[TV/Books] Game of Thrones ***SPOILER Discussion***

[RobertoCarlos]

what the fuck is this man.

This is some hardcore fanfic stuff.

"And then drogon melts the throne!!!"

[Sooba]

Could have been worst. Definitely could have been better.

Overall, dissapointing.

Darkeon speaks my mind. I've analyzed this show's shortcomings plenty. I'll be waiting for the books, if they ever appear. I'm done with this franchise until then.

[RobertoCarlos]

Sam bringing up democracy.

This is kinda hurting me now.

D&D.....

[Jimusmc]

aaaaaand a water bottle was shown. lol

https://twitter.com/bethisloco/statu...41245170020353

[IIamaKing]

The scene doesn't make sense in general.

Either Grey Worm has the power to demand some sort of justice, or he doesn't. He claims he does because they have him in physical chains, but Sansa says the entire North is outside the gates? Or was she implying the North would come down to free him? If the North has no one there, why does Grey Worm give a fuck what these people say? If the North is there (and presumably Yara's Fleet, Dorne's army which is untouched, the Vale, and Riverrun's forces), why the fuck do they give a shit about Grey Worm and the Unsullied? Just demand Jon. Hell, you still have the ninja Arya just hanging around there doing nothing, she could free Jon herself.

This is all built on the worthless ep3 characterization of the remaining Dothraki/Unsullied forces. I could have sworn there was only like a handful of Dothraki who ran out of the shadows with Jorah, and only maybe 2 dozen at most Unsullied by the end of that episode, but each episode after their forces kept getting bigger and bigger - which they needed to do just to justify how Grey Worm has any sort of right to demand jack and/or shit.

I wont argue with most of this but I think Grey Worm not fighting is more out of fatigue. Pretty sure the Northern forces were outside so just executing Jon or just trying to force Jon to be turned over would be more bloodshed that I just dont think anyone really wanted on that scale.

I do think a better resolution would have been to allow Tyrion to be freed but Jon as the Queenslayer had to pay with his life and he gets beheaded with his Valiran sword, Just like Ned. "Stark men dont do well in the capitol".

All the Starks got way too happy of endings. Like seriously, pretty much best possible outcomes all around.

[Voidwielder]

The throne being destroyed by Drogon is definitely a GRRM move - it marks an end of an era, a transition. It's very Tolkien-esque. Which is why I believe it's his idea.

I am not sure he'd go with the Enlightenment spin on Westeros geopolitics.

[Aurrora]

aaaaaand a water bottle was shown. lol

https://twitter.com/bethisloco/statu...41245170020353

How long until Nestle inexplicably gets credit for this bottle?

[RobertoCarlos]

brb investing in water bottles

[ohiostate124]

Took a screenshot of this exchange an hour before the episode aired

[RobertoCarlos]

This last episode was so fucking bad it made me regret watching the show to begin with. Holy fuck.

Im legit pretty upset at the moment.

I mean yeah it had a lot of great seasons ill be thankful for and rewatch.

But this final hurts on a personal level with how little fucks the writers give.

[Aurrora]

Took a screenshot of this exchange an hour before the episode aired

Well, the season's plot was apparently leaked months ago, so it's not really a "called it" moment.

[eschatological]

I wont argue with most of this but I think Grey Worm not fighting is more out of fatigue. Pretty sure the Northern forces were outside so just executing Jon or just trying to force Jon to be turned over would be more bloodshed that I just dont think anyone really wanted on that scale.

I do think a better resolution would have been to allow Tyrion to be freed but Jon as the Queenslayer had to pay with his life and he gets beheaded with his Valiran sword, Just like Ned. "Stark men dont do well in the capitol".

All the Starks got way too happy of endings. Like seriously, pretty much best possible outcomes all around.

Well, that just points out two other major flaws which I didn't mention cause I didn't feel like writing out all the flaws of this episode:

1) No one saw what happened in the throne room. Jon could have just walked away, and no one would know shit. Hell, they might not even know Dany died, they could have just assumed she had Drogon melt the throne and fly away for a quick vacay. If Jon left too, they woulda thought it was a lover's getaway. It was still fucking snowing, the blood coulda been covered up, or be gotten rid of. But, let's assume for the sake of giving the benefit of the doubt to the writers, let's say Jon confessed.....

2) .....why the fuck wouldn't Grey Worm execute him instantly? He literally says like 10 minutes before "Anyone who fights the Queen must die." The writers purposefully time skip right there 3 weeks because even they can't come up with an insane reason why Jon would simply be taken prisoner instead of being executed instantly.....



.....which all ties back into Dany's motivation. To me, I was curious to see how they would treat Dany's characterization. It had to be, imo, one of two things: 1) She was absolutely stark raving mad, or 2) she was horrified by what she did but resolute in her resolve to hold the throne. If the first was true, she would have instantly executed Tyrion for his betrayal, as an example, right in front of her worshipping Unsullied/Dothraki. If the second were true, she would have made a speech to Jon in the throne room about "necessary evil" and Jon would be talked down off the ledge and probably not see a reason to kill her. But instead, she's happy and rationalizing her actions. She's talking honeymoon plans. She spouts non sequiturs to Jon's accusations. She cannot be both rational and mad. But she needs to be utterly mad (to Jon, so he knows he has to kill her) but at the same time reasonable (to "justify" her actions to herself and her character, and appear like she can be just a normal ole ruler on the throne). But of course, it doesn't justify her character, this is D&D's shitty attempt to paint her grey when her actions were as black and white as they come.

[Adam Jensen]

They were running on fumes without g.martin's books, more seasons would just have become even more dissapointing...

Except the problem with S8 was how rushed it was. Had they spread it out a bit and taken more time, then maybe it'd be better. Give us more scheming from Varys, a bit more of Mad Queen Dany, give us a Battle of Winterfell where the NK is the threat he's been since the show started and give Bran a fucking reason to be. Give Jaime a better reason to go galloping back to Cersei. Maybe have more tension between Bronn, Tyrion and Jaime (or even have Bronn kill one of them.)

The writing and pacing was rushed. If they had slowed down and taken their time it could have been a decent season.

[Tyron]

Sansa's charisma stat is so high she surpasses all the Jedi Master's combined.

"The north will be its own kingdom"
*Waves hand*
*Everyone agrees*

[RobertoCarlos]

Sansa's charisma stat is so high she surpasses all the Jedi Master's combined.

"The north will be its own kingdom"
*Waves hand*
*Everyone agrees*

Her time with littlefinger gave her a passive with +15 to charisma

And tyrions intelligence debuff worn off this episode

[BloodyAngel12]

So even if the North left, the Iron Islands joined meaning there were still 7 kingdoms at the end.

[therealstegblob]

I am not sure he'd go with the Enlightenment spin on Westeros geopolitics.

He wouldn't, because it was really fucking stupid and shortsighted. It's some primitive diplomacy with no checks or balances so someone in the future can just get the biggest army (which is what decides who's in power in a feudal system, more or less) and the most support and strongarm the "votes". It fixes and changes nothing. It was unlordly dumb.

[buck008]

So I still stand by most of this last season being fine. I think this last episode really showed just how badly they were struggling to connect the dots in the time they had left. I mean, when a writer passes halfway through a series and another writer steps in to take his place and finish it, that never goes well. Regardless of how talented the substitute may be. From what I understand, they were working from a rough outline that just described major plot points and how things shook out. It really seems like they just filmed those major points without any of the connective tissue that made them make actual sense.

Martin only barely wrote for the show though. Most of the show was an interpretation and adaptation of his work by a third party. This whole show was the work of the team that also ran this last season. Based on that body of work, I hoped that they would be able to bring this bird in for a smoother landing. From the point that they overtook the books, they consistently chose a style that focused more on plot than character. That's fine, but it's not the way the books were written, which is a problem. Then they just had to slam through the last major set pieces at such a pace that we lost any sense of context.

By way of example, I love an ending for John that sees him leave King's Landing behind and head north with the wildlings. It makes total sense for him. How they arrived there in the show though? Oof. Arya gets nothing to do all episode and decides to take off, a decision that carries no emotional weight with us because we never saw her make it. Crap like that gets lost when you shift priorities, and we're left with an ending that technically connects all the dots, but leaves you feeling dissatisfied in how it got there.

[RobertoCarlos]

It's HBO fanfiction. This whole last episode made fuck all of sense.

Where do you start.

The only thing that didnt feel like a total ass pull was Tyrion being hand of the king again. That is the ONLY part of the ending I liked and thought made sense.

Everyone elses arc was totally destoryed/reversed or as you say the characters that did nothing and lived who had an important name in this "new age" world were made into lords of w/e or flat out queen of the north.

Broken wheel / democracy but we still respect family names

Complete garbage.

[Wildberry]

I'm really loving all of the people who were digging in to defend S8E3 now come around to the fact that the show's gone off the rails. It's been there since S5, but better late than never, I guess.