Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Paranoid Android]

Dallas megachurch that hosted Pence approved for millions in coronavirus aid https://t.co/mRgO1zbuZ9 https://t.co/KESmgVp4zx

https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1...650278912?s=19

Wait? What?

A Dallas megachurch that hosted Vice President Pence last month amid the coronavirus pandemic was approved for millions of dollars in federal aid.

First Baptist Dallas was approved for a forgivable loan worth $2 million to $5 million, according to data released by the Small Business Administration (SBA) on Monday.

Pence spoke at the church last month at an event dubbed "Celebrate Freedom Rally" with a crowd of 2,000 people. The church has a maximum capacity of about 3,000.

Its pastor, Robert Jeffress, has also been on President Trump's evangelical advisory board, Reuters noted.

The Dallas church was one of tens of thousands of religious organizations that received a total of $7.3 billion in SBA coronavirus aid, according to the news service.

https://thehill.com/policy/finance/5...mpression=true

Some are upset with Kanye but this takes it. The article does not say how or why they received the money.

$2-5 million? Biggest con in this nation is not taxing churches.

[Zan15]

Separation of Church and State going...umm....disappearing ...?


https://news.trust.org/item/20200707021948-4ednx

Televangelists, Dallas megachurch that hosted Pence approved for millions in pandemic aid

A Dallas megachurch whose pastor has been a vocal supporter of President Donald Trump was approved for a forgivable loan worth $2 million to $5 million

It was among the tens of thousands of religious organizations that received a total of $7.3 billion in pandemic aid from the Small Business Administration.

The list of religious organizations approved for about 88,400 small business loans also included Joyce Meyer Ministries Inc, a Missouri church which in 2007-2011 was investigated by the Senate over its finances. That church was approved for $5 million to $10 million - the largest sum an individual entity could apply for.

Critics of the program's rules, though, say it is unconstitutional for religious groups to receive taxpayer funds because America's founders, in a bid to preserve religious freedom for all, envisaged a strict separation between church and state.

"Going back to the founding of our country, one of the major principles is that no one should be forced to be taxed to propagate the religious ideas of another person," said Alison Gill, vice president of legal and policy at religious equality watchdog American Atheists.

[cubby]

I said quit talking about race, and you accuse me of race baiting, its not a productive conversation and I am not continuing it with you.

It certainly isn't a productive conversation considering that you're now lying. Please don't race-bait people in the forums - you brought up race as an issue, not me. It's not our fault you don't understand your own positions, and then seemingly can't remember what you said. If you don't want to discuss an issue, fine, but don't respond poorly and then not follow up. That's just bad manners.

Don't @ me.

Lol, ok champ. Didn't mean to ruffle your feathers.

[Zan15]

$2-5 million? Biggest con in this nation is not taxing churches.

Tell me about it.

Between religious organizations and the federal buildings we have more property in my town not paying property tax then are.

my mil rate for my car was 45. Property tax was 50

Average for the state is like 22-25. Richest town was 11.


They valued my 130k mile accident damaged car at 4500. Best trade in offer so far in last 5 months was 990.00.



I told the story before how the religious organization owns 3 buildings here for rentals. Rent to 22+ people, 425.00 per person, 2-4 people in an apt.
No property tax. No income Tax.
That's why i would love to see the under 150k list, i know they are on it.

[Breccia]

So, Mulvaney went on FOX News and said Trump should focus on the economy, specifically, how much it's improving right now.

If the president can go back to drawing those contrasts between him and Joe Biden, that it becomes a race between Trump and Biden, I think the president does extraordinarily well. And he shows people, 'Look, if you hire me, this is what you get. If you hire him, you end up with no jobs.’

Granted, Trump's highest marks have always been the economy, but "I'm climbing out of the hole I dug" isn't a ringing endorsement, nor is pointing at Obama's two terms of growth and saying "this is bad". Trump's 2017, 2018, and 2019 weren't all that good, and definitely weren't as good as Trump promised. COVID-19 didn't prevent Trump from getting 3% GDP growth. COVID-19 didn't put Trump off a 25 million jobs rate. COVID-19 didn't even end a trade deal with China, Trump did that on his own.

But that's old news. Mulvaney also said this:

If it ends up being a popularity contest or, worse, a referendum on President Trump, I think he’s got some real headwinds to face

I've been saying for years now Trump can't run on his record. It sounds like Team Trump agrees. Problem is, they can't realistically make the election only about one issue. That's impossible. With the number of Americans dead racing towards the 137k estimate with no real sign of slowing down (and case numbers are in "fuck Florida" territory daily) there's no way to scrape that issue off the front pages. And yet, during such, Trump officially leaves WHO, cuts aid to testing centers, continues to preach it'll just vanish very soon but also pushing a drug that doesn't work. Oh, and fighting the ACA in court.

Plus, of course, anything about international standing, anything at all about jobs including 2020, the tax cut failing to pay for itself (and also set to expire for individuals), Trump's blatant corruption (as seen with PPP loans going to his donors, holy shit releasing that list was both stupid and mandatory), his taxes, his racism, the massive amounts of socialism he poured into farmers and the energy industry, North Korea, Iran, North Korea again because of how badly he fucked that up in particular, trying to extort a country and getting impeached when he was caught, and the dozens of things in those books out/shortly out that report behind the scenes so accurately that Trump sued in court without saying "libel" or "slander" admitting the info is true.

Still, it's interesting to see Team Trump admit they've failed, and the only route to success is "ignore everything before June".

[Adam Jensen]

And yet, during such, Trump officially leaves WHO, cuts aid to testing centers, continues to preach it'll just vanish very soon but also pushing a drug that doesn't work. Oh, and fighting the ACA in court.

Remember when George Washington refused to know how many British troops were in the 13 Colonies because the numbers might make him look bad? Remember the famous speech at Valley Forge when he announced that the British would "be gone, like a miracle, with the heat in April"?

[DarkTZeratul]

Remember when George Washington refused to know how many British troops were in the 13 Colonies because the numbers might make him look bad? Remember the famous speech at Valley Forge when he announced that the British would "be gone, like a miracle, with the heat in April"?

"In reviewing the incidents of my administration, I am unconscious of intentional error, because I don't make errors."

[Drutt]

Taxpayer funds being allocated to religious organizations that pay no taxes is fucking criminal as far as I'm concerned.

If they need money, they should be getting it from their congregations.

[cubby]

Why the FUCK are we pulling out of the WHO during a pandemic?

https://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...s-us-from-WHO-

Jesus, here I thought I couldn't hate Trump more. Fucking man is an incompetent imbecile.

Because we're being led by a Crime Family Boss. And the scortched earth policy is only going to get worse. All those PPP dollars that went out to his friends and churches and billionaires are gone. Can't get them back, and it was yet another pay-for-play scheme.

Keep in mind that no one is looking at Trump's campaign spending - and he has over half a billion dollars on hand. I'm sure all his "friends" have a hand in in somehow.

[Paranoid Android]

Tell me about it.

Between religious organizations and the federal buildings we have more property in my town not paying property tax then are.

my mil rate for my car was 45. Property tax was 50

Average for the state is like 22-25. Richest town was 11.


They valued my 130k mile accident damaged car at 4500. Best trade in offer so far in last 5 months was 990.00.



I told the story before how the religious organization owns 3 buildings here for rentals. Rent to 22+ people, 425.00 per person, 2-4 people in an apt.
No property tax. No income Tax.
That's why i would love to see the under 150k list, i know they are on it.

Yeah, I saw your post right after mine, so I know you were composing it. I would want to know where the money went. Hey, these mega-churches are mega-businesses. So yeah did they take the money to give to people who are on their sales staff, book/merchandising and whatever else these churches make money. Sadly as a pessimist, I am in no doubt they likely pocketed more money than they gave out.

See the problem with when the one side always wants small government and points to corruption, which I no doubt hate. The problem being is that people who profiteer off government programs also have I guess the "moral" responsibility of not taking the money. These churches, who are suppose to be non-profit and multi-million dollar companies should not take this money.

[cubby]

Taxpayer funds being allocated to religious organizations that pay no taxes is fucking criminal as far as I'm concerned.

If they need money, they should be getting it from their congregations.

Agreed. And the Grifters of Politics (GOP) should be held accountable. But they won't. Because this is our new reality.

[Paranoid Android]

Taxpayer funds being allocated to religious organizations that pay no taxes is fucking criminal as far as I'm concerned.

If they need money, they should be getting it from their congregations.

Yes, as I just wrote. Where did the money go? These religious organizations and especially the example given are mega-businesses. They make so much money in merchandising and licensing. I'm betting the church mentioned makes millions in profit each year.

[Breccia]

McConnell isn't planning on giving it to him until after the election, so either way, Trump has no incentive to veto it.

Wait, when is it due?

- - - Updated - - -

Remember the famous speech at Valley Forge when he announced that the British would "be gone, like a miracle, with the heat in April"?

It's okay, Washington promised French troops would help and save everything. It helped that Washington had partial ownership in a French army!

Also, when Washington said "If we stopped checking to see if the British were at the battlefield, there wouldn't be any battles!"

[Thekri]

Wait, when is it due?

- - - Updated - - -



It's okay, Washington promised French troops would help and save everything. It helped that Washington had partial ownership in a French army!

Also, when Washington said "If we stopped checking to see if the British were at the battlefield, there wouldn't be any battles!"

December 31st. It is typically signed by the President in the 3rd or 4th week of December.

Trump can talk all the shit he wants before election, he doesn't need to put any cards on the table before then. And Trump doesn't give a shit about the names of military bases, he just wants the attention. He has nothing to gain from vetoing it, and a lot to lose.

[Edge-]

https://twitter.com/JohnRizkallah/st...19578416439298

Trump fan tells Asian family celebrating a birthday at a restaurant that "Trump is going to fuck you.", insults them for being Asian, and is kicked out of the restaurant.

He was dining alone, as I assume he's the type of miserable motherfucker nobody wants to hang out with.

Trump's fans sure seem nice.

[Zan15]

Yeah, I saw your post right after mine, so I know you were composing it. I would want to know where the money went. Hey, these mega-churches are mega-businesses. So yeah did they take the money to give to people who are on their sales staff, book/merchandising and whatever else these churches make money. Sadly as a pessimist, I am in no doubt they likely pocketed more money than they gave out.

See the problem with when the one side always wants small government and points to corruption, which I no doubt hate. The problem being is that people who profiteer off government programs also have I guess the "moral" responsibility of not taking the money. These churches, who are suppose to be non-profit and multi-million dollar companies should not take this money.

How about those groups that want smaller govt and lower taxes....

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/...ronavirus.html

https://www.rollcall.com/2020/07/06/...-to-ppp-loans/


Anti-tax crusader Grover Norquist, a loud opponent of government spending, notoriously once said: “I don’t want to abolish government. I simply want to reduce it to the size where I can drag it into the bathroom and drown it in the bathtub.” But his libertarian ideological commitments don’t seem to have stopped the group he leads from accepting government aid to weather the coronavirus crisis.

Norquist’s outfit. Lo and behold, the Americans for Tax Reform Foundation—the “educational” affiliate of the lobbying group Americans for Tax Reform— appears to have taken between $150,000 and $350,000 in aid.


The Ayn Rand Institute received a PPP loan of between $350K and $1 million

Taxpayers for Common Sense, Citizens Against Government Waste and Americans for Tax Reform Foundation received loans through the Paycheck Protection Program of between $150,000 and $350,000. The Center for Economic and Policy Research and The Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy, each received between $350,000 and $1 million. The Environmental Working Group received between $1 and $2 million.

Steve Ellis, president of Taxpayers for Common Sense, said his group received a “little less than $175,000,” which represents under 10 percent of the group’s budget.

The Environmental Working Group — which has long questioned the propriety of government subsidies to farmers — received a loan of $1,156,800, co-founder and President Ken Cook said in a statement.

[cubby]

The WHO withdrawal notification by the Trump administration triggers a one-year timeline. One more thing to add to the reasons for voting Biden.

- - - Updated - - -

Why the FUCK are we pulling out of the WHO during a pandemic?

https://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...s-us-from-WHO-

Jesus, here I thought I couldn't hate Trump more. Fucking man is an incompetent imbecile.

There is a one year clock on the withdrawal. So hopefully, if Biden wins, WHO will let us rescind the withdrawal request.

It seems like if Biden wins, his SecState is going to be busy. Like a new Assistant Secretary of State for International Apology Tour.

[Stormspark]

The WHO withdrawal notification by the Trump administration triggers a one-year timeline. One more thing to add to the reasons for voting Biden.

- - - Updated - - -



There is a one year clock on the withdrawal. So hopefully, if Biden wins, WHO will let us rescind the withdrawal request.

It seems like if Biden wins, his SecState is going to be busy. Like a new Assistant Secretary of State for International Apology Tour.

If I were other countries, I would not accept an "apology tour". I would only accept ACTION, to show that we have fixed our shit so that something like this can't happen again. I would view an apology tour as a meaningless gesture, and probably not even allow them in the country.

[Thekri]

The WHO withdrawal notification by the Trump administration triggers a one-year timeline. One more thing to add to the reasons for voting Biden.

- - - Updated - - -



There is a one year clock on the withdrawal. So hopefully, if Biden wins, WHO will let us rescind the withdrawal request.

It seems like if Biden wins, his SecState is going to be busy. Like a new Assistant Secretary of State for International Apology Tour.

Apologies may be easier then you think. Most foreign diplomats are going to be so relieved things can go back to normal, the SecState is going to get a lot of hugs.

Not that the job is going to be easy, mind you. Most of Biden's cabinet positions are going to be absolutely nightmares. There is just so much to patch back together. The SecState has to get some sort of sanity back in a Korean policy, stabilize Eastern Europe after it has been deliberately sabotaged, put together some sort of plan to deal with Iran in a reasonable manner, patch up our relationship with Mexico, figure out what the fuck we are doing in Venezuela, solve a major humanitarian crisis in central America, fix the problems irrational tariffs have caused, deal with Turkey going full retard...

This is basically the job before Covid, the actual job will be harder. By next January, the economic scope of this is going to be more clear. They are going to have to deal with opening up travel between nations again, dealing with massive financial damage to every country, including the US...

Anyway, apologies are the least of their concerns. There is a lot of work to do, and I suspect everyone is going to be so relieved that the US is back to behaving in a somewhat socially acceptable manner again, that apologies can wait a bit.

- - - Updated - - -

If I were other countries, I would not accept an "apology tour". I would only accept ACTION, to show that we have fixed our shit so that something like this can't happen again. I would view an apology tour as a meaningless gesture, and probably not even allow them in the country.

Pretty much this. Just get to work, don't fuss around with apologies. There is a lot to get done on this planet, and it hasn't been happening these last few years.

[Breccia]

"Trump is going to fuck you."

"Oh, you brought a check for $130,000 for us?"