people right about Sylvanas after all?

[Deleted]

WARNING! Reading through this entire thread could make you upset and mad.



since the leaking information of Sylvanas' actions in cataclysm there have been intense discussions about what she's really up to, her motivations and the consequences in a near future. almost all threads were flamewars and trollfeasts between "zealots", "emos" and "casuals" who dont care. myself have always defended her image against all gryffindor-boys and loved her whole story. but then i read this after coming from my summer vacation:

Q: What is the Argent Crusade's relationship with the Forsaken, in light of Sylvanas's recent actions?
A: Although the members of the Argent Crusade still stand by the Forsaken heroes who joined them in the battle against the Scourge, Sylvanas's actions since the slaying of Arthas have deeply concerned the crusaders. They, along with certain members of the Ebon Blade, are now watching Sylvanas and the Forsaken very closely, as similarities between her and the Lich King are increasing in number by the day.

yeah. they r totally making her a villain sooner or later. just put down the only cool character left in the lore. im surprised i dont care anymore tbh. after experiensing blizzard attempts to create new fresh lore in this xpac it was only a matter of time before it happened. cuz lore is now controlled by the need of new content to kill and loot. no depth. or can we still hope that a good surprise is around the corner? that there will be a horde vs tirion + mograine? a 4th war? maybe not, since "there is no money" for such awesomeness.

what r your last theories about sylvanas and the forsaken before blizzard surprises us with new predictable content?

[Zaelsino]

I wouldn't count on anything too drastic happening to her... at least until the next world-changing cataclysm.

[Weightless]

since the leaking information of Sylvanas' actions in cataclysm there have been intense discussions about what she's really up to, her motivations and the consequences in a near future. almost all threads were flamewars and trollfeasts between "zealots", "emos" and "casuals" who dont care. myself have always defended her image against all gryffindor-boys and loved her whole story. but then i read this after coming from my summer vacation:



yeah. they r totally making her a villain sooner or later. just put down the only cool character left in the lore. im surprised i dont care anymore tbh. after experiensing blizzard attempts to create new fresh lore in this xpac it was only a matter of time before it happened. cuz lore is now controlled by the need of new content to kill and loot. no depth. or can we still hope that a good surprise is around the corner? that there will be a horde vs tirion + mograine? a 4th war? maybe not, since "there is no money" for such awesomeness.

what r your last theories about sylvanas and the forsaken before blizzard surprises us with new predictable content?

I heard Sylvanas drops my BiS neck, that's all I care about.


/trollface

[Deleted]

It wasn't predictable, atleast when WoW started. Her character development is amazing and has spanned all the way through WoW leading to the moment we may or may not kill her. I personaly loved her story however if she must die for the good of all then so be it.
As for my theory; the horde has a contempt of sylvanas' actions of using the val'kyr to create new forsaken, so there wont be a horde v tirion+darion; So chances are she's going to be another Kael which is sad but to be honest i did not imagine her doing this, she herself hates the curse put on her so why this shift i dont know (and propably only one troll on mmo champ actualy know but he wont share).
The unfortunate truth however is that blizz cant just get rid of the forsaken meaning we wont see a cure for undeath... so i think we will end up killing her (please no mearly a setbacks XD).

[Deleted]

first time reading that. always seen her as evil from my human point of view, that doesnt matter and shouldnt be put as obvious in a fantasy game. i like her for being the last anti-hero(ine) standing with a big community supporting her. but if i say "she and her personality doesnt belong in warcraft" i would portray this game as childish and offend 20+ people. so im also hoping for a total war in azeroth or atleast a third faction. if she dies ppl will leave for sure... not to mention some female players that might take it personal

[Baker St Irregulars]

It wasn't predictable, atleast when WoW started. Her character development is amazing and has spanned all the way through WoW leading to the moment we may or may not kill her. I personaly loved her story however if she must die for the good of all then so be it.
As for my theory; the horde has a contempt of sylvanas' actions of using the val'kyr to create new forsaken, so there wont be a horde v tirion+darion; So chances are she's going to be another Kael which is sad but to be honest i did not imagine her doing this, she herself hates the curse put on her so why this shift i dont know (and propably only one troll on mmo champ actualy know but he wont share).
The unfortunate truth however is that blizz cant just get rid of the forsaken meaning we wont see a cure for undeath... so i think we will end up killing her (please no mearly a setbacks XD).

I take it you never quested in Arathi, or quested as a horde where you poison people to turn them into forsaken. In fact, I read up on the horde quests before I began playing and that was the major reason why I do not play horde. I find the horde to be morally reprehensible.

This was all true from the beginning. Sylvanas would have to be killed.

[Frioz]

I take it you never quested in Arathi, or quested as a horde where you poison people to turn them into forsaken.

This was all true from the beginning. Sylvanas would have to be killed.

Silly alliance, you make it sound like being forsaken is a bad thing. We are helping people to become better.

[Deleted]

I take it you never quested in Arathi, or quested as a horde where you poison people to turn them into forsaken. In fact, I read up on the horde quests before I began playing and that was the major reason why I do not play horde. I find the horde to be morally reprehensible.

This was all true from the beginning. Sylvanas would have to be killed.

You can say that now.

[Deleted]

Thats the thing though, the forsaken are really not meant to be the good guys. They are the playable scourge and they (and their queen) have some thick plot armor because of it.

[Deleted]

no one will quit playing wow just because Sylvanas died, they might if its a crapt battle for UC remake where Garrosh derp slaps her once and she dies XD
Also i forgot to mention she is/was posibly holding Calia Menethil prisioner, so there is a lot more we have to know about before we can even say when/if Sylvanas will die.

[Baker St Irregulars]

first time reading that. always seen her as evil from my human point of view, that doesnt matter and shouldnt be put as obvious in a fantasy game. i like her for being the last anti-hero(ine) standing with a big community supporting her.

There's a massive difference between being an Anti-hero and being a Villain.

Anti-heroes do the right thing, for the right reasons, in the wrong way.

She's never done the right thing. She's always done the self serving thing.

---------- Post added 2011-07-06 at 12:01 PM ----------

You can say that now.

I said it back then.
I said it 3 years ago.
I said it 2 years ago.
I'm saying it now.

The fact you and others didn't see it really screams volumes as to how much you paid attention to the quest lore.

---------- Post added 2011-07-06 at 12:02 PM ----------

Silly alliance, you make it sound like being forsaken is a bad thing. We are helping people to become better.

OH I get it. Ethnic Cleansing against people's will through genetic manipulation and murder.

:eyeroll:

[Deleted]

There's a massive difference between being an Anti-hero and being a Villain.

Anti-heroes do the right thing, for the right reasons, in the wrong way.

She's never done the right thing. She's always done the self serving thing.

if she does what she must for her own benefit or the future of her people is a matter of perspective. thats what makes her to such an interesting and mysterious person to have in this game. and a real pity to not be used by the cretive developers to its fullest for a really nice story.

[Frioz]

OH I get it. Ethnic Cleansing against people's will through genetic manipulation and murder.

:eyeroll:

Dam, what they tell me is true, I should put /sarcasm at the end of my posts.

Or save enough money to buy this thing,

[Deleted]

I take it you never quested in Arathi, or quested as a horde where you poison people to turn them into forsaken. In fact, I read up on the horde quests before I began playing and that was the major reason why I do not play horde. I find the horde to be morally reprehensible.

Actualy my main is a Blood elf, Garrosh is a basterd but he is growing up slowly, he dosn't like sylvanas at all he tolerates her; tbh i would love to hack off his head too. Dont say the horde are bad guys, think tauren and some trolls...

[hightides24]

OH I get it. Ethnic Cleansing against people's will through genetic manipulation and murder.

:eyeroll:

Even if it's against their will, it doesn't mean it's the wrong thing. It's like when your pet is sick and you take it to the vet to get cured, but the pet doesn't know you're trying to help it, so you have to force it to get better against its will.

[Thage]

Bakers, Sylvanas's goal has always been Forsaken dominance. How is that any different from Garrosh's goal of orcish dominance, Varian's goal of human dominance over the Horde, Lor'themar's elven supremacist stance, or the night elf race's xenophobic, elven-supremacist stance? What she's always done is what's best for the Forsaken--she doesn't care about the other races because they're not her responsibility or her problem.

Do I agree with Blizzard's schitzophrenic portrayals of her in Cataclysm as an antihero devoted to her peoples' survival, an antivillain plaguebombing civilian settlements to discourage Alliance incursions, and flat-out cackling villainous behaviors at different times? No, but by and large, from her own mouth, her number one and only concern in a world without the Lich King is doing what's best for the Forsaken. She isn't nice, she isn't altruistic--the Horde are her allies of convenience and the Alliance are her enemies. War is hell, shit happens, and at the end of the day she's still doing what's best for her people, not what's best for her enemies.

[Deleted]

I said it back then.
I said it 3 years ago.
I said it 2 years ago.
I'm saying it now.

The fact you and others didn't see it really screams volumes as to how much you paid attention to the quest lore.

Who says I didn't see it coming? When I first heard of WoW I couldn't even believe the Forsaken were playable and joined the Horde. Don't make assumptions based an absolutely nothing.

But saying things like "I knew it all along" makes it feel like you want to come across cleverer and cooler than the rest.

[Deleted]

no one will quit playing wow just because Sylvanas died, they might if its a crapt battle for UC remake where Garrosh derp slaps her once and she dies XD
Also i forgot to mention she is/was posibly holding Calia Menethil prisioner, so there is a lot more we have to know about before we can even say when/if Sylvanas will die.

i think that lore people will lose moral to play a shallow game. dont underestimate the power of a good plot to make profit

[Baker St Irregulars]

if she does what she must for her own benefit or the future of her people is a matter of perspective. thats what makes her to such an interesting and mysterious person to have in this game. and a real pity to not be used by the cretive developers to its fullest for a really nice story.

LOL It's not "a matter of perspective". Good and evil are not equatable to "perspective".

She is committing acts of murder to sustain her own power base. She doesn't give a rat's butt about anyone else but herself. She is a vile contemptible creature and does not fit the definition of "anti-hero".

---------- Post added 2011-07-06 at 12:08 PM ----------

Even if it's against their will, it doesn't mean it's the wrong thing. It's like when your pet is sick and you take it to the vet to get cured, but the pet doesn't know you're trying to help it, so you have to force it to get better against its will.

Honestly, this is the most asinine argument I've ever seen. It's the same argument ethnic cleansers use to "purify the soul" of their victims and "save the earth" from the wrath of god.

There is no way you can argue this and be morally right.

[Frioz]

Actualy my main is a Blood elf, Garrosh is a basterd but he is growing up slowly, he dosn't like sylvanas at all he tolerates her; tbh i would love to hack off his head too. Dont say the horde are bad guys, think tauren and some trolls...

The political pony is right, you shouldn't judge the horde since it is not as cetralize as the alliance. The BE just want to rebuild, the trolls want to just chill out, the cow people want to be left alone, and goblins would probably start a massive prostitution business if they could atm instead of going to war.