[Ret] Fix my DPS!

[Ellarielle]

Please help me. I'm in the bottom 10% for my item level and I'm really not sure what I'm doing differently on some fights vs. on others.

Logs from our most recent raid:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...e-done&fight=1
http://www.checkmywow.com/reports/X1C4myNnbvzjtYAa

Armory:
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...Anida/advanced

Thank you! Feeling pretty down on myself atm

[Kivross]

Thanks Nition. I guess the next question would be what do you guys use to sim? or where? I'm new to this whole dps and (pally) thing lol

A lot of us use SimulationCraft. Ask Mr. Robot has one but SimCraft is more accurate. Go to www.simulationcraft.org and download the proper client. They have instructions on how to use it, or you can check out some youtube videos. I would also recommend downloading the simulationcraft addon so you can import accurate data directly from your character instead of relying on the Armory.

[Ellarielle]

A lot of us use SimulationCraft. Ask Mr. Robot has one but SimCraft is more accurate. Go to www.simulationcraft.org and download the proper client. They have instructions on how to use it, or you can check out some youtube videos. I would also recommend downloading the simulationcraft addon so you can import accurate data directly from your character instead of relying on the Armory.

Thank you!

[Dhrykna]

Hi all,

I've recently switched to DPS from tank and looking for some advice on how to improve.

Logs: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/ranking.../783087/latest

Armory: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...Zarayna/simple

Stats:
Strength 31,817
Crit 22%
Haste 20%
Mastery 30%
Versatility 7%

Thanks

[Zoopercat]

@Kivross @Anida Hey wanted to jump in. I'm from AMR and have spent the past couple of weeks comparing our sim outputs to actual logs. I just did ret pallies a couple of days ago and it's spot on when comparing to top players. The spell data matches and so does the rotation. For example, the number of uses for each spell is within 0.5 to 1 use when looking at krosus logs. Now that is pretty accurate!

One thing to note: when comparing to logs, the buff 'retribution' from when a fellow player dies will increase the DPS on logs over the sims. I calculated that out to make sure our sims are matching, as if that wasn't present. We don't have that buff simulated right now since you don't know when or how often you would get it in a raid. Anyway, worth pointing out.

[Ellarielle]

@Kivross @Anida Hey wanted to jump in. I'm from AMR and have spent the past couple of weeks comparing our sim outputs to actual logs. I just did ret pallies a couple of days ago and it's spot on when comparing to top players. The spell data matches and so does the rotation. For example, the number of uses for each spell is within 0.5 to 1 use when looking at krosus logs. Now that is pretty accurate!

One thing to note: when comparing to logs, the buff 'retribution' from when a fellow player dies will increase the DPS on logs over the sims. I calculated that out to make sure our sims are matching, as if that wasn't present. We don't have that buff simulated right now since you don't know when or how often you would get it in a raid. Anyway, worth pointing out.

Thanks. My main question is how do I figure out what I'm doing wrong. I'm 50 to 60k too low according to ask Mr robot

[Zoopercat]

I'm not a ret pally expert. But what I like to do is setup a sim to match the log (Ursoc is good since we have that boss script). Match all gear, the artifact weapon, talents, and the length of the fight. I did that, here are the reports:

AMR Sim: http://www.askmrrobot.com/wow/simula...d24264ecca58a7
WCL Log: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ght=2&source=5

What I see are a handful of things:

1. You should do about 30% more crusader strikes, you got 24 and the sim got 36.
2. Once you generate more holy power from those extra crusader strikes, you can use more Templar's Verdicts. We have 63, you used it 47 times (take the 94 in your report and divide by 2. One of them is the echo, so it is double counted, as it's the same spell ID in logs).

Right there, those 2 things would really increase your damage.

The other thing I saw, our sim is using 2 potions of prolonged power (because 1 is a pre-pot). That probably accounts for about 8k DPS. I based that off doing a sim with no potions, which was about 15k less. So half of that is how much you'd lose with 1 potion (rough napkin math on that, of course).

[Ellarielle]

@Zoopercat thank you. I'll try to figure out if I can get those in more. I "feel" like I'm doing them as much as I can but I'm obviously not according to the numbers.

- - - Updated - - -

Thanks again Zoopercat. That seems to be my biggest problem I did better last night trying to keep my crussader strike on cooldown. Appreciate the help!

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...3&difficulty=0

[Deleted]

Hey,

I have a guildie who seems to be struggling with ret dps... please can you guys have a look at his logs and let me know if there's anything he can do to brush up?

Name is Pugnatôr on Khadgar/Bloodhoof

warcraftlogs.com/reports/rtBTkHxadwpA7WqG#type=damage-done&source=48

Thanks in advance

[Saskov]

Hey guys,
After Crusade/Secondary Stats nerfs my performance is on a constantly fall of production. I really tried other ways to improve it, like sim myself but having trouble with that to since I'm not familiar to SimCraft.
To begin with, here is my Armory
Here is a log of Ursoc myt
I really don't know what path follow to improve my damage output. About rotations, usually I always keep with Divine Hammer and Zeal to gather as much HP as I can and always try to use TV or DS when Judgment debuff is active.

[crumbler81]

Hey guys,

I'm looking for help improving my DPS so I can join my guild in progressing through Heroic Nighthold. I looked at my warcraftlogs for last night's fight against Star Augur and I showed improvement from previous raids, but still very low on the percentile meter. This is my first experience as a melee DPS in raids, and my first Star Augur fight so that may be some of the causes of my low DPS.

I have been improving my gear over the last few weeks, and I'm at the point now that I think I need to work on my skill more than anything. I currently use TMW to help with my rotation, and I plan on running some sims to see if Zeal or Fires of Justice are better talents for me. I'm thinking maybe I just need to practice my rotation until it becomes like muscle memory, but any advice you guys can give would be greatly appreciated!

I can't provide logs or armory link at the moment since this is my first post, but the logs are showing me in the 10th percentile and at my current gear level I should be in the 30th - 50th percentile.

[Kragorr]

Hello guys,

We currently have a trialist in our guild who just can't seem to keep up with the rest of the group damagewise, i was hoping i could get some helping hands to look through the logs and see if there is anything we can do to help him improve, thanks in advance.

His name is Eldruín - Outland.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...2&difficulty=0

[Deleted]

Hello guys,

We currently have a trialist in our guild who just can't seem to keep up with the rest of the group damagewise, i was hoping i could get some helping hands to look through the logs and see if there is anything we can do to help him improve, thanks in advance.

His name is Eldruín - Outland.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...2&difficulty=0

Going to only check Krosus, as its a single target fight, which makes its easy to see whats going on.

Gear:
No setbonuses. Be it Tier or Suramar sets. Quite a big jump in dps
From armory: Might of Krosus trinket is pretty meh. (for a general idea of trinket value: http://thesilverhand.net/all/trinket-analysis/)
Relatively high mastery and low versatility.
His artifact level is 38. To me, this is really low. But I don't know how "hardcore" your guild is, and what you require of him.

I imagine its just the way geardrops end up being, but it could use some work.

Talents:
He used FV/Zeal/BoW combination on Krosus, I see he changed to FV/TFoJ/BoW on armory.
I quickly simmed his talent combinations with his character, which ended up looking like this on single target:


As ES is a single target only ability, I suggest only using this on fights like Trilliax, Krosus, and Starboss. Take that as you will.
To help with when to use ES, Sholdice (from discord) made a very useful WeakAura to decide when to use ES: https://wago.io/N1MDro48f

Logs:
He delayed his 2nd Crusade by so much, that he couldnt get off a 3rd one. Crusade is basically all of rets dps. He missed a full use. (https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ability=231895)

Only 1 potion use, and it wasn't even an old war potion: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ability=229206

His opener is arguable (Currently he gets to 3 Holy Power, then crusades, and then Judgments). People tend the have different opinions on this one, but I suggest opening with pre-judgment > wake of ashes > Crusade+TV > BoW > TV > Get to 15 stacks of Crusade ASAP > Regular rotation.

He has quite a bit of downtime (47s to 58s, 64s to 77s, 89s to 96s, 153s to 161s, etc.) on the boss, probably to soak the puddles with the adds. If at all possible, he should soak in melee. Probably also while smashing the bridge. Downtime is detrimental for ret (and probably every other class).(https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...&view=timeline)

I also feel like he wasted a lot of uptime during crusade? I cant tell for sure. His crusade peak damage seems really low. For comparison:
This is your krosus fight. He peaks at like 800k in his opener, and then barely gets above 600k in his 2nd crusade (at around 2:30):


This is my krosus fight (albeit im better geared, and probably more high-end. But its just about showing you the peak crusade should have):


I also feel like he has a very low amount of Holy Power generators used, which causes less TVs used, which is rets main damage dealing ability.
As a comparison, he only used Blade of Justice 39 times in a 4:43 fight, and I used Blade of Justice 44 times in a 4:05 fight (which means I generated 10 more Holy Power in a 40s shorter fight, with just this ability:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...rce=12&fight=6
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...done&source=23

As I used TFoJ, and he used Zeal, Im not going to compare those two. But I imagine it has the same issue.

Minmaxing:
He only used Shield of Vengeance once in the whole fight, and probably as a defensive CD. I suggest using it as an offensive ability, using it every single time on cooldown IF he can proc it from any source of damage as well. Its quite a lot of damage.




I currently don't have time to watch other fights. I hope this helps, and gl with the trial.

[Kragorr]

Thanks alot Zyphenz, for your in-depth response.

[Deleted]

Hi guys, this afternoon i did some m+ with Divine Hammer + CoF and i noticed that with this talent, CoF proc a lot more instead using Blade of wrath. It's possible that each attack of divine hammer is considered a single attack for CoF proc? Thanks ^^

[Almondknight]

Hi all,

Long time lurker here.

Recently switched new ret pally here, just looking for some constructive criticism / feedback as I've really not pulling the numbers I'd like to, yet my CPM, ability usage and uptimes seem in-line with other higher parses rets. The biggest difference I notice is my abilities (on average) are sitting significantly less. I've been around an 885 ilevel for the past week, so 3 logs chronologically from 5 days ago to today are below (along with armory link):

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...2&difficulty=0
NH N with guild. Not full clear, but contains Krosus.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...2&difficulty=0
Pug NH H - 1st 3 bosses and Krosus attempts

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...2&difficulty=0
Pug NH H - Krosus attempts and kill

The trinkets I use are 890 Claw (got on the NH H pug), 865 Faulty on ST, and 865 Eye (no chest) on cleave (Scorp, Bot) as per the rankings on the trinket thread that floats around here. I do not have the belt, but do have the back and ring. No tier pieces regrettably as my guild is very heavy on that token so I've let them go to stronger DPS.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...light/advanced
Stats: 24.16%, 28.94% haste, 3.85% vers, 26.94% mastery
Artifact: Rank 35 (I know, but I started this toon on December 29, 2016)
Relics: 870 Holy - DS dmg; 885 Fire - DS dmg; 875 Holy, Judgement dmg - not much luck on AW duration relics yet.

Thanks in advance!

[Deleted]

I'm going to take a look later in the afternoon, but comparing your Krosus N to my Krosus N (https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...pe=damage-done, I am "Myzerino")kill, even though yours took 2min longer, the time difference shouldn't account for the DPS difference, considering my gear is mediocre at best compared to you.

One thing I notice is that you delayed your 2nd Crusade by about 30 seconds, causing you to lose out on roughly 16-20 seconds of your potential 3rd Crusade near the end. I'm not exactly sure why you delayed it.

Other things I noticed:
- You didn't use potions. Maybe intentional to skip them in Normal, but considering you did use a Flask (and I didn't), it's a bit weird not to use potions then.
- No Shield of Vengeance. On a lot of fights (especially Krosus) you can reliably use it as extra damage.
- You wasted 5 Holy Power compared to my 1. You used Wake of Ashes 4 times at 1HP. Considering you don't have 4p bonus, you should be able to reliably not waste holy power through Wake. I made a similar "mistake" once, but on the final 5 seconds of Heroism when I wanted to fit in 1 extra Ashes to Dust debuff, which is most likely a DPS gain (unsubstantiated).
- You've cast TV 3 times outside of Judgment window compared to my 1.

Outside of the Wake of Ashes debuff, Crusade and potion usage, my abilities hit for the following average amounts compared to yours (and you have the cloak, which I'm not going to filter out). Your damage first:
- TV 611.3k / 723.8k
- CS 132.4k / 166.9k
- BoJ 233.3k / 292.2k

For CS and BoJ you deal 20% less damage than I do and for TV 15.5%. All while you have better trinkets, better legendaries and an identical artifact weapon. I do have 4p though. I don't know my relics by heart (and I'm not at home now), I think I have 1 TV and 2 AW relics.

[Almondknight]

Thanks for the input Myz!

- The delay of Crusader would be a mistake; so thank you for pointing that out as I'll need to work on ensuring it happens at the right time.
- I know I waste some HP because of the ring. I will often TV during Crusade down to 0, then Wake, which lines up with the 4s of the ring's 1HP. However that would not account for 5 HP, but rather 2-3 at most. I'll have to be careful in managing my resources more closely
- Could you please point out how you track TV's outside of Judgment window? I've looked through the logs Debuffs, Casts, etc., and can't seem to find how to combine TV casts with Judgment debuff on boss. I recognize that number should always be 0, so thank you for pointing that out!

I am at a bit of a loss as to how my abilities could hit for 20% less. Again I do not have the belt, so obviously I do not spike the same as a ret with the belt during Crusade, but is there anything you could see that I am doing wrong? I'm not okay with pulling 25-40th percentile for my ilevel at all.

Thanks again for your feedback already! Any other input is appreciated.

[Deleted]

Thanks for the input Myz!

- The delay of Crusader would be a mistake; so thank you for pointing that out as I'll need to work on ensuring it happens at the right time.
- I know I waste some HP because of the ring. I will often TV during Crusade down to 0, then Wake, which lines up with the 4s of the ring's 1HP. However that would not account for 5 HP, but rather 2-3 at most. I'll have to be careful in managing my resources more closely
- Could you please point out how you track TV's outside of Judgment window? I've looked through the logs Debuffs, Casts, etc., and can't seem to find how to combine TV casts with Judgment debuff on boss. I recognize that number should always be 0, so thank you for pointing that out!

I am at a bit of a loss as to how my abilities could hit for 20% less. Again I do not have the belt, so obviously I do not spike the same as a ret with the belt during Crusade, but is there anything you could see that I am doing wrong? I'm not okay with pulling 25-40th percentile for my ilevel at all.

Thanks again for your feedback already! Any other input is appreciated.

You go to casts and plot your Holy Power spenders on the main graph first. Then you sort enemies their debuffs by you as the source and enable it on the graph as well. By clicking on the "Graph: Separate" text you can add them both to the main graph (containing your DPS curve most likely if you're looking at that) and see where the TV/DS lines fall outside of the Judgment areas.

[bigred]

So I am very reluctant to post logs, but here goes. I know I'm not great, I know there is a ton of room to improve... be gentle... haha, I know the internet can be brutal. Anyway, I'm not even sure I'm posting logs right, but we will see. Throwsbigrok is my character. Our raid over all needs help dps wise, we are working on it. This is H Trilliax... one of my better I think.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...nkings&fight=2