Page 1 of 4
1
2
3
... LastLast
  1. #1
    Deleted

    Der Spiegel: Democracy at the Tipping point

    Der Spiegel, a german news magazine (one of the most popular) posted this article recently.

    Please allow me to share it with this forum audience, i will add a comment at the end:

    Quote Originally Posted by Der Spiegel, Democracy at the Tipping point

    Ultimately, indifference is deadly. The apathy. The feeling of impotence. And the idle silence that follows. People, including journalists, start thinking they can't do anything anyway. That proved to be the case in Turkey and Hungary and it has long been the situation in Russia and China as well. Will it also happen in the United States?


    When democracy begins to erode, it seldom happens very quickly. Looking back, one can often determine the moment in which it became serious -- usually it was an election. How could Turkey have elected Erdogan, Russia Putin, Hungary Orbán and how could America have chosen Donald Trump with a clear conscience? When political discourse leads to a situation in which the discourse itself is replaced by demagogy, and when that demagogue is brought to power through a democratic process, then it's possible that democracy itself will be replaced by autocracy.

    Everything else then happens slowly. Meanwhile, some media continue day-dreaming and thus become even more obsessive about labeling any person warning against the threat as hysterical.

    So there we have it: Donald Trump, a misogynist and a racist businessman who verifiably made 87 false statements in the course of only five days of the election campaign, is no longer a candidate. He's sitting in the White House. Here are three insights about this American president who has been in office since Jan. 20.

    First, in the two-and-a-half weeks since his awful inauguration speech, he has demonstrated that he will do what he said he would: He is ordering the construction of a wall on the border to Mexico, he is issuing xenophobic decrees and he is rattling America's allies and international institutions and, by doing so, every aspect of global politics. He has already threatened Iran and North Korea. None of this comes as a surprise either, because even Trump's voters knew that adviser Stephen Bannon is a man who considers wars to be useful.

    Second, Trump is also showing that he will do much that he did not announce in the campaign. He has ordered scientists not to conduct or publish research on topics of which he does not approve. He says climate change doesn't exist and means it seriously. He stood by as one of his closest confidants invented the term "alternative facts" to create a parallel reality. Trump brings his children with him to high-level meetings, he hired his son-in-law as a White House adviser, he has spared countries in which he does business from his travel ban on citizens of predominately Muslim states, he has not divested himself of his company holdings, he has not released his tax filings (despite pledging to do so) and even had his adviser Kellyanne Conway claim that voters didn't care. He now wants to undo banking regulations so that "friends of mine" can get easier access to money. Is he paving the way to cash in and further enrich himself while in office?

    Third, Trump has already proven some of the things we already knew about him. The perception people have of him is more important to Trump than anything else. Nothing was more important to him in his first two and a half weeks in office than the size of the crowd at his inauguration. Trump is a chronic liar and he proves this in one tweet after the other. Trump despises the media (he calls it the "opposition party" and says "As you know, I have a running war with the media") as well as the judicial branch in the form of "this so-called judge" who didn't rule the way that his ruler desired. Meanwhile, Trump claims the people protesting against him are "paid."

    It is not at all absurd to assume that, if resistance doesn't mount, this will continue.

    Fewer and fewer people are attending protests because, slowly, people are losing interest and a sense of powerlessness is setting in. The media will turn to softer and more entertaining issues because they cause less trouble. Politicians who had at first sworn their resistance will notice that life is easier if they submit. Companies will also obtain contracts when they submit. Many people will become rich and rise in society when they submit. And if they don't do it, they will watch as others do. That's how autocracies form -- "not by diktat and violence," David Frum wrote in The Atlantic magazine, but through "the slow, demoralizing process of corruption and deceit."

    At DER SPIEGEL, we first warned against Trump in a cover story at the beginning of 2016. We followed it up with another cover story, "Five Minutes to Trump," seven weeks before the election. We do make mistakes, but underestimating Donald Trump wasn't one of them. On Saturday, we published a cover story illustrated with a caricature drawn by Edel Rodriguez, a Cuban immigrant who lives in New Jersey. The image shows a screaming man without eyes or a nose, but easily discernable as Trump, holding the decapitated head of the Statue of Liberty in one hand and a bloody sword in the other. "America First," it states -- there is nothing more to see or read -- anything else, as with all art, is a matter of interpretation.

    "Stunning," wrote the Washington Post. The political magazine Mother Jones described it as "one helluva statement." Demonstrators also used the cover image on posters at protests on the streets of cities across America. "The spectacular cover image is making the rounds here in the U.S. and people are all loving it," novelist Irene Dische wrote to us from New York. We've also been deluged with passionate letters from readers here in Germany, with responses typically going in two directions -- either it's "brilliant" or "that's sick, you should see a psychologist." Some complained the image was far too brutal.

    The authority-loving bild.de, the news website of Germany's largest tabloid newspaper, took to Twitter to cleverly criticize DER SPIEGEL. It didn't waste any words on alienation, the caricature or freedom of expression. It instead claimed that SPIEGEL had depicted Trump as an Islamic State terrorist, as if it were some kind of photomontage. This skewed interpretation paved the way for a rabid wave of outrage. But more serious colleagues at media like the Süddeutsche Zeitung and Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung also wrote that DER SPIEGEL went too far. Where, after all, can we go from here?

    In Kress, a leading media industry trade publication in Germany, journalist Franz Sommerfeld wrote, "If Trump is an emergency, then it's the media's job to ring the alarm in the soundest and most informative way possible, just as the new SPIEGEL cover story has done. That, of course, also includes caricatures and other forms of journalistic confrontation."

    What, after all, should we be waiting for?

    For Trump to show that he means business? He's already doing that. For him to start his first war?

    For the U.S. to fade away, for its people to put up with Trump and to allow a process to start that will ultimately become irreversible?

    Donald Trump did not decapitate a person on the cover of DER SPIEGEL, he decapitated a symbol. The Statue of Liberty has served as America's symbol of freedom and democracy since 1886 -- one that welcomes refugees, migrants, "the homeless, tempest-tossed," according to the inscription that it bears. Donald Trump despises and threatens liberal democracy, he despises and threatens the world order and he is the most powerful man on the planet. The emergency is already upon us.
    What do you think? Is the american effort of the people who love democracy slowly diminishing? Or is it growing stronger?

    My impression is, as more trump tries to install autocracy, as more people will oppose him.

  2. #2
    German media is absolute trash.

    It'd make the guys in Pravda blush.

  3. #3
    Deleted
    the only thing that's dying is globalism

    rot in hell

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by rym View Post
    Der Spiegel, a german news magazine (one of the most popular) posted this article recently.

    Please allow me to share it with this forum audience, i will add a comment at the end:



    What do you think? Is the american effort of the people who love democracy slowly diminishing? Or is it growing stronger?

    My impression is, as more trump tries to install autocracy, as more people will oppose him.
    Claim Democracy is dead or in trouble? Check
    Finger pointing at people who didn't vote Hillary or Trump? Check
    Unironic use of Autocracy? Check

    Question. If he's a puppet for the GOP, why would they allow only him to have all the power?

  5. #5
    Banned JohnBrown1917's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Обединени социалистически щати на Америка
    Posts
    28,394
    Quote Originally Posted by Taftvalue View Post
    the only thing that's dying is globalism

    rot in hell
    Thanks to Trump, I'm only seeing a better opinion of it in my personal circles. Its funny.

  6. #6
    Now seems like the time to join in the world is ending, so I can reflect back and say "Told you so" So to make sure I get in on the action, The world is ending, I'll be dead, so I'll just have my "I told you so" now

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Gilrak View Post
    Thanks to Trump, I'm only seeing a better opinion of it in my personal circles. Its funny.
    "The people I surround myself with support my silly opinion"

  8. #8
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Austilias View Post
    German media is absolute trash.

    It'd make the guys in Pravda blush.
    Our press is quite different from soviet unions state press from once. Der Spiegel is privately owned and not driven by german officials to start with.

  9. #9
    You know, people keep trashing on Trump, and he's certainly the most crude president America has had, but think about it. At heart, a lot of his policy proposals are a reflection of the problems voters have been dealing with for a while now.

    For instance, look at the rise of Globalism like Taftvalue mentioned; it has brought benefits, yes, but the benefits it has brought have not come to everyone, and now the losers are fighting back. There are thousands of people in the US who are good, hard-working, honest people who just want to provide for their family that have lost their jobs as a result of a) companies moving production offshore, b) being replaced by robotic automation, and c) companies importing foreign labour so that they can justify paying lower wages. These kinds of losses hit the American heartlands particularly hard, while densely populated cities such as New York and California, who claim to be sympathetic to the poor and needy, hand-waved their concerns away. It becomes especially insulting then, when these same compassionate souls demand we spend money to help other countries and regions in the world while neglecting their neighbor states.

    Then look at immigration. By and large, most Americans don't really have a problem with immigration, so long as it's done legally. Most Americans are also highly supportive of the rule of law. So when you get reports of immigrants not only coming over the border illegally, but then also getting protection and essentially rewarded in sanctuary cities, that strikes many as plainly unfair. What's the point of even having immigration laws if they keep getting broken and our own states won't even enforce them? How is that even fair for those who do immigrate legally? We just throw law and policy out the window because the people coming in have sad stories. But somehow, if you point this out, you're labelled a heartless, bigoted xenophobe; you can't even have a reasonable debate on it because you get told to shut up immediately. Trump's approach with a wall and travel ban is ham-fisted, but only because we've been denied reasonable discourse on the subject for years.

    Trump is just the megaphone for a sizeable portion of America that feels it hasn't been listened to. And even if something happens to Trump and he falls out of power (whether sickness, age, assassination, whatever), if something doesn't address the concerns of the heartlands, another Trump will take his place soon enough.
    Last edited by Jorgee; 2017-02-07 at 05:47 PM. Reason: Edited for spelling corrections

  10. #10
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by rym View Post
    Our press is quite different from soviet unions state press from once. Der Spiegel is privately owned and not driven by german officials to start with.
    But it is owned by someone. Does that someone not have his own agenda to push?

  11. #11
    That cover is inspired.

  12. #12
    Banned JohnBrown1917's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Обединени социалистически щати на Америка
    Posts
    28,394
    Quote Originally Posted by purebalance View Post
    "The people I surround myself with support my silly opinion"


    "I disagree with it, so its silly"



    p.s i'm not very pro-globalism, but good try.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Taftvalue View Post
    the only thing that's dying is globalism

    rot in hell
    I too will enjoy it when everything costs way more.

  14. #14
    Scarab Lord Zoranon's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Czech Republic, Euro-Atlantic civilisation
    Posts
    4,071
    Quote Originally Posted by rym View Post
    Our press is quite different from soviet unions state press from once. Der Spiegel is privately owned and not driven by german officials to start with.
    No, the accurate description is that Spiegel is the mouthpiece of SPD. No chance that this article happened so shortly after Schultz criticised Trump-
    Quote Originally Posted by b2121945 View Post
    Don't see what's wrong with fighting alongside Nazi Germany
    Quote Originally Posted by JfmC View Post
    someone who disagrees with me is simply wrong.

  15. #15
    Deleted
    "Der Spiegel: Democracy at the Tipping point"

    And it started to dip severely with ultra liberals. Calling themself democratic, what a joke. You get what you ask for ultra liberals.

  16. #16
    Legendary! Vargur's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    European Federation
    Posts
    6,664
    Quote Originally Posted by purebalance View Post
    "The people I surround myself with support my silly opinion"
    Yes, but it's not about that, it's about outlining the differences between nationalism/isolationism and globalism and seeing them clearer than ever before.
    It's about what your own thought culture's conclusion is about where either paths would lead to in the end.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    I too will enjoy it when everything costs way more.
    Or USA becomes like North Korea.
    Science flies you to the moon. Religion flies you into buildings.
    To resist the influence of others, knowledge of oneself is most important.


  17. #17
    The entire article is "The candidate I supported didnt win, therefore democracy must be dying"

    I think on the contrary, the candidate who spent less money on his campaign and was trashed daily by the press is the one who won, democracy is very much alive.

  18. #18
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by DiegoBrando View Post
    But it is owned by someone. Does that someone not have his own agenda to push?
    Surely he has. But "Der Spiegel" splits comments from news. They dont add biases to news.

  19. #19
    Still not sure I understand the level of hate aimed at Trump sure he's sexist and quite likely racist but he's not really done much yet. Keep in mind his political peers both at home and abroad have been guilty of various acts of exploitation, genocide and war mongering but sure lets go after Trump because he clearly the worst of the worst, right?

  20. #20
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Zoranon View Post
    No, the accurate description is that Spiegel is the mouthpiece of SPD. No chance that this article happened so shortly after Schultz criticised Trump-
    Spiegel is not part of the SPD. They are above party lines.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •