Blizzard, please, don't change anything in the Mage Tower challenge

[crusadernero]

It has literally nothing to do with skills, it is about time lol

It is a game, everyone can press the keys at the right time and move around with practice... you know.

They should nerf the HP a bit, for the sake of saving us time. That´s about it.

It most certainly is about time if the only way to complete these challenges are to farm old shite gear from old xpacs & timewalking dungeons. Not only do you need to complete the challenges, but also spend time farming gear that are useless in every other place than there.

[Alydael]

I hope Blizzard never listen to those who are complaining about the Mage Tower challenge. It's a real challenge, and it's not meant to be an easy path. If you can't deal with the encounters, improve your skill, because that's basically the problem: your LACK of skill. Bosses are NOT overtuned, they are just challenging; get over it. All those who are complaining wanna destroy an interesting feature of the game just because they want it straight away; they wanna get there and kill the boss without any effort (perhaps because they think they should get it just because they're paying). As I said before, you should IMPROVE your skill with your character and try it over and over until you get it. Blizzard, please, don't listen to those who are whining, they are the reason why this game has become so easy in so many ways. Keep the difficulty as it is right now.

I think you lost sight of what goes into content/ game design. It is not about any of the things you mentioned at all (where did you even get that info- it was bad, don't go to that site anymore).

It's all a matter of who the content is designed for.

If the content was designed for mythic raiders, players that push +15 keys and gladiator level pvp players: Then it is fine, maybe even a drop undertuned.

If it is designed for your average player to complete in a reasonable amount of time: its way overtuned and the players will probably try it for a bit then give up on it.

Its all about your intent when you design the content. Who is this content designed for? I do not think Blizz ever clearly stated who they were designing this for.

I would suspect it is the regular player though because:
1) This is recycled content, not cutting edge stuff. The cutting edge part of this was the first, original time it dropped. That time is over now.

2)They are currently way short on content for the "average" player

It really comes down to who this content was meant to engage. I am not really sure where you even got all that other stuff from. A game is a business with an intent and a purposeful design.

[crusadernero]

If it wasn't time-limited then I feel like they'd probably be fine leaving them as they are.

However, seeing as they are, they could do with some nerfs just so that people kinda get a chance to actually get them done.

yep.. Theres no timed event in wow that is actually hard. Clear 5 mythic dungeons, clear 5 timewalking dungeons, fight 20 pet battles, win 5 bgs.. All of them are easy. Why not this too if they want to have it timed?

- - - Updated - - -

I think you lost sight of what goes into content/ game design. It is not about any of the things you mentioned at all (where did you even get that info- it was bad, don't go to that site anymore).

It's all a matter of who the content is designed for.

If the content was designed for mythic raiders, players that push +15 keys and gladiator level pvp players: Then it is fine, maybe even a drop undertuned.

If it is designed for your average player to complete in a reasonable amount of time: its way overtuned and the players will probably try it for a bit then give up on it.

Its all about your intent when you design the content. Who is this content designed for? I do not think Blizz ever clearly stated who they were designing this for.

I would suspect it is the regular player though because:
1) This is recycled content, not cutting edge stuff. The cutting edge part of this was the first, original time it dropped. That time is over now.

2)They are currently way short on content for the "average" player

It really comes down to who this content was meant to engage. I am not really sure where you even got all that other stuff from. A game is a business with an intent and a purposeful design.

As a average wow player who doesnt push high m+ keys, mythic raids or high end pvp - this feature is something i'll do for a while and if I aint getting progress, I just forget it excists. I did this back in legion too and it was a challenge, but not like this.

Hearing the need to farm old shit gear that scales better in there makes me just frustrated. Hell no im not going to farm that for this. Also, since it timed its easier to just say "fuck it" and ignore it. If it was always there, I could at any time go there and try it out.

[Wuusah]

Imo the WW monk challenge is well designed and not overtuned. But it’s also one of the easiest challenges. I got it in 5-10 tries. Some enemy abilities are ruthless and need to be dealt with, like interrupt but some others are salvageable if it doesn’t overlap with something else.

The worm also doesn’t 1shot you once the Tauren dies, like some people here said. It hits hard but I managed to kill it before it kills me. Obviously you need to get it to low hp before you kill the Tauren, but you don’t have to kill it before the Tauren.

The WW monk challenge never felt unfair. You always had a decent amount of time to react. And I think that’s the problem with many of the other challenges. They are so overtuned that you just get instagibbed by something with barely any time to react. You don’t even know what killed your or how you could’ve done it better.

[HASELHOOF93]

That is why they will nerf it imho. It is not even that most people don't have the will to throw themselves at a brick wall for 4 hours. I doubt most people have 4 hours to play.

?? then simply dont do that content. Being able to clear it aint some human right. You could have that argument for any piece of content that requires time, mount farming, M+, raiding, achivements. Stating all of these I noticed basically playing A GAME. How much time you can/is willing to play it is up to you.

[Chipped coin]

It would awesome if they made it a template.

Then even MORE people won’t be able to do it and there will be absolutely 0 ability to change anything to help.

Unless you’re inferring by making a template it would be tuned easier?

I don't honestly know. I've tried other characters and found the difficulty varied. Some are rather absurd some like imp mother are free. It really seems like it just needed testing now.

[Rustykeyboard]

bad/inexperienced players who have never done this type of content are now feeling the 4 behaviour pattern of change.

1. Denial: It is not me, it is blizzards fault for making the mage tower difficult. They need to nerf, i dont need to change.
2. Resistance: I will not do mage tower until it is nerfed. Or, I will post stuff on forums on why i will quit this game/not do mage tower until it is nerfed.
3. Exploration: Maybe I will try mage tower. I see other people write it is doable. The transmog looks cool. I will give it a try with a positive attitude of i can do it.
4. Commitment: Mage tower is fun, I enjoy doing difficult challenges. Now i will try it on other characters, with other talents. Other builds, i will farm trinkets to make it more interesting.

This is pretty common behaviour among people.

[Coldkil]

bad/inexperienced players who have never done this type of content are now feeling the 4 behaviour pattern of change.

1. Denial: It is not me, it is blizzards fault for making the mage tower difficult. They need to nerf, i dont need to change.
2. Resistance: I will not do mage tower until it is nerfed. Or, I will post stuff on forums on why i will quit this game/not do mage tower until it is nerfed.
3. Exploration: Maybe I will try mage tower. I see other people write it is doable. The transmog looks cool. I will give it a try with a positive attitude of i can do it.
4. Commitment: Mage tower is fun, I enjoy doing difficult challenges. Now i will try it on other characters, with other talents. Other builds, i will farm trinkets to make it more interesting.

This is pretty common behaviour among people.

They are already rebalancing it, blue post and all. While i agree with what you say. Most players though will stop at step 2 and just ignore that content, especially since it's novelty only.

[Deadite]

?? then simply dont do that content. Being able to clear it aint some human right. You could have that argument for any piece of content that requires time, mount farming, M+, raiding, achivements. Stating all of these I noticed basically playing A GAME. How much time you can/is willing to play it is up to you.

Well i won't be doing it. I don't think i have the classes to do them all so there is no point in doing some as the Tmog is pretty shit imho. It is fine they are adding content for a niche audience.

[Eazy]

Requires much more WHAT?

More coordination, DPS, leech, thinking, gear.

I meant much more as overall.

[Lolites]

?? then simply dont do that content. Being able to clear it aint some human right. You could have that argument for any piece of content that requires time, mount farming, M+, raiding, achivements. Stating all of these I noticed basically playing A GAME. How much time you can/is willing to play it is up to you.

that would be true IF timewalking was always available
when something is available twice a goddamn year thats a different story

[ro9ue]

I think there's a point where something can be tuned so tightly and you can execute all the proper actions, but still lose because of small variances over the course of the fight. Something didn't crit, your total critical strikes overall were less, allowing a phase to not transition as smoothly. Procs don't line up. Etc, etc.

At that point, yes you need the skill and practice to get to that level, but that player is still essentially pulling levers for a smooth set of variables to play out for success. Having done a ton of these, I know that sometimes your success just comes down to a trinket proc lining up nicely or rolling a crit on an agatha imp.

What it should be tuned to is just if you've executed everything correctly, prioritizations, avoided bad mechanics, etc - you'll get your win.

[Lolites]

1. Denial: It is not me, it is blizzards fault for making the mage tower difficult.

thats not denial, thats reality, they already admited some specs are terribly tuned...
ive done few back in legion (before overgearing it) and some of them are now WAAAAY harder due to legendaries/artifects missing and class changes...

[DechCJC]

The more I do the challenges, the more I realize that for the most part, people really do just need to get better. I don't mean to sound like a prick, but it's actually really frustrating seeing people complain about this stuff after a day.

They're not impossible, they're some of the only challenging solo content the game has to offer. The solution should be to remove the time limit, detach it from the legion timewalking altogether, not nerf it. There are few cases where it should be SLIGHTLY nerfed, and they could do a better job with optimizing stats and gear so that gear has NO impact whatsoever, templates if you will.

I've went from thinking the holy priest challenge was impossible to something that I can complete 9/10 times without fail. It's taken a long time, and I'm going to be pretty miffed if they nerf it when it's totally doable and i've spent this time getting through it.

TL;DR remove the time gate, PLEASE don't nerf them much. Tweak them slightly where needed, and when I say tweak, I mean mostly health pools of certain enemies.

[Edlarel]

TLDR if you're confident you have the skill, then farm up the gear/stat requirements, because ilevel doesn't help and the content requires specific gear.

A friend and I were discussing this last night, and the consensus is they're not "overtuned" in the sense that they're impossible. They're just tuned for characters with gear we don't have anymore. The people beating these right now are doing so after altering their gear to line up better with what the tower requires, which typically means greater defense and trinkets FROM Legion (Withered Jim says hi). Had a warlock saying he beat destro with Versatility gear and armor gems.

Right now, it's how PVP should be. You're going to have an exponentially harder time beating it without the gear that is intended for it (RE: Legion-esque). Because we don't have Legiondaries and such, it comes off as overtuned for the currently downscaled gear.

Our proposal was not to nerf the difficulty of the encounter itself, but to have the gear you're wearing be either a) irrelevant to the challenge or b) activate the legiondaries while in the encounters and key off of its ilevel/rarity to compare to legion gear accordingly, so mythic current content gear = mythic Antorus and so on. Option B is more fair to people who put in effort to optimize, but also means your power level will fluctuate with each new raid (that may not be a bad thing). But it will ultimately make the fights more about the challenge and less about the lack of gear.

Anyway, that's about where I stand with it. Currently smashing my druid up against the tank boss that I beat with some amount of ease back when it was current. Just learning the mechanics again, pretty sure I'll be fine.

[m4xc4v413r4]

I just came here to see people cry about the mage tower. It's like going back in time. Carry on.

[SirReal]

As I told you before, I don't need to prove anything. You're free to think I'm lying, it's so funny to see you trying to catch me with something.

Improve your skill and stop whining. Period.

Obvious troll is obvious. You haven't killed anything and you'll forever be the bench player that you hate. Sorry bud...

[Gaidax]

Had a warlock saying he beat destro with Versatility gear and armor gems.

I have no idea just based on what you people think it requires some special gear. I did Destruction challenge with this character: armory link equipped in very same gear as usual and just switching 2 talents.

Armor gems? Versatility gear? Wut???

It's a pure mechanics challenge - you either interrupt fel burst or fuck it up, you either move out of shit or fuck it up.

Heck, it's not even "tight" - you can eat occasional burst or ground AoE and recover over time. You don't even have to execute everything 100%, there is a certain leeway for fuckups. P2 does not even "exist", you get to P2 - you're practically done.

[Rustykeyboard]

but not impossible, people are still completing MT.

[HASELHOOF93]

that would be true IF timewalking was always available
when something is available twice a goddamn year thats a different story

Again, speaking in broader terms (I know it might be hard to grasp): the availability of something is in many cases one of the factors that adds value to it.

Lets say you missed it. Then what? You missed a achivement and a transmog with absolutely no player tied to it. Too bad. Try again next time. q.q