The Legion table - Ion's additional response

[KrazyK923]

You just did it again. See where this is going?

Yup, your complete lack of self-awareness.

Got it.

Keep on pretending I'm somehow being you from the other side of the argument. It's laughable and obviously not true, but you're free to continue to try and do so.

Pretty happy knowing my point has only ever been, "Let's look at what they're actually saying with nuance and not screaming at the top of our lungs at Blizzard."

[Rudol Von Stroheim]

Yup, your complete lack of self-awareness.

Got it.

Boy, you can't stop yourself can you? You want to insult, insult, and insult. I'm starting to think you get off on this.

[KrazyK923]

Boy, you can't stop yourself can you? You want to insult, insult, and insult. I'm starting to think you get off on this.

Oh so now saying somebody have a lack of self-awareness is an insult to you?

Interesting. I mean, it's not, and not even in the realm of MMO-C rules of "insulting," but ok.

Anyhow, I'm done making on this offtopic tangent with you.

[Kryos]

Well this was a clusterfuck of a post. Blizzard mentioned once that they had an idea for something possible. You took it as some sort of blood oath and are butthurt you didn't get it. I'm sorry you feel that way. But guess what? Things change. Just because you didn't get another Gorehowl doesn't mean Blizzard are just tricksters or liars. Thats so immature of a thought process.

So you just tell me, that you feel sorry for me, that I believe that the stuff they plan and want to do will really come true. Ok, I bite. So I'm an idiot to believe in their published plans and ideas.

And NOW we have Ion telling us about the plans and ideas they have for the Class Hall and now I should believe everything he says to become true and ignore the reality on the Alpha server, because that's not final and I should believe in their plans.

Don't you see a contradiction here? You get mad at me for believing in Blizzard in the past and then you get mad at me for not believing in Blizzards ability to turn their plans and ideas into reality.

Make up your mind. I did. I stopped believing about 2 years ago. I just check what I can play and see and what I can play and see. In Alpha ist currently does not look like "3% of legion" but more like an important and central part. If they change that, great. If not, I wouldn't be surprised.

PS: I don't play a melee, I don't care about Gorehowl. But another Legendary apart from the ring type was planned and talked about with several examples.

[Rudol Von Stroheim]

Oh so now saying somebody have a lack of self-awareness is an insult to you?

Interesting.

No, it just falls in line with the same, "You're ignorant, I'm not," mentality you like to parade about with.

[Coffeh]

MMO Poster (circa Vanilla): CLASS QUESTS ARE COOL. BENEDICTION WAS AWESOME...HUNTER BOW QUEST WAS AWESOME.
*Legion will have class quests*
MMO Poster (now): SCREW YOU BLIZZARD AND YOUR SINGLE PLAYER GAME CRAP!

Well played internet...well played!

The pivotal difference here is in vanilla you went and did this stuff. Yeah, I remember the hunter bow quest. It was a bitch solo. But I also remember not yearning to sit around a table and send out followers, wait x amount of time and get a reward. That is not engaging content. And Blizz can say all they want that it's greatly reduced compared to WoD, it constitutes only 3% of your gameplay experience. Blah, blah blah. If you believe a word in blue color text at this point you're a damn fool.

[KrazyK923]

And Blizz can say all they want that it's greatly reduced compared to WoD, it constitutes only 3% of your gameplay experience. Blah, blah blah. If you believe a word in blue color text at this point you're a damn fool.

Once again, here we go.

It doesn't matter what Blizzard says.

[Fkiolaris]

Nothing meaningful should come from the mission table - no story quests, no artifact upgrades, nothing. It should be treated like all optional content which bliz recognizes that many people do not find fun - lock silly things behind it like pets, mount, and toys, maybe xmog stuff. That way no one feels compelled to do it, but it's there as a thing for people who might like it or want foofoo rewards.

That is 100% my POV as well. Pet battles/farm/brawlers ect? Completely optional and nice to have around for people who enjoy these things. Garrisons and this nonsense? Not really.

My biggest issue with Blizzard and WoW right now is that with MoP (yes, MoP) they had a great blueprint of features that they could use to truly offer good variety of MMORPG-centric activities to fit different tastes and playstyles (scenarios, great dailies system like 5.1, many secondary systems that were optional, CMs, descent LFR etc etc). They just needed to re-adjust the relevant reward systems and the difficulty of some of the content (like heroic dungeons), along with the delivery of enough good content in major patches. Instead, they pretty much abandoned everything other than CMs and went full retard with the Facebook game.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

MMO Poster (circa Vanilla): CLASS QUESTS ARE COOL. BENEDICTION WAS AWESOME...HUNTER BOW QUEST WAS AWESOME.
*Legion will have class quests*
MMO Poster (now): SCREW YOU BLIZZARD AND YOUR SINGLE PLAYER GAME CRAP!

Well played internet...well played!

Spat water out, swear to Carl Sagan I did.

[Rudol Von Stroheim]

Once again, here we go.

It doesn't matter what Blizzard says.

Actually, I'd say that's a fair assessment. It doesn't. It's more about what they do at this point.

[KrazyK923]

(scenarios, great dailies system like 5.1, many secondary systems that were optional, CMs, descent LFR etc etc).

Yup, MoP did set a lot of this up.

It's really unfortunate that they listened to the people who complained about it instead of those of us who actually liked it.

- - - Updated - - -

Actually, I'd say that's a fair assessment. It doesn't. It's more about what they do at this point.

Which is why when people like you constantly say they're lying, they should just stop listening to you and your demographic entirely. People who aren't even offering constructive criticism but just toxicity and screaming like children.

[kensim]

The pivotal difference here is in vanilla you went and did this stuff. Yeah, I remember the hunter bow quest. It was a bitch solo. But I also remember not yearning to sit around a table and send out followers, wait x amount of time and get a reward. That is not engaging content. And Blizz can say all they want that it's greatly reduced compared to WoD, it constitutes only 3% of your gameplay experience. Blah, blah blah. If you believe a word in blue color text at this point you're a damn fool.

I didn't believe any blue text, I was sitting in Anaheim at Blizzcon listening to these guys. Say what you will but it is easy to see they love this game. The Order Hall campaign or class quests are not sit around and do nothing...its go out and do stuff...hopefully hard challenging stuff.

[Deleted]

That is 100% my POV as well. Pet battles/farm/brawlers ect? Completely optional and nice to have around for people who enjoy these things. Garrisons and this nonsense? Not really.

My biggest issue with Blizzard and WoW right now is that with MoP (yes, MoP) they had a great blueprint of features that they could use to truly offer good variety of MMORPG-centric activities to fit different tastes and playstyles (scenarios, great dailies system like 5.1, many secondary systems that were optional, CMs, descent LFR etc etc). They just needed to re-adjust the relevant reward systems and the difficulty of some of the content (like heroic dungeons), along with the delivery of enough good content in major patches. Instead, they pretty much abandoned everything other than CMs and went full retard with the Facebook game.

MoP had the most balanced design implemented until today. Blizzard listened to the whiners, removed what was good of MoP and we got WoD.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

I don't think it's about a gowehowl legendary. I think it's about feeling like, time after time, being told one thing and getting another(or lack thereof). They feel like Blizzard talks a big game but tends to under deliver or if they do, it's some sort of mutated monster of what they had stated it'd be. So they're taking this history of missteps in communication and holding it against them post-WoD.

Can you blame them?

Stop calling people children too. Getting sick of that. To me that's no better than going around calling people trolls because they have a difference of opinion. You're on a forum right now, for a video game, spending your valuable time arguing with people about whether or not they should be upset. ...It's called a mirror man. Maybe you should look into one and see what looks back at you.

Sorry mate, but calling Blizzard constant names = acting like a child. Stomping your feet for this reason or another over a video game is childish. Many posters are being childish, and how about instead of complaining to me about it, you could instead try stopping that behavior. Its sad that you're okay with some of these posters, but not TWO posters attempting to ask for objectivity and mature postings.

And yeah I do blame. The quote about Gorehowl is specific in that, nothing was concrete. And this is how jokes like "But did they promise" started... because people see and hear things, take them out of context and get upset and then go to the pitchfork store. Like the whole class accessory thing.. people calling Blizzard liars when they specifically state.... "after WoD" or soemthing to that effect.

[Zcion999]

No, it's not premature. Players have been actively telling Blizzard what the hell is wrong with this trash game for several expansions in a row!!! And Blizzard is always choosing the lazy ergo shitty design approaches that culminated in the most shitty gameplay to be developed in a game that has the audacity to call itself RPG. Blizzard should consider themselves lucky that they have such a vocal and angry playerbase, because people care for WoW like no other game before it, however Blizzard refuses to listen. When it comes to Blizzard - premature reactions are good, because if problems were getting fixed in time we wouldn't have famous phrases like "Expansion X will fix it!".

If they are so lazy and stupid and the game is so shitty, stop paying for it. Just stop playing. When they don't have enough subscribers to keep the game running they will either change their designs or close the game. Its that simple.

Or you know, your subjective opinion might not be as objective as you think and you might not be the target audience. I for one like this game a lot and think Legion looks pretty good.

[Rudol Von Stroheim]

Which is why when people like you constantly say they're lying, they should just stop listening to you and your demographic entirely.

Yet ironically I was one of the people that liked MoP and you just said, Blizzard should've listened to. So which is it?

Difference is, I don't trust anyone coming out to speak on behalf of Blizzard. It's called PR. I'll take it and then generously add salt. I'm not going to argue on behalf of what their PR says. What I will argue on behalf of, is what players say that is actually in the alpha. All I had heard until recently, is that it was quite literally garrisons 2.0 with little difference and potentially key content locked behind it.

[KrazyK923]

I didn't believe any blue text, I was sitting in Anaheim at Blizzcon listening to these guys. Say what you will but it is easy to see they love this game. The Order Hall campaign or class quests are not sit around and do nothing...its go out and do stuff...hopefully hard challenging stuff.

I also think there's something to be said about the missions that have a day cooldown/length is that those missions, at least in this moment, are the major storyline Class campaign ones.

Personally I'm completely fine with them basically transitioning the Garrison Campaign from WoD into the Class Campaign and, instead of not doing it until max level and only one per week, you're slowly doing it over the course of your leveling experience while also not being able to just burn through the entire thing in one day.

It's essentially what Mists of Pandaria did in 5.1. Except instead of just doing a bunch of dailies every day and not knowing what reputation level you unlocked more of the story, you can see it through the new system.

All I had heard until recently, is that it was quite literally garrisons 2.0 with little difference and potentially key content locked behind it.

And you were misled. By a lot of people who get revenue from making outrage videos or websites (like WoWHead) who were simply mistaken, whether it was due to them rushing out the article for clicks or not.

[Rudol Von Stroheim]

Sorry mate, but calling Blizzard constant names = acting like a child. Stomping your feet for this reason or another over a video game is childish. Many posters are being childish, and how about instead of complaining to me about it, you could instead try stopping that behavior. Its sad that you're okay with some of these posters, but not TWO posters attempting to ask for objectivity and mature postings.

And yeah I do blame. The quote about Gorehowl is specific in that, nothing was concrete. And this is how jokes like "But did they promise" started... because people see and hear things, take them out of context and get upset and then go to the pitchfork store. Like the whole class accessory thing.. people calling Blizzard liars when they specifically state.... "after WoD" or soemthing to that effect.

Let me reiterate. You're calling other people childish. While arguing with them on a form. About how they should or shouldn't be angry and how they should or shouldn't express that anger. That's being hypocritical whether you like it or not. First you need to acknowledge your own problems before you can address someone else's.

- - - Updated - - -

And you were misled.

Agreed. I corrected myself but I was still in a tizzy and needed to just get off of here and go cool my head.

Now I'm back with a little bit of a fresh perspective.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

So you just tell me, that you feel sorry for me, that I believe that the stuff they plan and want to do will really come true. Ok, I bite. So I'm an idiot to believe in their published plans and ideas.

And NOW we have Ion telling us about the plans and ideas they have for the Class Hall and now I should believe everything he says to become true and ignore the reality on the Alpha server, because that's not final and I should believe in their plans.

Don't you see a contradiction here? You get mad at me for believing in Blizzard in the past and then you get mad at me for not believing in Blizzards ability to turn their plans and ideas into reality.

Make up your mind. I did. I stopped believing about 2 years ago. I just check what I can play and see and what I can play and see. In Alpha ist currently does not look like "3% of legion" but more like an important and central part. If they change that, great. If not, I wouldn't be surprised.

PS: I don't play a melee, I don't care about Gorehowl. But another Legendary apart from the ring type was planned and talked about with several examples.

Nowhere have I stated that you should 100% believe everything you read. But you're nowhere in the middle of (ALL LIES-----BELIEVE EVERYTHING).

I've not once gotten mad at your for believing Blizzard. But Blizzard also never promised you Gorehowl, for instance. You saw them mention it and then expect it. Do you see the real issue? You have unrealistic expectations. You expect every single idea that Blizzard says they are throwing around to come to fruition.

I've also seen multiple alpha posters state that it isn't a huge part of the core game, and yet we have people here lying, people like you with unrealistic expectations, and others just shouting for no reason.

Again, "talked about" doesn't mean anything.

[Deleted]

Can the people who say "We don't want this" stop it because the mission table wasnt the problem with garrisons. It was the trivialisation of professions and the fact they produced so much gold so people felt subconsciously the need to do them daily to max out there gold what caused massive burn out. Plus the garrison is a focus to all the anger of the fact we got short changed in content patches in wod.

So as you can see a mission table with 6 champions that unfold a unique story to your class that has no impact on other aspect of game play like gear or professions has no reason to take a pleb fit over.

So please can someone tell me why they hate the legion hall mission table in detail so we can actually discuss it and not act like plebs because the wow community has went to knew lows of stupid the last acouple of months.