BREAKING: Military coup in Turkey in progress! Tanks on the street, police disarmed.

[Ulmita]

a nice graphic from bbc:

[Kuntantee]

I don't want to sound too confident, but these are highly likely to be all Cemaatists. They've been organizing/staffing freely in last 15 years. Yesterday, an army attorney said 60% of the army are Gulenists. It was very well known that they've spread so far in juridical and education system, but it was a bit shocking for me in the case of army. So yeah, most likely all Gulenists.

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I appreciate all the insight from you all in Turkey by the way. I hope you understand that I'm not arguing with you all. I just want to understand the situation better. Hope you guys get it sorted out without (my fear) turning into an Erdogani Islamist Dictatorship.

If Erdogan stays Erdogan, there will be a second coup in at most two years. Mark my words. At that point, I am not sure if his devotes would oppose or not. Likely to cause a civil war.

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You posted somewhere around the start of this thread or when the coup was going that they were one of the few places to get a decent education.

Rather amusing that you keep insisting on the bullshit you produced out of thin air, without even checking my post history.

[Reeve]

If Erdogan stays Erdogan, there will be a second coup in at most two years. Mark my words. At that point, I am not sure if his devotes would oppose or not. Likely to cause a civil war.

You don't think he can purge all the opposition from any positions that have the power to conduct a coup?

[Ulmita]

If Erdogan stays Erdogan, there will be a second coup in at most two years. Mark my words. At that point, I am not sure if his devotes would oppose or not. Likely to cause a civil war.

When is his term ending? aka when are the next elections?

[Kuntantee]

You don't think he can purge all the opposition from any positions that have the power to conduct a coup?

Okay, some background.

Islamic movements in Turkey are simply ignorant, uneducated, illiterate. Pick one. Cemaat is an exception. They always educate their man power, because unlike other cults and movements, they have an objective, that is to control the state. So, educated man power is a requirement to achieve their objective. Going back to 2001, AKP is newly elected, they are political manifestation of Islamic movements in Turkey. Although they had liberals among them in 2001, they left rather rapidly in following years. In essence they reflect their roots, they are fucking illiterates. AKP voter base is not solely composed of political Islamists. In fact, most of them are what we call "centre-right" (merkez sag in Turkish), your average nationalists. However, in the eyes of AKP's upper management, there is a difference between centre-rightists and political Islamists. In my opinion, they would only call the political Islamist voters to be "like them", they wouldn't trust any other groups of their voter base. This is precisely why they allied with Cemaat in the first place. The only educated Islamic movement is the Cemaat. They still use their non-Cemaat political Islamist voter base in pretty much every part of the government, but not in intelligence, police, army and juridical system. Why? Because education. AKP let Cemaat organize and staff deep in the government, but they are loyal to Cemaat and not AKP. So, if you remove Cemaat, what you will have is AKP opposition

What about rest of the major educated groups in Turkey? You have Turanist-Nationalists, Kemalists and Kurds (PKK supporters). PKK supporters are out of question, they ain't getting any position. All of them are anti-AKP. So, if AKP is to remove Cemaat from the positions which most requires solid education, their options are limited. They simply do not have man power to fill all positions. In fact, in my opinion, not even close. At the moment things are batshit crazy in here, as I've said earlier, Cemaat has spread so far and so deep that you can't trust anyone. AKP knows it and AKP neither have the luxury nor the actual man power to appoint their devotes.

Cemaat is resourceful and smart. AKP is not. While cooperating with Cemaat, they didn't even created their own infrastructure to educate devotes like Cemaat did. I mean I am not sure but it doesn't look that way. They can fill some low-level governmental positions or even higher positions but not intelligence agency, not army, not higher juridical positions, not higher positions of police, certainly not academia . Also, AKP is a political movement which lacks devotion. Most people see AKP as an opportunity, they do not pursue an ideal. if things go bad, no one, even the people they appointed, will be there to help them.

So, in the army, they will have to do with the people who are not politically aligned with them. They won't perhaps criticize AKP loudly but they will be in those positions regardless. If things keep going terrible, which means the things are suitable for a coup, the army, absent of Cemaat, full with AKP opposers, could conduct a military coup.

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When is his term ending? aka when are the next elections?

2019

/10chars.

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This is no about Constantinople child. This is about your shitty ass society entering a western society who respects things like women, sexual preference, freedom of speech, other's people property, borders, etc. Keep Constantinoupolis, i really don't care. You are not compatible with the western world.

Hell 10 years ago you used to stone people... We talk again in 500 years about you joining EU. Until them suck it, no EU and hell you should be kicked of NATO too.

Ironic when this is coming from a Greek. You think you guys are European? lol... Is that what you tell to yourself before sleep? You are Mediterranean/Aegean/Anatolian(aka Asia Minor), just like Turks. Greek culture is almost identical to Turkish culture, whether you like it or not.

[Deleted]

Good thing I am not in academia these days, I will come to Finland, take your women and use your welfare.

And then get conquered by Russia.

[Slant]

That would be the worst outcome, it will give him absolute power as a result. Wait for emergency laws taking effect.

Called it. He's following the exact pattern.

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When is his term ending? aka when are the next elections?

There's a 50/50 chance his term is ending when he dies now.

[Puupi]

Good thing I am not in academia these days, I will come to Finland, take your women and use your welfare.

Good luck with that.

[Gref]

@Grummgug taken from you/his reply from Venezuela thread. Sums up so well the erdogans %50;

Democracy can only exist if the people are educated. And by educated, we mean able to support themselves without government. Once that is lost, once the people cannot function without government aid, then the government gets huge, corrupt, and stupid because the only way the people know how to better their lives is bigger government. So they keep voting for it. Eventually, it collapses into a dictatorship.

so fucking well said.

the difference is akp keeps using what is accumulated all these years of turkish wealth. what the republic produced. Otherwise we would be fucked already. Although they are incredibly corrupt, we still have the wealth that keeps us going. They couldn't finish hoarding that wealth, selling all state owned enterprises yet.

[Acidbaron]

Rather amusing that you keep insisting on the bullshit you produced out of thin air, without even checking my post history.

I'm fairly certain i remembered something among those lines, not everyone is out to get you and after a raid i really didn't feel like checking a 100 page long thread.

What i find more amusing is you trying to give all this some sort of positive spin and even justify it all, anyway at the end of the day it's your hot mess and we'll see a year from now how much good this purge of what i see of opposition is going to do. I personally think even Putin will become jealous.

[Hooked]

They need to secure all of our weapons away from turkey and kick turkey out of nato. I would honestly rather be friends with russia than with turkey. Turkey is a turnstile for isis coming and going into iraq and syria. That isnt how a nato friend acts to its neighbors or its alliances.

[chrykoolaid]

It's too bad. Mustapha Ataturk really wanted a secular democracy and we can see that the country he founded is really off track on that one.

[Slant]

Yeah, pretty much. This is a textbook example of a democracy transitioning into a dictatorship.

[rogueMatthias]

They need to secure all of our weapons away from turkey and kick turkey out of nato. I would honestly rather be friends with russia than with turkey. Turkey is a turnstile for isis coming and going into iraq and syria. That isnt how a nato friend acts to its neighbors or its alliances.

Yep 100% this. It's inexcusable that they're still even allowed in NATO let alone that they are/were being considered for the EU.

Interesting that Trump in the news today is saying that if he's president, America wouldn't "automatically protect ALL Nato countries..". We all know who he's talking about.

[Darth Primus]

Ironic when this is coming from a Greek. You think you guys are European? lol... Is that what you tell to yourself before sleep? You are Mediterranean/Aegean/Anatolian(aka Asia Minor), just like Turks. Greek culture is almost identical to Turkish culture, whether you like it or not.

Laughed so hard at your turkish hatred speech, I also had to contribute to this post.

Greek culture gave the world things like philosophy, geometry, law and justice, history, Hippocratic Oath, olympic games, tragedy & comedy, democracy (ouch) and even more things that are considered world heritage today.

What did your turkish culture gave to civilization apart from killing, conquering, torturing and genocides? You may fool yourself being proud of being a turk, you will never fool anybody else.

As for your so called "claims" over Greek territories, you will learn to respect international laws concerning good neighborliness between countries, or you will get isolated and treated as a third world muslim country you are.

[Kuntantee]

Laughed so hard at your turkish hatred speech, I also had to contribute to this post.

Greek culture gave the world things like philosophy, geometry, law and justice, history, Hippocratic Oath, olympic games, tragedy & comedy, democracy (ouch) and even more things that are considered world heritage today.

What did your turkish culture gave to civilization apart from killing, conquering, torturing and genocides? You may fool yourself being proud of being a turk, you will never fool anybody else.

As for your so called "claims" over Greek territories, you will learn to respect international laws concerning good neighborliness between countries, or you will get isolated and treated as a third world muslim country you are.

Woa, someone took it personal got offended. Poor Greeks, they don't even know who they are and what their culture is . No one is there there to back you up. This was evident in Cyprus. Watch your moves if you do not want to lose more soil.

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Good luck with that.

I just refused a position from some University in Finland. It's easier for me to get around

[Acidbaron]

Don't forget the greek cuisine what clearly turks just copied over.

[Kuntantee]

What i find more amusing is you trying to give all this some sort of positive spin and even justify it all, anyway at the end of the day it's your hot mess and we'll see a year from now how much good this purge of what i see of opposition is going to do. I personally think even Putin will become jealous.

You are still hallucinating. I never said this is all good. It is likely for Erdogan to exploit this situation. However, several governmental institutions were known to be filled with Cemaat. Education is one of them, which is why I said the initial purge is targetting Cemaat. I am sure I've repeated that I can't speak for other suspensions several times.

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Don't forget the greek cuisine what clearly turks just copied over.

This will surely enrage me .

[Darth Primus]

Woa, someone took it personal got offended. Poor Greeks, they don't even know who they are and what their culture is . No one is there there to back you up. This was evident in Cyprus. Watch your moves if you do not want to lose more soil.

Is this the best you can come up with and reply to my argument ???

Two words for you mr butthurt: Grow up

[Kuntantee]

Is this the best you can come up with and reply to my argument ???

Two words for you mr butthurt: Grow up

Your arguments? That post involved arguments? I must be so stupid that I missed.