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[17:06] <Terin> The reason why I've asked for a meeting is quite simple. I feel theres a lot of things we actually
haven't managed to sort out in the roleplaying forum since the last meeting we had, where a lot of things were
discussed.
[17:07] <Terin> One of my major concerns have been regarding new people. I don't think we've been active enough about
promoting what our part of the forum stands for, and what you can find there. The second part is getting those
who actually do come around to our forum a feel of being welcome, and having some backup in joining up.
[17:09] <Terin> But, I'm going to take a point and start with where I've, in attempts to change things on the forum, ran
my head against the wall. - The moderators.
[17:09] <Terin> Now this is not meant to come off offensively, so please interrupt me if you feel it does.
[17:14] <Terin> I honestly think Black Mage has been away and too... non senstial to the forum to be a moderator, and I
suggest we swap him out for someone else. This someone else could very likely be Khorianas, who's put a lot of
effort and thought into the forum, and I know he cares for the wellbeing of the roleplaying community a lot.
[17:15] <+Khorianas> I would have appreciated if you had gone through this with me.
[17:15] <Terin> It is my thought. Wheter you want to or not, is another discussion.
[17:21] <Madgod> As for replacing Black... he's been with us for a long time, and I'd rather not have another Garots
issue come along
[17:21] <Madgod> if anyone remembers the general circumstances of that.
[17:21] <Madgod> I'd prefer if that was a last minute resort
[17:21] <Terin> As for that, we need moderators we can count on and trust in.
[17:21] <Terin> And I honestly don't feel we can count on Black Mage at all atm.
[17:22] <Terin> I've tried PM'ing him like, over a week ago, and still haven't recieved any response.
[17:23] <+Aramore> I do think that Black needs to go
[17:24] <+Aramore> I don't care what the circumstances are around im
[17:24] <+Aramore> he's not a moderator as it stands
[17:24] <@Sunshine> it's no shame to be removed from a moderator position; it's just a practical question of whether the
person is doing something or not.
[17:24] <@Sunshine> as far as when, it may be delayed slightly because of the current outage, but we'll see
[17:24] <@Sunshine> sometime very soon.
[17:25] <Madgod> I'm not arguing against that. I would just rather not have another Garots thing go on.
[17:25] <+Aramore> Well we'd rather have an active mod
[17:25] <+Terin> I'd rather go through another Garots and have a better forum, than have nothing happen at all.
[17:25] <Madgod> Garots never came back to RP (even though he said he would, multiple times), after he was removed as a
mod.
[17:25] <@Sunshine> if you mean the drama, there's something a little different here, and we can handle things in a
better way.
[17:25] <Madgod> Hopefully.
[17:26] <@Sunshine> focus not on removing mods for right now, but figure out the rest
[17:26] <Madgod> I'd just rather not lose a RPer, considering how relatively few we have.
[17:26] <+Terin> Anyway, onwards to next step.
[17:26] <+Terin> The promotion of the roleplaying forums and how we deal with new rp'ers.
[17:27] <+Terin> First off, I was thinking we need to be more active. Possibly writing summaries of whats going on in
the General forum. Write something about what one can expect, and see happen in the roleplaying forums.
[17:27] <+Terin> So that people actually have an idea something like us exist.
[17:28] <+Terin> A thinog that was also brought up on last meeting, but never happened.
[17:28] <+Terin> I was thinking we could have a post functioning somewhat like a blog.
[17:28] <@Sunshine> Bibi mentioned one ad on the front page; you're welcome to have a thread in the general forums and
post periodically
[17:28] <@Sunshine> if it's not overbumped.
[17:28] <@Sunshine> (where by overbumping i mean every 5 minutes or whatever)
[17:29] <+Terin> Where someone writes updates regarding the forum, every few days.
[17:29] <Madgod> that actually makes things a LOT better.
[17:29] <Madgod> We could update the page with new RP's that are up or something.
[17:29] <+Terin> Exactly.
[17:29] <+Terin> General news from the RP forum.
[17:29] <Madgod> Factions too, because those might give people ideas on making a character or something.
[17:29] <Sy-Nali> if i may add a thought here
[17:30] <Sy-Nali> not to say i don't think the idea is nice, just something maybe worth to keep in mind
[17:30] <Sy-Nali> having as many people joining the rp forums as possible is probably not the best idea, since many may
not actually have the dedication and patience to really be active and do more than three posts and then leave
[17:31] <Sy-Nali> so promotion is all well and good, but shoving it up everyone's ass is not
[17:31] <+Terin> How we're going to deal with new roleplayers.
[17:32] <+Terin> Currently the forum is, in my opinion, quite hard to figure out as a newcomer. There's many posts, many
links, many guides that you'd have to figure out and get through.
[17:32] <+Terin> So what I've been working on is creating a buddy system where the new roleplayers get an experienced
roleplayer helping them out and getting started.
[17:32] <+Terin> That way, it may become a more fun experience and cause more people to put effort into it.
[17:32] <Sy-Nali> have to agree on this with Terin, as i experienced it myself a few weeks ago. i had no clue
whatwherewhyhuh?
[17:32] <+Terin> And people that do not want to put effort into it, will not contact any of the "buddies"
[17:33] <+Terin> So we'll more or less hit two flies with one punch.
[17:33] <+Terin> Obviously, this means some people on the forum will have to put effort into getting new people to feel
welcome.
[17:33] <+Terin> But I am sure there's people like that out there.
[17:36] <Madgod> what's this mean with the stickies?
[17:36] <Madgod> Because we already cut them in half last time.
[17:36] <+Terin> What I suggested was making a "Hot links" thread.
[17:36] <+Khorianas> Maddy: that was my thought.
[17:36] <+Terin> And linking to all the other threads in that one.
[17:37] <+Khorianas> burying the threads gets less people to read them.
[17:37] <Madgod> That's what we said last time, IIRC.
[17:37] <+Terin> The point is, it doesn't matter if they're buried.
[17:37] <+Khorianas> Fishing up the how to do a character thread lead to an influx in bios. So I'd rather have it stay
on top
[17:37] <+Khorianas> I'd disagree.
[17:37] <Madgod> We have the three big ones, the absences thread, and then the "THE REST OF 'EM!" thread.
[17:38] <+Terin> What I mean is, we'd end up with like
[17:38] <+Terin> Absence, Bio's and Hotlinks, at best.
[17:38] <+Terin> And hotlinks would be a thread with like: "Bios - Go here" etc, something small and easy to look
through.
[17:38] <+Khorianas> We had that. and it didn't work imho.
[17:39] <+Terin> What was wrong with that system then?
[17:39] <+Khorianas> Finding the stuff. And having to click through 3 reopening browser windows.
[17:39] <@Sunshine> for what it's worth, a) assuming a buddy system, the buddy would/should/could point out relevant
threads before the person moves on, and b) there's probably nothing wrong with one more sticky if there's really
only that many
[17:39] <+Terin> Exactly my thought.
[17:40] <+Terin> The experienced roleplayers will know where to look.
[17:40] <+Khorianas> So you want to drop the burden on the veterans basically?
[17:40] <+Terin> And for the record, I want to remove all the "We open thread one, and in thread one we open thread two,
and in thread two we open thread three"
[17:40] <+Terin> I want it to be thread one leading to thread three, if you want to go to thread three immediately.
[17:40] <+Aramore> Not sure what you mean there
[17:40] <+Terin> I mean stuff like.
[17:41] <+Terin> If we have a Hotlinks and the hotlinks have "Bio"
[17:41] <+Terin> Then in bio you have "Lifespans" and "Nicknames" and such
[17:41] <+Terin> That might be okay in this term for the b io, but not for other things.
[17:41] <+Terin> I feel there's too much "Leading around" in the threads.
[17:41] <+Terin> So you end up with ten open browser windows at once.
[17:41] <@Sunshine> i think everyone's in agreement on that point
[17:42] <+Terin> And I am sure we can compress it some way or the other.
[17:42] <@Sunshine> i think the stickies are okay as is; we have a few major ones out and the others should all be at a
single level in the important links thread
[17:42] <+Terin> So you'd only have to open hotlinks, and then click to find the way around.
[17:43] <@Sunshine> they're good as is, i mean. with some rearrangement of the major links thread if needed to make sure
everything's there.
[17:43] <+Terin> Because when I wrote my first bio.
[17:43] <+Terin> It was like:
[17:43] <+Terin> Open Bio. -> Open naming thread. -> Open lifespans. -> Open general guide.
[17:44] <+Terin> and suddenly I sat with like 5-6 open browser windows, confusing myself at which one to look at : <
[17:44] <+Aramore> Lifespans would be a WoWpedia link anyways
[17:44] <+Aramore> we can't just steal all the wowpedia infor and call it a day
[17:44] <+Terin> Yes, I'm quite aware :p
[17:44] <+Terin> I'm merely saying we can reduce it to be less of a cluster.
[17:44] <Madgod> Terin: It's better than having a bunch of people fishing through a long list of threads. The links in
the bio thread are right there in the parts where they matter.
[17:44] <+Aramore> it would be easier tio see exactly what you call a cluster if we could see the forums : (
[17:45] <+Khorianas> I think it is quite allright atm.
[17:45] <Madgod> You'd have the same exact thing if you had them in a list on another thread, except that it'd be less
organized
[17:45] <@Sunshine> i'd suggest discussion of stickies be postponed until a future date when the site comes back up
[17:45] <+Terin> Back to the original topics.
[17:45] <+Terin> 1: The Moderators being hard to reach atm.
[17:45] <+Terin> 2: New roleplayers.
[17:46] <+Terin> And 3: The layout of our forums.
[17:46] <@Sunshine> so put 3 aside for now; does anyone have additional comments on 1/2?
[17:46] <+Khorianas> 2 and 3 have been discussed twice the last 4(?) months I think.
[17:46] <@Sunshine> 2 seems to have not been accomplished
[17:46] <+Aramore> it worked for awhile
[17:46] <+Aramore> we did get about 5-10 new people
[17:47] <@Sunshine> there are a few new roleplayers, but it's still a very small board
[17:47] <+Aramore> well bios
[17:48] <+Terin> What do we do about 1?
[17:48] <@Sunshine> what's the purpose for having more moderators?
[17:48] <+Terin> A lot easier to keep track on.
[17:49] <+Aramore> people to reach
[17:49] <Madgod> Sunshine: So I don't go crazy
[17:49] <@Sunshine> what's the responsibility of the moderators right now?
[17:49] <+Terin> They set the general rules of roleplays, keep people in check, assist on bios, new people, keep trolls
and the general layout of the forums clean.
[17:49] <@Sunshine> if this is about one person making decisions and rules for the entire roleplay community, it
shouldn't be happening in the first place
[17:49] <+Khorianas> Terin: the mods said nothing , we discuss stuff,.
[17:50] <@Sunshine> as far as assisting on bios, helping with new people, reminding people of rules during roleplays,
that's a community effort
[17:50] <Madgod> I've always talked with the community before editing the rules.
[17:50] <+Khorianas> You have which is right.
[17:50] <+Khorianas> That's why I wondered about the motion.
[17:50] <+Khorianas> Sunshine is also completele right.
[17:51] <Madgod> I'm not sure about anyone else, but I get quite a few PM's concerning questions and such.
[17:51] <+Terin> Sunshine: If two members disagree on how the rules in a roleplay is bent, a moderator generally steps
in. - And I'd say we're good as a community to give our help.
[17:51] <Madgod> Mods have overseen such things, though I only recall meeting for such twice
[17:52] <@Sunshine> but is having a moderator there any different than having anyone there who knows what they're doing?
aside from a status symbol
[17:52] <+Khorianas> Not really.
[17:52] <+Khorianas> and iirc A thread is ruled by the OP usually
[17:52] <+Terin> ( As long as the op is there :p )
[17:52] <Madgod> We smack any troll who stumbles in here.
[17:52] <Sy-Nali> i think the status symbol can mean something there though, at least and especially among new people
[17:53] <+Khorianas> Maddy: which is done alright.
[17:53] <Madgod> Or really, I, I think... I dunno if the other RP mods have infracted anyone.
[17:53] <Madgod> 'least in the RP forums.
[17:53] <+Terin> The status symbol does mean something, yes.
[17:53] <@Sunshine> trolls are the main point of the RP mods
[17:53] <+Terin> For instance, if more experienced roleplayers - like me and Khorianas - have a go at each other over
something that might be.. silly, its not like we'll be completely devoid of logic in a RP
[17:54] <+Terin> ..But we'll still need someone to tell us to stfu, and who is out of line.
[17:54] <+Aramore> unlike the regular forums where it's just being a mod
[17:54] <+Terin> Which does happen too.
[17:54] <@Sunshine> i was hoping that you'd be able to sort it out yourselves in a thread, or get the opinion of the
others :p
[17:54] <+Terin> We might, we might not.
[17:55] <+Terin> The main point for needing more than one active mod though is also bound in
[17:55] <+Terin> If the roleplayers disagree with the mod.
[17:55] <+Terin> Sorta like
[17:55] <+Terin> It all being more democrative than one being emo or nto.
[17:55] <Madgod> To answer your question, Sunshine, on how many mods we really need... I'd like at least one active
person, and Elyaan's been on-and-off for a couple weeks. A third I doubt is really all that necessary right now
[17:56] <Madgod> Until we start advertising to the rest of the forums, two is plenty.
[17:56] <+Aramore> and as Elyaan doesn't do much RP modding and Black Mage is less active than Garots was
[17:56] <@Sunshine> i agree that it's necessary to have two active mods, purely so that it's not a burden on the one
single mod
[17:57] <+Terin> Elyaan is also busy in the other forums when he's here, I believe.
[17:57] <Madgod> Once (if) we start advertising, we should test those waters. If me and the second mod are swamped,
then we should grab a third
[17:57] <@Sunshine> i doubt we'll need a third
[17:57] <Madgod> maybe even fourth, but I doubt that'd be necessary.
[17:57] <@Sunshine> i doubt it will be swamped in any way shape or form
[17:58] <+Terin> So what is the general consensus? Two mods, needing a new one?
[17:58] <Madgod> Elyaan seemingly had some problems recently. I'd give him the benefit of the doubt for at least a
little while.
[17:59] <+Terin> I just know that I've felt as if Madgod has been alone for far too long, as I've also expressed to him
a while back.
[17:59] <@Sunshine> has Elyaan been interested in the actual administration of the RP forums, other than the one
reorganization?
[18:00] <+Aramore> I think he was about for the reorganisation then didn't do much modding since
[18:00] <Madgod> I believe Aramore has the right of the situation, yeah.
[18:00] <+Terin> I don't know what to answer. He's been away for so long, and when he's here he's also got duties in
other parts of the forums.
[18:00] <@Sunshine> what I'm really looking for in an RP mod is someone who will act on equal footing with Madgod in
helping to take care of the boards
[18:01] <+Terin> I don't know if Elyaan can do that, while also rping with us and keeping track on his own part.
[18:01] <@Sunshine> and who is interested in exerting effort to expand the forum, encouraging new roleplayers (with the
help of the community on both)
[18:01] <+Terin> ^ Tbh, I think that fits mostly everyone in the channel atm.
[18:02] <+Khorianas> I'd have to ask then, is the recent size/activity of the RP Forum a problem Sunshine ?
[18:03] <@Sunshine> if the forum remains as is, it's likely to be pushed down on the forum list, if nothing else. but
that's all in Bibi's hands.
[18:04] <@Sunshine> i don't want to make anybody panic; it's just that if the forums do actually die, there's little
reason to keep an empty forum (especially in prime location near the top of the list)
[18:05] <@Sunshine> so, we'll see how things go
[18:06] <@Sunshine> as far as who would make a good secondary mod; i'm curious to hear suggestions, but likely in
private (via PM on the forums when they come back up or on irc whenever)
[18:06] <@Sunshine> or self-nominations, either way
[18:06] <@Sunshine> just because i don't want to put anyone on the spot here
[18:07] <@Sunshine> also, as far as the second point, i'm curious how everyone feels about both advertising and about a
'buddy system'
[18:07] <+Khorianas> I don't want advertising tbh.
[18:07] <@Sunshine> even in the form of a thread in general discussions?
[18:07] <+Shujaa> If I may, I got into the forum just recently and have a few things to say about that.
[18:07] <+Khorianas> Most likely it will lead to an influx of people that loose interest and lead to rps dying.
[18:07] <@Sunshine> sure Shujaa
[18:10] <+Shujaa> The first thing I did was reading all the stickies and found the beginner RPs, which was great, but it
was really, really intimidating actually trying to get into those threads. There were three at the time, one was
completely dead with only 2-3 posts and didn't really suit me (I find comedic RP feels intimidating to start out
with) and then there was another thread with like...7 pages,
[18:10] <+Shujaa> and now that hread is like 10-15 pages. There's no way a newbie is gonna read through all that to make
one post. I posted in the third one, which was only like 3 pages at the tme cause it felt like I actually have a
shot at getting into that.
[18:10] <Madgod> dun think so.
[18:10] <+Shujaa> So while I love the idea of beginner RPs it's not working imo if they're not properly tended to.
[18:10] <+Aramore> The point in the Tavern RP
[18:11] <+Shujaa> A buddy system might a be really good idea to have instead or as a compliment to that.
[18:11] <+Aramore> was just to RP for a few hours and then leave with nothing lost
[18:11] <+Aramore> but it's turned into a thread where it's got its own complex story
[18:12] <+Shujaa> Well...when I wanted to post in one thread, I want to stay true to what's going on there. So I want to
read everyone else's posts. Like, is there a brawl? Who is actually there, what is happening? etc
[18:13] <+Terin> Yeah.. and that quickly gets confusion with 10 people posting.
[18:13] <+Shujaa> And if the thread is so long I think it's very intimidating
[18:13] <+Khorianas> Mhm. the reading up in the tavern threads is hard.
[18:13] <+Khorianas> But it got revived when we did the night/day change.
[18:13] <Madgod> The buddy system, I think, would be a good idea, but I'm worried about cliques and the like, for some
weird reason. May not be a big deal at all and I'm just being a weird worrysome person.
[18:13] <+Khorianas> perhaps we have to "format" the tavern thread every week or so.
[18:14] <+Aramore> Yeah I agree with that Khor
[18:14] <@Sunshine> giving a personal contact is a good idea i believe
[18:14] <+Shujaa> Well beginner thread are good, but there needs to be some system in place to make it so they don't end
up like the tavern...whether it be recaps in the main post, or new threads starting
[18:14] <@Sunshine> and putting it at the bottom of every one of the 'major' stickies is probably a good idea
[18:14] <@Sunshine> (the ones which are not included in the big list)
[18:15] <@Sunshine> i mean, the bio one and the starting rp one
[18:15] <@Sunshine> or whatever htey were
[18:15] <@Sunshine> just something like "Just a reminder, feel free to contact X, Y, or Z if you have trouble!"
[18:15] <@Sunshine> that should lower the PM burden on madgod
[18:15] <+Khorianas> I would even put them at the START of the stickies. Like "If something of the following confuses
you don't hesitate to ask XYZ,..
[18:16] <+Khorianas> If people give up half way they don't read it.
[18:16] <@Sunshine> either way
[18:16] <+Terin> Its a yes!
[18:17] <Madgod> Well then we should have volunteers for RP Buddies, then.
[18:19] <@Sunshine> seems natural to break it up on type of character (ally/horde/other) or on class type
(spell/melee/etc)
[18:19] <Madgod> Hence why I prefer the wide range of characters thing.
[18:19] <@Sunshine> if you wanted to divide somehow
[18:20] <+Terin> I broke it up on classes personally.
[18:20] <+Terin> Since faction can always be bystanded by going to Dalaran or something of the like.
[18:21] <Madgod> I could do pretty much all of them :P
[18:21] <+Khorianas> WEll if we give them links to our character threads it is pretty obvious who can help you.
[18:21] <+Terin> I don't think we should give links and make themhave a look at our characters.
[18:21] <+Terin> Thats just confusion.
[18:22] <+Khorianas> well it is a lot to read again that's true.
[18:22] <Madgod> Yeah
[18:22] <Madgod> Especially considering I've got... 10-12 bios which are fairly lengthly
[18:22] <+Khorianas> But i would still list the people and perhaps comment on what they know about .
[18:22] <Madgod> I wouldn't expect any newbie to go and read through ALL of them.
[18:22] <+Khorianas> rather than alignments/classes etc.
[18:23] <+Terin> Its just that reading like the way you suggest Khorianas.
[18:23] <+Terin> If Madgod's name is on the top
[18:23] <+Terin> and he can do pretty much everything
[18:23] <+Terin> why would you read on through the list?
[18:23] <Madgod> I can reffer people to others
[18:23] <Madgod> if that has to happen
[18:23] <+Terin> - Its still a lot of unneccesary work.
[18:24] <+Terin> If we can just use the thread to refer people around.
[18:24] <@Sunshine> i like the idea of distributing
[18:24] <+Khorianas> But with what do we discriminate then?
[18:25] <+Terin> Classes gives us a lot of room.
[18:25] <@Sunshine> you can mention that they're welcome to PM someone else if they'd prefer, but this way it makes it
easier both for the new people (because they don't have to try to figure out who to talk to or get sent around
to multiple people) and for the people who get overwhelmed with PMs (madgod) because he won't have to redirect
people
[18:25] <+Khorianas> Classes are inacurate in actual RP. A bloodknight a Sunwalker and a Silver Hand Paladin would fall
in the same register.
[18:25] <@Sunshine> class types or factions
[18:25] <Madgod> general types of characters, we can say.
[18:25] <+Terin> That doesn't mean that the one who's dealing with Paladins doesn't know about the differences.
[18:26] <+Terin> And in case I for instance don't know enough about bloodknights, I could refer him/her to you.
[18:26] <Madgod> If someone has an idea for a class and doesn't know who to go with
[18:26] <Madgod> we can have them PM someone on the list and they'll clarify
[18:26] <Madgod> "Necromancer? Oh, Maddy's good with those guys, mess around with him"
[18:27] <Madgod> "Sunwalker? That's a paladin, so talk with Khor"
[18:27] <+Khorianas> well it will be the best approach maybe but the redistributing will still happen.
[18:27] <Madgod> It'd be less common though
[18:27] <+Terin> its a system we can improve upon, when / if we'll need to.
[18:28] <+Terin> Our first objective should be getting new people around.
[18:29] <+Terin> I'm glad we all got this talk though. I'm sure we'll manage. As for the posts I've already made
schemes to Maddy that I'll help him modify to fit the forums in accordance to what we've talked about tonight.
Notable Differences Between Cataclsym Classic 4.4.0 and Original Cataclysm 4.0.3a
Notable Differences Between Cataclsym Classic 4.4.0 and Original Cataclysm 4.0.3a
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Did Blizzard just hotfix an ilvl requirement onto Awakened LFR?
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