often is Divine Protection and that is locked in to our Seraphim sequence

[Candlemaster]

Last week raided with a Kirin Tor ring, this week forget to start logs on Mythic Kargath

R.I.P. 46.9k log, you will be missed.



Looked at logs, and it seems theres a pretty good representation of tanks in the top 10 on every fight, so it really doesnt seem like anything need be done @ previous discussion.

<edited out useless post>

Tried harsh words in heroic tonight, and you do notice the loss of mitigation a decent bit, and think it caught some healers off guard in a few bursty situations, which partially ended up my fault for having a poor keybind swap making SotR harder to access thinking I wouldn't need it at all. After fixing that, things evened out. The survival loss for using it for anything remotely relevant WHILE tanking is 100% not worthwhile. Weaving is certainly decent enough, just didnt overly care to focus enough for that later into the night.


P.S. The warrior buffs seem to be doing pretty well, boosted my co-tanks DPS a fair bit from pre-buff numbers, and it surely was needed.

I tried out harsh words in lfr... i died on brackenspore with no healer being above 10k hps (/wtf). It wasn't even during a breath and I only had 6 stacks of rot on me... I did really like however I noticed my HW jumping from doing 17k [I checked they were all 3 HP but the crits were coming at 55k w/o sera up Was i just having wonky rng or is the crit multiplcation on HW higher than 150% 200%? I'll never get to actually ever use it even on farm content in my current guild. Our healers excluding maybe one or two are quite suboptimal and have several heroic highmaul peices but im still sitting at below 50% most boss fights. (im mostly full heroic / 2 piece mythic from caches)

[aGit]

as i understood it, is our new stat prio BA > haste > mastery > crit > rest?

i just want to be sure before i start regemming and reenchanting my stuff

[Xfighter]

As per earlier in the thread, and via Theck @ www.sacredduty.net:

Bonus Armor > Haste (to 50%) > Crit (Seraphim) >= Mastery > Crit = Vers > Multistrike > Haste (above 50%)


Basically Crit/Mastery are interchangable, based on preference/individual gear set ups. But it's pretty safe to go for haste gems/enchants, minus the weapon enchant, where either Blackrock or Thunderlord are probably still the best two to choose from. Even the mastery one in a HS-world probably works as well. Not sure on the #s for the haste enchant though. Basically if you already have a chant on your wep, prob best to still keep it for now.

[Deleted]

as i understood it, is our new stat prio BA > haste > mastery > crit > rest?

i just want to be sure before i start regemming and reenchanting my stuff

Guide thread pending updates - they'll be done as soon as I can get to them - but Haste is our best stat now. The only thing I'm still trying to figure out is whether I intend to advocate haste cap during Sera or haste cap outside Sera - likely the latter since I find it doubtful we'll be using Sera past T18 progression.

[arel00]

I'm guessing we'll end up wanting Haste>Mastery in the end anyway. But that's just gut feeling for now.

[kouji71]

Yeah, not having any trouble with seraphim uptime anymore. If anything theck's WA are telling me to start pooling haste too early now.

[Vergilius]

1) This change had very little effect on where Seraphim/HS stand. It buffs both of them to some degree. Obviously Seraphim a little more than HS, but not by enough to make a huge difference in how either perform relative to one another. Here's the raid summary plot from the sim in the blog post:

You can compare that to the same prot from the "pre-hotfix" sim to see that nothing much changed on the TMI plot. All the numbers went down by ~1k.

Why is Sera_HA better on DTPS than Sera_SW? Do you really gain that much less damage taken during HA that it not only offsets the constant HP generated by SW on the 1 min 42 sec downtime, but beats it by 1.7k DTPS? That seems crazy.

[Tivadar]

As fun and funny that I find it to be pulling nearly 40k single target in prot spec, albeit a DPS centric build, I'll be the first to say this buff went a little far.

I was purely focused on the DPS aspect of the build as you can see I was not actually tanking. It actually appears to be viable as a dps spec, but from the small sample size I had does seem to fall behind ret in all aspects since not avoiding attacks cripples aoe damage a bit.

Unable to post links, but anyone interested I was prot DPS for my guilds heroic farm on Tuesday. Name is Tiv on bleeding hollow if anyone cared to check it out on warcraftlogs

[Deleted]

Why is Sera_HA better on DTPS than Sera_SW? Do you really gain that much less damage taken during HA that it not only offsets the constant HP generated by SW on the 1 min 42 sec downtime, but beats it by 1.7k DTPS? That seems crazy.

HA has better uptime on SotR to begin with, than SW. And the SotRs preformed durning HA will be also buffed by Seraphim.

EDIT:
With my current gear, I get the following theoretical maximal uptimes:
- HA: 60% SotR uptime
- SW: 47% SotR uptime

That is a lot. :\

[Deleted]

thank you theck and all the other guys für your work!