Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Deleted]

I'd fully be cheering for high elves if they showed up with Pandaren body types, kicked out of Quel'thalas for eating all the mana crystals.

This please. I would sign for this.

[Obelisk Kai]

I like that this thread is really trying to distill the High Elf culture down to its essential highlights, and represent them visually and mechanically. It really underlines just how wide a gap exists between Sin'dorei and Quel'dorei. It's a little odd that some of the folks posting are criticizing this as fanfiction - I mean, everything in the first post draws directly from Warcraft game content. If you're going that route, it would make more sense to criticize it for not having enough ideas that go outside of the established canon.

It is fanfiction, the OP is grafting elements from the Wildhammer Dwarves and elements of his own creation and others onto the High Elves in a vain attempt to create a measure of distance.

The problem with this approach is that is not what a High Elf is. It's a forced approach. It's everything these people condemn about Void Elves but apparently it's ok in this instance because the resulting elf has the correct skin colour.

[T33]

I'm in favor of High Elves simply for one reason: It is insanely clear there is a huge want for them. While they are definitely just blood elves with blue eyes, adding them as a customization option for them would be fine I think, at least.

[RangerDaz]

It is fanfiction, the OP is grafting elements from the Wildhammer Dwarves and elements of his own creation and others onto the High Elves in a vain attempt to create a measure of distance.

The problem with this approach is that is not what a High Elf is. It's a forced approach. It's everything these people condemn about Void Elves but apparently it's ok in this instance because the resulting elf has the correct skin colour.

I'm not sure what we can call a forced approach on a fantasy story, especially when it comes to warcraft.
Aren't Void Elves a forced approach to create a different Elf type? What about Lightforged Draenei? And so many other races, story arcs, etc. And they all made live.

In the end this is Blizzard's game... and they will do what they want. And people will still pay their subscriptions for some years to come.

[Zenlin]

I would 100% support the Alliance getting High Elves, if they didn't already exist. That's why I will never quite understand this eternal argument. I know why it's desired, would be foolish to ignore it, but that still doesn't change the fact that they're already a playable race, Blood Elves. It's been confirmed. Blood Elves are High Elves, something we already knew. They wanted to please the Alliance players that wanted High Elves, but not play on the Horde, that's why Void Elves were implemented, and yet many people just spit in their face at them extending the olive branch. I think there is nothing wrong with imagining concepts like this, and using your creativity, but ignoring reality altogether is another story. For better or worse, Blood Elves are an integral part of the Horde and their journey, simply giving the Alliance the same exact race, without any pretenses, would be a bit cruel. That's where Void Elves came in and filled that gap (which was a step too far already for some Horde players). I personally don't mind it, but it's a bit discouraging to see so many people still not satisfied.

[Zorish]

My "beliefs, loyalties, or focus" affect my eye colour because if I had one set of "beliefs, loyalties, or focus" I stayed with Silvermoon and got green eyes, and if I had another set of "beliefs, loyalties, or focus" I got exiled and kept the blue. Those green eyes of mine mark me as someone who stayed loyal to the True King of Silvermoon, someone who was willing to do what was needed to ensure the survival of my people no matter what it meant and not one of those moral cowards who would see the Blood Elfs extinct rather than get their hands dirty with a little blood or moral outrage.

And Blood Elfs will keep the Green Eyes as long as Blizzard feels they are important to the faction identity. Which I hope is a long time.

Faction identity is important to some players. Just as looking "cool" or "pretty" is important to others. You feel it isn't important...that's fine. But you shouldn't make the mistake of thinking that your belief in this aspect is shared by everyone. Some people...for example, those who reject the Void Elf model because they are NOT High Elfs...do value faction identity. And that identity goes beyond the model or eye colour.

and another player "beliefs, loyalties, or focus" let them be "high elf" and still stay loyal to the Silvermoon as their homeland. Without tapping to fel, or just using much arcane power to "wash" his eyes color. YOUR belives that they belong to the Aliance only matter ONLY to you. But your belives goes against the lore. Blizzard don't want to create "High elves" playable because that will mean creating TWO IDENTICAL RACES ON BOTH SIDES OF THE CONFLICT! We already have such race - pandaren. Want another neutral race - ok. But say that they are neutral/both sides. THEY ARE NOT PART OF ALIANCE ONLY BECAUSE YOU SOME FANATICS FROM Silver Covenant, who sat in the dalaran "sucking" magic from local mages instead helping their homeland.

[KyrtF]

I'm still in favour of the mass genocide.

I really don't think it would work.

We are in an era of alternate universes and time travel and where even burning the corpse doesn't guarantee you'll stay dead.

All for it, if it would work...but it won't. It'd just change the shape of the discussion...not stop it.

The only thing that will stop them is to give them High Elfs....and not a needless spiteful "compromise". That's why I spent time crafting my ideas...taking concepts from within the game to craft a High Elf race within the game that nonetheless created a High Elf allied race that....while a TRUE High Elf faction...nonetheless creates a clear differential between High Elfs and Blood/Void Elfs.

They get a different model.
They get a different class selection.
They lose some of the classes most associated with High Elfs...and do so in a continuation of a Blizzard storyline
They get new racials and coopt the Night Elf Empire architecture as the basis for a new Roman Empire style aesthetic
The Silver Covenant get described as fanatics (I liked that idea )

So there is a clear difference.

In return...they get an eye glow that varies .with class and the DarkFallen.

I could live with that. But regardless...this debate is old, and if the only way to stop it is to give them High Elfs, I'd say yes. There's no point arguing that Allied Races don't destroy any arguments against them.

I'm willing to entertain any idea, but no others will work

[WurstKaeseSzenario]

I'd rather have my High Elves and Wildhammer Dwarfs separate.

[KyrtF]

You do realize they are a FACTION and not a race right? You guys are really stretching the concept of allied races to new levels of derp with some of these suggestions. Hell, let's just turn every single faction and every single race currently in game into an allied race. FFS can we stop with the dumb already? OP needs a hobby, girlfriend, cat...something.

You mean, like Blizzard did with Highmountsin Tauren and Draenor Orcs? Different factions....same race.
How about Void Elfs? Same race, different faction

Allied races has destroyed every argument against High Elfs. The only thing now is what will stop the debate. I'm sure eventually it'll die down...but it'll come back. It always comes back.

[Zorish]

All High Elves are either neutral or Alliance. There are other castes of High Elves across Azeroth, some are in the Hinterlands, and there are communities in Stormwind, too. They aren't all fanatics, they just don't believe in the Horde and what Quel'thalas has become.

and still "High elves" are Blood elves. And as blizzard said their eyes can in some time return to their original color. so - if they are playable no lore against Horde having them as BE customization or Allied race too.

[Goldielocks]

Damn you sure spent a lot of time on something that has 0% chance of becoming a reality.

[RangerDaz]

They haven't been saying no for 10 years, they've been saying "maybe someday". Ion's justification is weak and can be applied to both the lightforged Draenei and Void Elves as much as the High Elves.

Who knows, Blizzard's philosophy might change eventually, and they might warm up to the idea a few expansions down the line if they keep up the pace of allied races being added.

Ion also said that Blizzard wanted the old Alliance Paladin vs. Horde Shaman feeling back (as if Classic WoW isn't a thing to come in the future...), and guess what happened a month later... Dark Iron totems were datamined.

It is all very subjective. They opened a Pandora Box when they created Allied Races. Now this will only stop when the Expansion is over... and all Allied Races' slots are filled.

[KyrtF]

and another player "beliefs, loyalties, or focus" let them be "high elf" and still stay loyal to the Silvermoon as their homeland. Without tapping to fel, or just using much arcane power to "wash" his eyes color. YOUR belives that they belong to the Aliance only matter ONLY to you. But your belives goes against the lore. Blizzard don't want to create "High elves" playable because that will mean creating TWO IDENTICAL RACES ON BOTH SIDES OF THE CONFLICT! We already have such race - pandaren. Want another neutral race - ok. But say that they are neutral/both sides. THEY ARE NOT PART OF ALIANCE ONLY BECAUSE YOU SOME FANATICS FROM Silver Covenant, who sat in the dalaran "sucking" magic from local mages instead helping their homeland.

Blizzard has ALREADY got the same race on both sides of the conflict.

What do you think Void Elfs are? Where do you think they come from?

Void Elfs are Blood Elfs who chose to study the wrong magic. There is LESS difference between them and Blood Elfs than between Blood Elfs and High Elfs

The Alliance HAVE Blood Elfs
The Alliance HAVE the Blood Elf model
The Alliance WANT High Elfs and they are NOT shutting up about it

Try studying what Allied Races are before coming back to comment.

[FlubberPuddy]

Well, hopefully they expire before then. Alliance got their Thalassian Elf model in the VE's, just as the Horde got a NE model in the Nightborne.

Their upper limit is something like 40 Allied races, that's what Ion ball-parked in the Forbes interview. So unless you can think 40 plausible unique races then we're going to get more rehashes at some point.

[Zorish]

Blizzard has ALREADY got the same race on both sides of the conflict.

What do you think Void Elfs are? Where do you think they come from?

Void Elfs are Blood Elfs who chose to study the wrong magic. There is LESS difference between them and Blood Elfs than between Blood Elfs and High Elfs

The Alliance HAVE Blood Elfs
The Alliance HAVE the Blood Elf model
The Alliance WANT High Elfs and they are NOT shutting up about it

Try studying what Allied Races are before coming back to comment.

you are picked the wrong person to tell this. it's aliance players who don't understand this and still want "muh "High elves"". I am just trying to tell them that their "High elves" already ingame and if they still want them consider them being both sides not one.

[therealbowser]

It's not just the story (which is bad, and let's face it is going to stay bad based on how Blizzard "develops" Alliance content), it's not just the worse zones, it's not just the Horde getting blatantly superior race options from every conceivable angle, it's all of the above plus what's happening right now to Alliance's PvP/PvE scene.

Look at how many Alliance guilds have downed Mythic Argus. How many teams have cleared Mythic+ 25 or higher, how many PvP groups have hit 2400+ in Legion. The entire high end scene for Alliance is crumbling down to nothing. Everyone still agrees going into BfA, Horde racials are superior to Alliance for both PvE and PvP, and all the time we hear more and more high to top end Alliance guilds either dying or switching to red in anticipation of BfA, because not only do they have those racials, but they also have the Nightbourne and the dino forms and the better zones and the better blah blah blah.

Let's face it, WoW's playerbase ain't what it used to be. The scene for everything is shrinking more and more, but this is happening much quicker on Alliance. BfA is straight up looking like Cata 2.0, only this time I honestly don't know if Alliance will survive that.

But why am I wasting my breath. This is MMO champ for fucks sakes, probably the biggest group of Horde fanboys outside of Blizzcon, so who cares if Alliance just dies outside of LFR right.

Couple things.

First of all, I disagree that the Alliance story is always worse than the Horde story, although it is almost always true, and relatively speaking, more effort is put into Horde than Alliance, period. A good example, for instance, is Shadowmoon Valley vs. Frostfire Ridge. Alliance unquestionably had better content in that one instance.

I do agree, however, on Horde being the more popular faction, but it's not because their racials are better. Realistically, the only race that has good enough racials to really stand out are blood elves, simply because they have an extra interrupt. Nothing else is going to be significant, even to hardcore mythic progression guilds I'd be surprised to see them going out of their way to buy race changes or anything. Arguing that racials are better for PvP is subjective and not necessarily true -- look at void elf spellcasters, for instance.

All of this said, while Alliance definitely has less hardcore players, they still have the larger population still -- last I checked. Hardcore progression guilds tend not to care what's most played because they have a regular group that isn't going to reroll because it's fun, though they might reroll if it helps them get access to better players. Alliance will naturally weather this just fine. The people who play Alliance are used to this kind of crap, some even revel in it. It will not even phase them -- and I say this out of pity rather than as an insult.

Lastly, dunno about MMO-champ having hardcore horde fanboys, but it wouldn't surprise me. It doesn't really bother me, though.

[KyrtF]

you are picked the wrong person to tell this. it's aliance players who don't understand this and still want "muh "High elves"". I am just trying to tell them that their "High elves" already ingame and if they still want them consider them being both sides not one.

No....YOU don't get it.

High Elves are NOT Blood Elfs. Never have been...never will be. I don't play a High Elf, and I wouldn't expect Alliance players to call Void Elfs High Elfs for the same reason.

Faction identity is what the Alliance are after....and it is what makes me play a Blood Elf rather than a High Elf with Green eyes. For players for whom faction identity is important, access to the Blood Elf model isn't giving the Alliance High Elfs because nothing of what it means to be a High Elf comes with it.

High Elfs are NOT in game because neither Blood Elfs nor Void Elfs bring the factional High Elf identity with them

That may not mean much to you, but to those players who want High Elfs, it is quite important and is an aspect not satisfied by Void Elfs.

[Zenlin]

Void Elves were pulled out of no where. It's not an olive branch, it's just a confusing decision. Having a race that looks INCREDIBLY SIMILAR to their horde counterpart is not an issue, or else we'd see more complaints about pandaren in PVP.

Void Elves are up there with the most requested allied races of all time with Mag'har and Nightborne, and they finally had the opportunity to do it and they do some weird pulled-out-of-the-ass lore. It wasn't a compromise because no compromise needed to happen, they could have just done it.

Saying there aren't enough High Elves alive is goofy, because the Army of the Light is a couple divisions of foot-soldiers and Void Elves are a handful of cultists.

High Elves have been wagged infront of our faces, and received development EVEN IN LEGION, it's wasted development, though.

They could have very easily appeased the High Elf crowd by having the Void Elf void form toggleable, but they didn't. It is just a genuinely confusing, unjustified decision on Blizzard's part.

I have no other complaints about allied races or BFA, I don't hate Void Elves, hell, I main one! I just think it's an echo of what could have been, a refined concept that people clearly want to play.

There are enough high elves, because there are communities of High Elves in:
-Stormwind
-Dalaran
-Hinterlands

And all around the world! They could have said "Alleria knew of an island enclave of High Elves" and it would have been more believable than "We were exiled from Silvermoon for using void magic!"

The issue with that being though, Pandaren were able to be both factions from the start, they didn't start separated. There is a big distinction there. Let's say Blizzard finagled a way to work Draenei lore into the Horde format, they then decided they wanted to give them to the Horde as a Allied race. I have a sneaking suspicion a very large group of people would be very upset. Yes I understand High Elves have been present in Alliance lore for a long time, but you get the point I'm trying to make. It's that feeling I think as to why many Horde players are taking issue with the idea. Also don't forget, Lightforged and Void Elves may be few, but they're incredibly skilled and talented. So though there may not be many, every single one of then offers something to the cause. But High Elves, though they are inherently skilled in certain ways just like Blood Elves, are also very few and not all have special assets they can bring to the table, which makes the roster even smaller. I'm not trying to dissuade you from your passion, I understand fully where you're coming from, I just hope you understand where players who are opposed are coming from as well. That's all I'm trying to get across. I think sometimes with all the fighting and back and forth on topics like this, it just turns into something tribal and divisive with no one even trying to understand where the other side is coming from.

[Powerogue]

The concept images look a lot better now than Captain Jack Sunrunner but it still remains that we've never seen these in-game. People will look at that and go "who the hell are these people?" All established allied races are races we've met before. (with the somewhat exception of void elves but we've met Alleria, that counts!) The main issue is we've already met plenty of high elves in the Silver Covenant who look nothing like this at all.

If they wanted to do this at this point they'd have to establish a faction of high elves that actually dress and look like this and give us time to associate with them in-game. It would ideally not be the Silver Covenant who already have an established look to them. Blizzard, for good reason, almost always avoids completely overhauling the visual identity of a WoW race.

[Traycor]

The concept images look a lot better now than Captain Jack Sunrunner but it still remains that we've never seen these in-game. People will look at that and go "who the hell are these people?" All established allied races are races we've met before. (with the somewhat exception of void elves but we've met Alleria, that counts!) The main issue is we've already met plenty of high elves in the Silver Covenant who look nothing like this at all.

If they wanted to do this at this point they'd have to establish a faction of high elves that actually dress and look like this and give us time to associate with them in-game. It would ideally not be the Silver Covenant who already have an established look to them. Blizzard, for good reason, almost always avoids completely overhauling the visual identity of a WoW race.

I think you mean Jack Sunsparrow...

Point taken on look changes, but I disagree that the Silver Covenant has an established look. That's why Blizz hasn't used them as an Allied Race yet. They have no look at all. They dress kinda blue? Even if the High Elves were never added as playable, the faction/NPCs need an overhaul because they have no look or design direction. Most of their outfits seem random with only the tabard to tie them together.

It would be no big deal to just switch the NPCs to have the new hair and warpaint. And give them new outfits. When the Silver Covenant showed up in Dalaran with new outfits, we didn't go, "Who be dis?" When major characters get new models, it's no problem. Just make the switch. If they were turning red with horns, I could understand confusion, but giving them some style would be just fine.