[7.2] Legion Shadow Priest Guide and Discussion

[Apero]

I hope not, would be silly otherwise. Might have just been a bug?

Also I felt like an idiot last night, Xavius heroic hit 97% right as we popped lust, thought I was in the dream so went Ham, died about 95s later and was like wtf? Yup, wasn't in the dream. Oops.

Mage Mate said some of his stuff did not reset as well, guess its a bug. Damn it, would have been a decent try..

[Djriff]

ahahahahha look at this guy who would do that hahaha I totally didn't do that on one of our first tries hahaha definitly wasn't my fault that the boss killed the raid at 2% that I could've taken out of him had I been alive, cause that definitely didn't happen ahahahahah T_T

Happens to all of us mate.

So I FINALLY got my Chrono Shard. I had the Strand of Stars neck piece forever but I realized something: the chrono shard, 840, alone would put me at beyond 13k haste(the soft cap was 12k I think?) so it seems to be that using both neck and CS together would be kind of overkill.

Then it hit me: I also have Prydaz. The question is: should I toss my 1.2k haste/640 crit neck for Prydaz when using Chrono Shard(that places me at ~41% haste w/ proc), should I use Strand of Stars(which would place me even higher on the proc, but I lose a lot of crit/mastery from the 895 neck) or should I keep using my haste/crit neck(which was my choice over Prydaz before chrono shard).

I really hate to say this, but I wouldn't advise chrono shard for StM. The haste is nice but you can't rely on it to push you farther in Voidform. If it procs at the right time it's amazing, if not it's less so unfortunately. Also don't worry about procs like that pushing you over the BP, it's not the end of the world to have more haste.

Mage Mate said some of his stuff did not reset as well, guess its a bug. Damn it, would have been a decent try..

I'll ask around later to some friends to see if this is a thing still.

- - - Updated - - -
@MissAnonymous

Got a chance to look through your logs. Biggest problem I see is that you're popping StM too late or dying to it too early.

Taking Xavius as an example, you popped PI 25 stacks when you can easily save it until like 70 without having to hit SW: D. During your last voidform of that fight you popped PI while at 33 stacks, which is much to early again.

Just looking at the rest of your pulls Dragons seems to be your highest StM voidform at 86 stacks. You died to lack of Insanity generation as you popped PI at 55 stacks which is too early. Ideally you want to cast it as late as possible into StM Voidform to extend the longevity of it and hopefully get to that 3rd Vtor.

Hopefully that helps. You can practice StM in your garrison or at your factions capital (Stormwind/Org) pvp dummies.

[MissAnonymous]

Thanks for the analysis, Djrff. I guess I just need to learn to trust that I'll be able to stay in StM long enough to pop PI late. I usually pop it early 'cause I panic? I guess? I dunno. I need more practice, I think.

Alright, I think some of my distrust of how long I'll be able to stay in StM is due to my inconsistency on how long I can stay in Voidform. Against a training dummy with no haste food or buffs, I have very different lengths of time I can stay in Voidform outside of StM --

With Void Torrent: 24-27 stacks.

Without Void Torrent (I can't seem to make it where I get one every Voidform): 18-20 stacks.

With PI: 30-33 stacks.

The difference makes it hard to guess what my personal average is and when the best time is to do... well, anything, based on my haste. And this is without having to move at all. Also seems like I may be doing something wrong with my rotation in general. Just against a target dummy while standing still, I wasn't able to reach 70 stacks of Voidform without SW or PI. My FPS is 100 and MS is 48, which makes me think it is a rotation error if not due to my lack of haste.

EDIT:

Using Dispersion at about 58 stacks to allow my Void Torrent more time to come off cd allowed me to get to 70 stacks where I was able to pop PI, but even then I was only able to get to about 90 stacks of Voidform before I died. More practice/testing required, I think.

[FrothyMug]

90 is a good StM, especially when you're just starting to use it. I get really jittery when in StM and my heart rate goes way up as I get past 50-60 stacks. It will just take practice and familiarity to get super high voidform stacks.

I just moved from Arlington last summer. How's the weather?

[MissAnonymous]

90 is a good StM, especially when you're just starting to use it. I get really jittery when in StM and my heart rate goes way up as I get past 50-60 stacks. It will just take practice and familiarity to get super high voidform stacks.

I just moved from Arlington last summer. How's the weather?

Bipolar. As always.

And 90 isn't bad with just standing there pew pewing away, I guess, but it's a lot harder in practice. And I know one of the other Spriests in my raid team is able to maintain 100 for a while, and so it's hard not to compare.

We started progressing on Mythic Nythendra tonight, and... I was just god awful. So bad I've offered to sit on Sunday if need be. Consistently bottom of the dps charts, one pull even doing as little as 140k dps (*gag*), just ugh. I do not do well when I am struggling with a class. I just need to get this down.

[elsus]

With the nerf to dispersion is it still possible to reach the 3rd torrent consistently? I'm sitting at 11.5 k haste and am still yet to reach it. My logs dps wise are strong, but I can't go that far past 100 stacks.

[Vampiregenesis]

How do you use stm? i guess you use it during execute phase but what is the perfect moment use it? outside of voidform? anytime? inside voidform? when?

[dmfg]

On the subject of key binds - I use:
1 MF
2 VT
3 MB
4 SWP
5 VErup
6 SWD
Q VEmbrace
E PWS
R VTor
T mind bomb

Alt 1 SF
Alt 2 class neck
Alt 3 dispersion
Alt 4 STM

Shift 1 grounded plasma shield
Shift 2 SM
Shift 3 silence
Shift 4 dispel
Shift 5 mass dispel

I have A and D as strafe, but I also use mouse run a lot (both mouse buttons together). I find that makes it a lot easier to time movement with instants for stutter stepping.

[Jullyx]

How do you use stm? i guess you use it during execute phase but what is the perfect moment use it? outside of voidform? anytime? inside voidform? when?

When you exit your last voidform before StM. i.e, when there is approximately 2 minutes left of the fight and you have 0 insanity.

[l33t]

On the subject of key binds - I use:

Shift+5 is not a very good to use keybind, and you should use tilde (`) AKA the button before 1 as well. Shift+q, shift+e, shift+r and alt+e are also a very comfortable keybinds.

[dmfg]

Shift+5 is not a very good to use keybind, and you should use tilde (`) AKA the button before 1 as well. Shift+q, shift+e, shift+r and alt+e are also a very comfortable keybinds.

Unless you have injected a neutral parasite into my brain, I don't think you know which keybinds I find more comfortable than others.

I actually use ' for mind sear, forgot to mention as I don't really press it.

[Tharid]

Unless you have injected a neutral parasite into my brain, I don't think you know which keybinds I find more comfortable than others.

No, he knows. He knows everything. Him and davesignal have formed a symbiotic MMOC alliance where everything they state has to be true, most prominent that Shadow was, is and will forever be doomed. If those guys would invest as much time in playing Shadow as they are in trying to make the Priest forum a depressive circlejerk, they could actually become so decent that they'd be able to talk about the spec on a high level.

Nothing personal, but this has been on my mind since I started lurking the thread three months ago. It's actually terrifying how many people try really hard to keep a negative mindset about Shadow here, even if the spec is in the best spot since FOREVER.

It's okay to not like something like S2M or incorrect patch notes. But please don't try to suck every last bit of possible drawbacks of Shadow out of it just to publicly take a glorious bath in the "badness that is Shadow" and everything around it. It makes the community a worse place.

Sorry for the rant.

[l33t]

No, he knows. He knows everything. Him and davesignal have formed a symbiotic MMOC alliance where everything they state has to be true, most prominent that Shadow was, is and will forever be doomed. If those guys would invest as much time in playing Shadow as they are in trying to make the Priest forum a depressive circlejerk, they could actually become so decent that they'd be able to talk about the spec on a high level.

Nothing personal, but this has been on my mind since I started lurking the thread three months ago. It's actually terrifying how many people try really hard to keep a negative mindset about Shadow here, even if the spec is in the best spot since FOREVER.

It's okay to not like something like S2M or incorrect patch notes. But please don't try to suck every last bit of possible drawbacks of Shadow out of it just to publicly take a glorious bath in the "badness that is Shadow" and everything around it. It makes the community a worse place.

Sorry for the rant.

What?

I guess, Insanity is high in this one? Sharing keybindings info can be a depressing circlejerk? Dude, you really should go and have a rest.

Also, instead of reportable personal attacks and flaming, use your ignore list. Saves you from looking like an idiot on occasions like this one.

[kalaratic]

With the nerf to dispersion is it still possible to reach the 3rd torrent consistently? I'm sitting at 11.5 k haste and am still yet to reach it. My logs dps wise are strong, but I can't go that far past 100 stacks.

ya you can still hit it. even though you don't get stacks anymore in voidform it still buys you 12 seconds for void torrent to come off cd

[Djriff]

Thanks for the analysis, Djrff. I guess I just need to learn to trust that I'll be able to stay in StM long enough to pop PI late. I usually pop it early 'cause I panic? I guess? I dunno. I need more practice, I think.

I've found that following the 4P P's can literally apply to anything.

Practice, Patience, Perseverance, Pays Off.

Just keep at it and you'll get it.

Alright, I think some of my distrust of how long I'll be able to stay in StM is due to my inconsistency on how long I can stay in Voidform. Against a training dummy with no haste food or buffs, I have very different lengths of time I can stay in Voidform outside of StM --

With Void Torrent: 24-27 stacks.

Without Void Torrent (I can't seem to make it where I get one every Voidform): 18-20 stacks.

With PI: 30-33 stacks.

The difference makes it hard to guess what my personal average is and when the best time is to do... well, anything, based on my haste. And this is without having to move at all. Also seems like I may be doing something wrong with my rotation in general. Just against a target dummy while standing still, I wasn't able to reach 70 stacks of Voidform without SW or PI. My FPS is 100 and MS is 48, which makes me think it is a rotation error if not due to my lack of haste.

Your personal average in non StM voidform won't have a huge impact on your StM one since that one you know will be X seconds long because you've practiced it, if that makes sense.

As for averages this is my plan for Mythic Ursoc that I was executing every pull last night.

Pre Pull:
Pop neck before combat, maintain insanity with sear.

On Pull:
Pre Cast MB immediately cast PI then dots + Fiend and hurry into VF, usually takes about 8 seconds.
I have to refresh SW: P before I can cast VB so I do that, VB, then Vtor.

Normal priority rotation

Use my next Vtor as it comes off CD and pop PI right when it comes of CD.

My next vtor will be for my StM voidform which is the around the 2.5m mark in combat.

Once I exit my 2nd to last Voidform, I pop StM to hurry back into VF, get MB, Flay, VB, Vtor, VB/Dispersion if I don't need to refresh my dots just yet, andthen normal rotation. Boss is sitting around 45% at this time. I can maintain my insanity without having to use SW: D until around 70 stacks, at which point I'm already past my 2nd torrent and I pop PI at 82 stacks. at 102s into Voidform I pop Dispersion again in place of a flay when I have both charges of SW: D on CD. That buys me just enough time to squeeze out the last Vtor then I'll fall over dead.

It helps that we kept wiping repeatedly that I was able to basically commit that to muscle memory and I had some viewers in the stream keeping track of things like hey you can squeeze a 3rd PI here, etc etc.

You can do all of that planning via log analysis of past fights to get average kill times.

Using Dispersion at about 58 stacks to allow my Void Torrent more time to come off cd allowed me to get to 70 stacks where I was able to pop PI, but even then I was only able to get to about 90 stacks of Voidform before I died. More practice/testing required, I think.

You want to disperse after your 2nd VB (the one after Vtor) so that you'll have dispersion later on in the fight to hit 3rd Vtor.

With the nerf to dispersion is it still possible to reach the 3rd torrent consistently? I'm sitting at 11.5 k haste and am still yet to reach it. My logs dps wise are strong, but I can't go that far past 100 stacks.

Yes, even though you don't gain stacks, you still gain 6 seconds on Vtor CD with 0 drain.

How do you use stm? i guess you use it during execute phase but what is the perfect moment use it? outside of voidform? anytime? inside voidform? when?

Roughly 125s from the boss dying. Depends on your raid DPS and I use a WA to tell me roughly when combat will end. You have to subtract about 10-15s depending on your gear as your DPS will skyrocket and that influences the time to die.

We started progressing on Mythic Nythendra tonight, and... I was just god awful. So bad I've offered to sit on Sunday if need be. Consistently bottom of the dps charts, one pull even doing as little as 140k dps (*gag*), just ugh. I do not do well when I am struggling with a class. I just need to get this down.

Are you guys hitting execute? If not don't worry about it you can make it up in StM. 140k does sound low outside of StM, I was maintaining around 260k on Ursoc, but I have an add to pad ToF on as well. I'll have to double check what I was doing on Nyth before MC killed me mid StM.

[dmfg]

Djriff, do you have to PWS at all on Ursoc? I have 2.14 mill hp and I'm super close to getting one shot by the charges through ranged (happened a lot on progress), but if I PWS I fall behind on insanity.

Likewise, do you dot the last ghost bear? Again I feel like I can't afford the lost insanity.

[Djriff]

RL required us to use Vantus runes so that helped. I used PW: S a lot earlier in the fight, but outside of that no. We're using rallying cry and other raid wide damage reduction CD's to survive it. I had to swap out my 820 ring to an 850 one with a bit more stam to help out as well, but dead DPS = no dps.

Also at that point if you have to make a choice between Insanity generation and PW: S and casting PW: S would kill you, you would die anyways so it's a moot decision. That's how I explained it to one of the officers at least.

[siq]

Hey guys

I have 34% haste and 24% crit i use for raiding
I can swap gear pieces to get 34% crit & 25% haste staying with the same ilvl

Which of the two is better for mythic+ when not running surrender to madness ? should i just stick with haste or crit becomes much better with LotV?

[Djriff]

I would use the crit heavy set in Mythic +, you'll probably see more DPS. Someone in the Priest Discord last night was saying that they do 500k on trash with a crit heavy set, so some people are seeing good results.

[siq]

I would use the crit heavy set in Mythic +, you'll probably see more DPS. Someone in the Priest Discord last night was saying that they do 500k on trash with a crit heavy set, so some people are seeing good results.

Thanks. gonna try this.
You think i should go even higher crit? can replace 850 Swarming Plaguehive for 840 int/crit trink or with 865 Wriggling Sinew for 37% crit 22% haste