If they made a new class in the future, what would it be?

[TheRevenantHero]

Death Knights aren't Runemasters because Runemasters were never a thing.

Runemasters existed in the TTRPG and were initially going to be a class but they were basically made into monks.

- - - Updated - - -

Again, Priestd have abilities like Shadowy Apparition Mindbender, Fade, Psychic Horror, and Dispersion. How are those any different thematically than Haunting Wave?

- - - Updated - - -



Engineering would need to be a class with actual Tinker abilities for that comparison to work.

No they don't. They basically do the same thing, it's just lots of items they make instead of spells. By your logic, engineers are tinkers.

[razorpax]

Yup, very good news for Dark Rangers too. Good to see more HotS abilities make its way to WoW

Yeah it’s very cool to see her gear that can change your skills too
I love it

[Teriz]

No they don't. They basically do the same thing, it's just lots of items they make instead of spells. By your logic, engineers are tinkers.

Uh no. One is piloting a mech with advanced weaponry, and the other is crafting items for selling. That’s not the same thing,

[TheRevenantHero]

Uh no. One is piloting a mech with advanced weaponry, and the other is crafting items for selling. That’s not the same thing,

First of all, there is literally zero concrete evidence that tinkers would always pilot a mech so that's an invalid argument. For two, engineer items function exactly like your tinker concept. You're splitting hairs as usual. If runemasters and DKs are the exact same(which they're not), then engineers and tinkers are the exact same thing. If we don't need runemaster because we have DK then we don't need tinkers because we have engineers.

[Teriz]

First of all, there is literally zero concrete evidence that tinkers would always pilot a mech so that's an invalid argument.

1. All three expansion classes got their ultimate abilities from WC3.

2. The Tinker’s ultimate in HOTS and WC3 both involved mech piloting.

For two, engineer items function exactly like your tinker concept.

Where’s the engineering mech capable of tanking a raid or a dungeon?

You're splitting hairs as usual. If runemasters and DKs are the exact same(which they're not), then engineers and tinkers are the exact same thing. If we don't need runemaster because we have DK then we don't need tinkers because we have engineers.

A class that uses Runes and Runic power as a resource, can affix various runes to empower their weapons, and can use rune-based magic isn’t a Runemaster how exactly?

[TheRevenantHero]

1. All three expansion classes got their ultimate abilities from WC3.

2. The Tinker’s ultimate in HOTS and WC3 both involved mech piloting.



Where’s the engineering mech tanking a raid or a dungeon?



A class that uses Runes and Runic power, can affix various runes to empower their weapons, and can use rune-based magic isn’t a Runemaster how exactly?

As always, HotS is 100% irrelevant since it has different mechanics and isn't a Warcraft game. Furthermore, you need to stop acting like your conjecture is facts.

There is absolutely nothing saying tinker will pilot a mech in raids/dungeons. That is completely your conjecture. And you concept of it won't happen since it would be giving tinkers two healthbars, which would be far too OP. Once again, by your logic, engineers and tinkers are the exact same thing.

Runemasters imbue their BODIES with runes, not just their weapons. And by your logic, that means that paladins and priests are the exact same since they both have the Light as their power source, can both heal, and have Light based abilities. Mages and elemental shamans are the exact same thing since they both use elemental spells and have mana as a power source. Warriors and bear druids are the exact same thing since they both have rage as a resource and can both tank.

Do you still how absolutely ridiculous your logic is now?

[datguy81]

Pretty sure the jailer & the Primus are both rune masters

[Triceron]

You’re talking about the ability to send a wave of ghosts that deal shadow damage. Priests currently have an ability that sends waves of ghosts that deal shadow damage. Haunting Wave is merely a more extreme example of an existing ability that easily fits in the Spriest spec.

A banshee is a type of apparition.

So.... why would they even need to give this ability to Priests when they already have their own version?

Seems redundant,, unthematic and better saved for an actual Dark Ranger class. Banshees don't even fit a Shadow Priest theme, they're undead spirits not creatures of the Void.

[Teriz]

As always, HotS is 100% irrelevant since it has different mechanics and isn't a Warcraft game. Furthermore, you need to stop acting like your conjecture is facts.

There is absolutely nothing saying tinker will pilot a mech in raids/dungeons. That is completely your conjecture. And you concept of it won't happen since it would be giving tinkers two healthbars, which would be far too OP. Once again, by your logic, engineers and tinkers are the exact same thing.

Death Knights got Death and Decay and a variation of Animate Dead.

Monks got Storm Earth and Fire.

Demon Hunters got Metamorphosis.

Why wouldn’t the Tinker get a version of Robo Goblin? Especially when we see mech riding be a very common trait among major Goblin and Gnome characters?

As for two health bars, why couldn’t the Tinker have a mechanic where their mech is destroyed and they survive and fight for a while in pilot mode until they can summon their mech again? You can put a similar limitation on that as the Shaman reincarnation ability which also essentially gives Shaman 2 life bars.

The point is this; Mech riding is a feature within the Tinker hero concept, and has a high chance of being the main feature. You can’t say that engineering does the exact same thing when it doesn’t offer that gameplay at all.

Runemasters imbue their BODIES with runes, not just their weapons.

Like Rune Tap?

And by your logic, that means that paladins and priests are the exact same since they both have the Light as their power source, can both heal, and have Light based abilities. Mages and elemental shamans are the exact same thing since they both use elemental spells and have mana as a power source. Warriors and bear druids are the exact same thing since they both have rage as a resource and can both tank.

Do you still how absolutely ridiculous your logic is now?

That’s your logic, not my logic. Blizzard themselves stated that they placed the Runemaster concept (whatever that is) into the Death Knight class. I have no idea why you’re denying that fact.

- - - Updated - - -

So.... why would they even need to give this ability to Priests when they already have their own version?

Seems redundant,, unthematic and better saved for an actual Dark Ranger class. Banshees don't even fit a Shadow Priest theme, they're undead spirits not creatures of the Void.

That isn’t their version, I’m saying that Haunting Wave fits in perfectly with Shadow Priests because they have existing similar thematic abilities.

[TheRevenantHero]

Death Knights got Death and Decay and a variation of Animate Dead.

Monks got Storm Earth and Fire.

Demon Hunters got Metamorphosis.

Why wouldn’t the Tinker get a version of Robo Goblin? Especially when we see mech riding be a very common trait among major Goblin and Gnome characters?

As for two health bars, why couldn’t the Tinker have a mechanic where their mech is destroyed and they survive and fight for a while in pilot mode until they can summon their mech again? You can put a similar limitation on that as the Shaman reincarnation ability which also essentially gives Shaman 2 life bars.

The point is this; Mech riding is a feature within the Tinker hero concept, and has a high chance of being the main feature. You can’t say that engineering does the exact same thing when it doesn’t offer that gameplay at all.



Like Rune Tap?



That’s your logic, not my logic. Blizzard themselves stated that they placed the Runemaster concept (whatever that is) into the Death Knight class. I have no idea why you’re denying that fact.

- - - Updated - - -



That isn’t their version, I’m saying that Haunting Wave fits in perfectly with Shadow Priests because they have existing similar thematic abilities.

Because giving a class two health bars is incredibly broken. If you can't see how wildly OP that is, I don't know what to tell you. Regardless, that isn't likely to happen at all. You're also wrong about it being part of the concept. The unit in WC3 wasn't riding a mech. They literally stopped being a goblin and fully turned into a robot. So you have no idea what the fuck you're talking about.

Rune tap is still the DK using the runes on their weapons. Runemasters don't lose their power if their weapon is gone. If you take away a DK's runeblade, they literally lose ALL their powers.

And it is your logic. You're claiming that DKs and Runemasters are the exact same because they both use runes, both use runic power as a power source, and can affix their weapons with runes. I gave three examples of already existing classes that, by your logic, are the exact same as each other. Hilarious how you disregard that because it doesn't fit your narrative.

Oh and explain how a clearly necromancy oriented ability fits with the theme of a class that uses VOID MAGIC. Haunting Wave doesn't fit shadow priests AT ALL.

[Teriz]

Because giving a class two health bars is incredibly broken. If you can't see how wildly OP that is, I don't know what to tell you. Regardless, that isn't likely to happen at all. You're also wrong about it being part of the concept. The unit in WC3 wasn't riding a mech. They literally stopped being a goblin and fully turned into a robot. So you have no idea what the fuck you're talking about.

Why would it be OP in Tinkers but not in the Shaman class?

Also:



That would be a Goblin riding a mech in WC3.

Rune tap is still the DK using the runes on their weapons. Runemasters don't lose their power if their weapon is gone. If you take away a DK's runeblade, they literally lose ALL their powers.

Except you can use Rune tap without any weapons equipped. You're using the Runes and the power they generate within your resources, which indicates that the runes are on the DK itself.

And it is your logic. You're claiming that DKs and Runemasters are the exact same because they both use runes, both use runic power as a power source, and can affix their weapons with runes. I gave three examples of already existing classes that, by your logic, are the exact same as each other. Hilarious how you disregard that because it doesn't fit your narrative.

I'm claiming that they're Runemasters because Blizzard placed the Runemaster concept into the DK class. It's the exact same reason why DKs are also Necromancers, since Blizzard placed the Necromancer concept in the DK class as well.

Oh and explain how a clearly necromancy oriented ability fits with the theme of a class that uses VOID MAGIC. Haunting Wave doesn't fit shadow priests AT ALL.

Haunted Wave sends a wave of ghosts. Shadowy Apparitions sends waves of ghosts at a target.

What's the difference?

[Deneios]

Banshees are ghosts. Each banshee is an entity of its own. Shadow priest apparitions are not entities of their own

[username993720]

Wrathion might not be a Dragonsworn, but if there were any major lore character to attach any Dragon-themed class around, it'd likely be him.

I mean, the Aspects and Chromie are well established lore figures to draw from too, but they're not as forward as Wrathion when it comes to calling on mortal champions.

And you don't need an exact title of the class to be the face of the class itself. Kel'thuzad shed his mortal being and became a full-on Lich but he's still tied heavily as an important figurehead of the Necromancer class. Or how Thrall is the figurehead of the Shamans but he lost all his Shamanic powers (should we even still be calling Thrall a Shaman?).

Attaching the most popular character around to an RPG class doesn't make it true.
You know what a Dragonsworn is (hint: the answer is in the name)? a mortal pledging allegiance/loyalty to a Dragon/Dragonflight and getting powers/knowledge/artifacts in return.
However cool that made-up concept is, Wrathion is a Dragon, himself. A Dragonsworn would be more along the lines of Night elves followers of Ysera.

Kel'thuzad's Human Necromancer form is the associated image, not his Lich form.

Thrall has, always, been an iconic Shaman - losing his powers or not, we didn't call him one because we felt like it.

We're definitely heading towards that. Turalyon leading the Alliance will be a gamechanger.

And as much as I like the idea of shaking things up and having get some overzealous and fanatical leaders, I feel like this is too on-the-nose.

The only class i can associate with that theme is the Shadow Hunter (even if not in abilities, but in description).

I see ghosts/evil spirits. Priests have abilities like that.

Void duplicates, not Banshees.
Are you seriously saying the Priest is a Dark Ranger? It can't even use a bow.

Blizzard didn’t go out of its way to make DH and DK improbable from a lore perspective. Not only is there a gameplay barrier, Blizzard has been purposely pushing the notion that DRs are merely undead Hunters for quite some time.

-_-
We've been there before.
Blizzard, deliberately and clearly, pushed the Demon Hunter to the Demonology Warlock -a thing that lasted for 4 expansions.

A nice turn around after you said they were likely. Clearly, you're trying to avoid detection before unleashing the dog shit.

Nathanos is already dead, and Sylvanas is heading for the meat grinder. It’s fairly obvious at this point.

We're in the land of the dead, where he is at. -_-
It's not fairly obvious. You want it to be. At this point, we don't know what the future hold and whether she'll survive or not. Look at Azshara. She survived her encounter so that she'll have more screen time in the future.

Again, Priestd have abilities like Shadowy Apparition Mindbender, Fade, Psychic Horror, and Dispersion. How are those any different thematically than Haunting Wave?

One's Void, the other's Death.
Stop trolling -_-

Engineering would need to be a class with actual Tinker abilities for that comparison to work.

Neither is the Runemaster a class.
How convenient is that things apply to your agenda only.

What’s the difference between a Priest sending out a wave of Psyfiends or Shadow appirations and Sylvanas sending out a wave of Banshees? It’s the same thing in general.

It's not. read the lore.
And, stop trolling. It's getting annoying.

You’re talking about the ability to send a wave of ghosts that deal shadow damage. Priests currently have an ability that sends waves of ghosts that deal shadow damage. Haunting Wave is merely a more extreme example of an existing ability that easily fits in the Spriest spec.

A banshee is a type of apparition.

Again with the similarity in function -_-
Many classes have overlapping abilities.
You, clearly, trying to aggravate people here, on purpose.

Items and abilities aren’t the same thing.

but different lore ones are? -_-
It's getting tiresome to deal with your shenanigans.

Uh no. One is piloting a mech with advanced weaponry, and the other is crafting items for selling. That’s not the same thing,

Here we go again...
Attempting to distort things to fit your agenda. *sigh*

A class that uses Runes and Runic power as a resource, can affix various runes to empower their weapons, and can use rune-based magic isn’t a Runemaster how exactly?

It isn't a martial artist.
It only uses domination runes, not other runes.
Same thing as always, trying to belittle lore.

You can’t say that engineering does the exact same thing when it doesn’t offer that gameplay at all.

And you can't claim things are the same when lore-wise they are different.

That isn’t their version, I’m saying that Haunting Wave fits in perfectly with Shadow Priests because they have existing similar thematic abilities.

And Robo-goblin would fit perfectly inside Engineering as a small, mostly cosmetic, cooldown.

See how i can change things to fit my narrative?

I'm claiming that they're Runemasters because Blizzard placed the Runemaster concept into the DK class. It's the exact same reason why DKs are also Necromancers, since Blizzard placed the Necromancer concept in the DK class as well.

*1/2 Runemaster.
Its runic aspects were integrated into the Death Knight while its martial arts were integrated into the Monk. This is not debatable, this is a fact.

Haunted Wave sends a wave of ghosts. Shadowy Apparitions sends waves of ghosts at a target.

What's the difference?

Ghosts is a general term.
Priests use the Void.
Dark Rangers use Death.
It's like saying both Paladins and Priests use the light, Death Knights and Mages use frost, Mages and Warlocks use fire, Warlocks and Demon Hunters use fel, and therefore, there's no need to separate between them. But, you know that wouldn't be right.

[Azerox]

Necromancer but with 2 healing specs.
I want to have a dark-healer.

[Teriz]

Banshees are ghosts.

Apparitions are also ghosts.

- - - Updated - - -

Void duplicates, not Banshees.
Are you seriously saying the Priest is a Dark Ranger? It can't even use a bow.

I'm saying that the core concept of the Banshee is currently in the Shadow Priest spec. Silence and Possession. The Priests shooting out ghosts is no different than Sylvanas shooting out ghosts.

-_-
We've been there before.
Blizzard, deliberately and clearly, pushed the Demon Hunter to the Demonology Warlock -a thing that lasted for 4 expansions.

A nice turn around after you said they were likely. Clearly, you're trying to avoid detection before unleashing the dog shit.

But Blizzard always showed Illidan capable of reproducing Demon Hunters like himself, complete with the ability to perform Metamorphosis. Sylvanas has never reproduced a Dark Ranger with Banshee abilities. At best she created undead Rangers and Hunters like Nathanos and Daelyn Summermoon. So yeah, while the Demon Hunter's abilities were largely farmed out to other classes, the DH never had that lore barrier that Dark Rangers have had. Blizzard has increased that lore barrier by pretty much denying a Dark Ranger class in Shadowlands, placing Dark Rangers in the Hunter Class hall, killing Nathanos, merging the DRs raised on Darkshore with the Forsaken, and putting Sylvanas up for the chopping block. Unless something dramatic occurs, the potential of a Dark Ranger class concept ends in 9.1.

One's Void, the other's Death.
Stop trolling -_-

In terms of gameplay, it's all shadow.

Neither is the Runemaster a class.

No, just a concept that was obviously placed in the Death Knight class per Blizzard.

None of the Tinker's abilities were placed in the engineering profession. That's the difference.

Ghosts is a general term.
Priests use the Void.
Dark Rangers use Death.
It's like saying both Paladins and Priests use the light, Death Knights and Mages use frost, Mages and Warlocks use fire, Warlocks and Demon Hunters use fel, and therefore, there's no need to separate between them. But, you know that wouldn't be right.

Void and Death are all Shadow magic in gameplay terms.

Those classes you mentioned provide differing gameplay opportunities despite some spec similarities. For example, Warlocks have demonic pets, while Mages do not. Paladins are heavily armored melee reinforced by holy magic, while Priests have no damage-dealing holy specs, and only have a damage-dealing shadow-based spec, something Paladins don't have.

A Dark Ranger would offer nothing that the Hunter class currently doesn't offer.

[Cosmic Janitor]

Necromancer but with 2 healing specs.
I want to have a dark-healer.

Doesn't sound like much of a necromancer.. at least make it a dps/heal/tank split . (so blatantly copying ESO..)

[TheRevenantHero]

Why would it be OP in Tinkers but not in the Shaman class?

Also:



That would be a Goblin riding a mech in WC3.



Except you can use Rune tap without any weapons equipped. You're using the Runes and the power they generate within your resources, which indicates that the runes are on the DK itself.



I'm claiming that they're Runemasters because Blizzard placed the Runemaster concept into the DK class. It's the exact same reason why DKs are also Necromancers, since Blizzard placed the Necromancer concept in the DK class as well.



Haunted Wave sends a wave of ghosts. Shadowy Apparitions sends waves of ghosts at a target.

What's the difference?

The goblin tinker ability in that picture is called mecha-goblin. And according to the text from WC3, they stop being humanoid and become 100% mechanical. They're not piloting the mech. They ARE the mech.

Yeah you're gonna need to link something that has Blizzard saying that because I tried googling it and didn't find anything.

Shadowy Apparitions doesn't summon ghosts. It sends a shadowy copy of the caster at an enemy to deal Void damage. So it's not ghosts and isn't necromancy. Which is why giving them Haunted Wave makes no god damned sense.

[Traveler Voltin]

Necromancer but with 2 healing specs.
I want to have a dark-healer.

that doesnt sound like a necromancer than. sounds like something else.

[Teriz]

The goblin tinker ability in that picture is called mecha-goblin. And according to the text from WC3, they stop being humanoid and become 100% mechanical. They're not piloting the mech. They ARE the mech.

That's simply a gameplay description for someone inside a vehicle. Think about it; If you were piloting a tank, your enemy would need to the destroy the tank in order to destroy you. Also if you look at the graphic, the Goblin is literally sitting inside the vehicle.

I also think this is quite interesting;



Because it could justify a Tinker class wearing robotic suits ala Ironman, and thusly open up the class to other races.

Yeah you're gonna need to link something that has Blizzard saying that because I tried googling it and didn't find anything.

Find anything on what? I don't know what you're talking about here. Please clarify.

Shadowy Apparitions doesn't summon ghosts. It sends a shadowy copy of the caster at an enemy to deal Void damage. So it's not ghosts and isn't necromancy. Which is why giving them Haunted Wave makes no god damned sense.

Again, apparition literally means "ghost". The talent that boosts this ability is called Auspicious Spirits. So yes, you are summoning ghosts.

[datguy81]

WC3 the tinker becomes the Mech

Robo-Goblin (Ultimate)
Transforms the Tinker into a Robo-Goblin, a powerful armored form that has the following traits:
-Bonus Strength and armor.
-Use of the Demolish ability, which grants bonus damage against buildings.
-The Tinker becomes mechanical, rendering him immune to stun, most offensive spells, and several beneficial spells