Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Makabreska]

And absolutely destroy any semblance of lore left. Woohoo!

Don't exaggerate, pls. Pretty much every class-race combo can be reasonably explained, lore wise. Druid gnomes can be simply gnomes who got exposed to druidic ways and got captivated by them. It happens all the time in fantasy genre, when unlikely combinations occur with individuals who experience a different calling.

[Khaza-R]

Nothing wrong with locked race / class combos. But if that's the route you're going to take with lore then you need to add actual fluff to justify why there's cultural and racial differences for such restrictions. Modern WoW has been devoid of that for years and almost never gets that intricate when adding new lore. So I can see why they are moving to the more Hearthstone-esque design of everyone can be everything.

[Darkarath]

I used to be against all races being all classes. But now I am in favor of it. I welcome that freedom.

I know that in some cases it could seem weird, but at the end of the day, even a Tauren could be a rogue, probably 1 in 10.000 taurens has the skills for being a rogue, but it still could happen, so why should not we be able to experience that role? Along with these changes they should really start making almost everything account-wide, things like reputations and gold, its about time.

[Xilurm]

Don't exaggerate, pls. Pretty much every class-race combo can be reasonably explained, lore wise. Druid gnomes can be simply gnomes who got exposed to druidic ways and got captivated by them. It happens all the time in fantasy genre, when unlikely combinations occur with individuals who experience a different calling.

Yeah but how many? Are they going to be adding tons of NPC's like that around the world? Or is it just going to be a couple at best? Is there going to be a lot of lore surrounding them or just a tiny event that happens in a massive world.

[Ersula]

This might have flown when classic launched but we’re now 18 years of lore development beyond DND and 10 years beyond Them using DND concepts in the Rpg.

You say that like the cribbing from the forgotten realms thing wow does is a thing of the past when it's happening constantly. The setting of a sealed-off, untouched world ruled by elementals & dragons is just the origin story of Abeir-Toril, the forgotten realms being sundered into two parallel worlds, or Revendreth just being Ravenloft, etc.

[Makabreska]

Yeah but how many? Are they going to be adding tons of NPC's like that around the world? Or is it just going to be a couple at best? Is there going to be a lot of lore surrounding them or just a tiny event that happens in a massive world.

I don't member having lot's of lore dropped on us in Cata, with last class/race combo addition. Biggest were Taurens palas, with their sun worship. Gnome priests were just some healers, dwarf sham were Wildhammer, dwarf mages/locks were simply Dark Iron. Troll druids were Loa followers, everybody could be a hunter etc. For example - Draenein locks, probably the most egregious combo, could be Eredars returning back after Legion fall. We immediately accepted DK's, why not them?

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You say that like the cribbing from the forgotten realms thing wow does is a thing of the past when it's happening constantly. The setting of a sealed-off, untouched world ruled by elementals & dragons is just the origin story of Abeir-Toril, the forgotten realms being sundered into two parallel worlds, or Revendreth just being Ravenloft, etc.

Oooof, what will you be wrong about this time, hmm?

[AngerFork]

I don't member having lot's of lore dropped on us in Cata, with last class/race combo addition. Biggest were Taurens palas, with their sun worship. Gnome priests were just some healers, dwarf sham were Wildhammer, dwarf mages/locks were simply Dark Iron. Troll druids were Loa followers, everybody could be a hunter etc. For example - Draenein locks, probably the most egregious combo, could be Eredars returning back after Legion fall. We immediately accepted DK's, why not them?

Don't forget about the Night Elf Mage NPCs that went back to Darnassus to push for the Highborne being allowed back into Night Elven culture. Small thing to be sure, but it absolutely helped to make the world feel alive.

I'm definitely hoping we get a few of these NPCs scattered around for some of the new combos as they are added in. An Eredar Warlock from the Legion as you mentioned would be a solid choice. I'm still not sure how to make a Mag'har Paladin work given what they saw on their world, but I have to feel like it would start with Liadrin showing the Mag'har where the Light can still be good. Void Elf Shaman would also be a bit of a reach...an NPC or quest showing how the elements could ever really trust a being that heard from the Void that much might be useful.

[Nymrohd]

Oh my, Mind Spike may be coming back? Maybe we'll get a non-dot, non-Void form shadow priest?

[Lorgar Aurelian]

You say that like the cribbing from the forgotten realms thing wow does is a thing of the past when it's happening constantly. The setting of a sealed-off, untouched world ruled by elementals & dragons is just the origin story of Abeir-Toril, the forgotten realms being sundered into two parallel worlds, or Revendreth just being Ravenloft, etc.

Just gonna copy from the wiki but do you really think dragon flight is the same as this?

Abeir-Toril was one of many worlds that appeared after Ao crafted Realmspace out of the phlogiston.[3] Though barren and devoid of life, creatures of manifest entropy and elemental nature known as the primordials began to appear in Realmspace, coveting those worlds.[8] Unknown to the primordials, the first gods also began to appear in Realmspace. Selûne and Shar were the first ones[8], and they began to create life on the world of Abeir-Toril, creating the goddess Chauntea and the sun to sustain that life.[9]

When the twin goddesses became aware of the threat of the primordials, they rallied all the gods to defend the virgin worlds, even summoning gods from other dimensions to aid the native gods in the war.[8] This conflict was later known as the Dawn War.[10] While the gods and primordials battled for ages, life flourished on Abeir-Toril.[8]

The first lifeforms on Abeir-Toril were aberrant, however. Beings from the Far Realm who tried to gain a foothold in Realmspace,[5] among them the Eldest, the oldest-known aboleth and possibly the progenitor of the entire species.[7] The gods also opposed against them, and the Cerulean Sign was a rune of power created during this time by the gods to oppose those beings.[5]

It was the end of the Shadow Epoch, during the last period of the Days of Thunder, that a conflict between the titans and the batrachi sparked. To defeat their enemies, the batrachi summoned many primordials from their imprisonment. The gods quickly moved to battle their ancient foes, and a primordial called "Asgoroth the World Shaper" hurled an ice moon down to the surface of Merrouroboros in an event known as the Tearfall, intending to destroy the world she could not claim as their own.[3][11]

It was this action that finally spurred Ao to action, leading to the "changing of stars", in which the world was separated into two twin planets, Abeir and Toril. Ao gave the primordials control over Abeir, while retaining sovereignty over Toril for the gods.[12] When Abeir-Toril was sundered, the city of Xxiphu, the realm of the aboleth, remained on Abeir.[6]

Those events were unknown to Faerûnian sages until after the Spellplague, when the dragonborn of Abeir and the sarrukhs of Okoth revealed forgotten lore regarding the ancient past.[3]

[Makabreska]

Oh my, Mind Spike may be coming back? Maybe we'll get a non-dot, non-Void form shadow priest?

Non-Void form? That is our major CD.

[tristannarutofan]

Nothing wrong with locked race / class combos. But if that's the route you're going to take with lore then you need to add actual fluff to justify why there's cultural and racial differences for such restrictions. Modern WoW has been devoid of that for years and almost never gets that intricate when adding new lore. So I can see why they are moving to the more Hearthstone-esque design of everyone can be everything.

Fact is rvery race Can be every class and there is no reason to think otherwise. What class restrictions represented is what was COMMON. A gnome paladin is possible, but with their culture its unlikely.

And indeep players tend to enforce these things. Most ppl pick lf draenei to be paladins or priests, most ppl pick nightborne to be mages. A few ppl being tauren rogues doesnt stop that. Its just confirmation bias. Zero gnome druids before so any new ones are more obvious. But the majority of certain races are stilll their prefered classes

[Raetary]

Good fucking riddance Searing Nightmare.

[Ersula]

Sorry but u are definately confusing Tropes and specifics. A fantasy world ruled by fantasy monsters made of magic isnt unique, nore is a world of vampires.

Just gonna copy from the wiki but do you really think dragon flight is the same as this?

"If it's not exactly the same, it doesn't count." I bet you'd also say Selune has nothing to do with Elune.

You're so sure you're right about something you have no familiarity with: You're missing the part where the Dragon Rulers of Abier created a prismatic race of dragons to serve as troops in an apocalyptical war against otherworldly invaders. "These are just tropes." No, they're far to specific.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Fact is rvery race Can be every class and there is no reason to think otherwise. What class restrictions represented is what was COMMON. A gnome paladin is possible, but with their culture its unlikely.

And indeep players tend to enforce these things. Most ppl pick lf draenei to be paladins or priests, most ppl pick nightborne to be mages. A few ppl being tauren rogues doesnt stop that. Its just confirmation bias. Zero gnome druids before so any new ones are more obvious. But the majority of certain races are stilll their prefered classes

This really doesn’t work in every case without changing established lore or coming up with new lore.

A Mag'har orc can’t stay uncorrupted and be a warlock, a worgen can’t be a paladin due to the nature of the curse and controlling the light, a void elf or light forged can’t be a DH due to the effects of mixing magics, and Mabye a few other examples I can’t think of off the top of my head.

So while they could absolutely just change retcon the lore or come up with new work arounds currently a few combos just shouldn’t be possible.

[Alanar]

Mind spike hype! Aoe changes, dark avengelism.

Interesting.

[tristannarutofan]

You say that like the cribbing from the forgotten realms thing wow does is a thing of the past when it's happening constantly. The setting of a sealed-off, untouched world ruled by elementals & dragons is just the origin story of Abeir-Toril, the forgotten realms being sundered into two parallel worlds, or Revendreth just being Ravenloft, etc.

Sorry but u are definately confusing Tropes and specifics. A fantasy world ruled by fantasy monsters made of magic isnt unique, nore is a world of vampires.

And thrn there is the fact that there isnt a single piece of fantasy that isnt inspired by something else. Thats what is fun about it!. Every video game dev is a nerd who watched the same shows and played the same games u did

[Lady Atia]

This really doesn’t work in every case without changing established lore or coming up with new lore.

A Mag'har orc can’t stay uncorrupted and be a warlock, a worgen can’t be a paladin due to the nature of the curse and controlling the light, a void elf or light forged can’t be a DH due to the effects of mixing magics, and Mabye a few other examples I can’t think of off the top of my head.

So while they could absolutely just change retcon the lore or come up with new work arounds currently a few combos just shouldn’t be possible.

Mag'har Warlocks would be Affli only in lore, just like Lightforged Priests currently are holy only lore-wise. You can be a worgen priest, so there is literally no reason you couldn't wear plate armour and become a Paladin. HFC had a void revenant infused with fel and you can be a void elf warlock already, no reason you couldn't be a voidelf dh.

There are literally 0 race/class combos where you can't just write new lore for them, honestly.

[tristannarutofan]

Yeah because in dungeon and dragons the players make the story, sure there's a setting but it was made with lots of freedom of choice in mind. That ain't the case for Warcraft. You got Races with their own identity and culture.

I understand having a Night Elf paladin for example, if their spells had different names and visuals and they had their own specific armour. But I'm afraid that won't be the case. Which is just lazy.

Identit and culture dont mean anything. Anime and japanese and japanese history are something from japan but otakus are a plague on this world. Most people dont play chess but enough do to still have chess tournaments. If only .0001% of a demographic exists then there are many

[Therougetitan]

Non-Void form? That is our major CD.

It has only been the major CD since Legion after they took meta out from demo warlocks and decided to give a builder/spender to maintain a form to Spriests instead. Peak shadow priest was in MoP then followed up by WoD with dark evangelism and options like clarity of power. As long as void form is central to the spec it will limit the spec.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

"If it's not exactly the same, it doesn't count." I bet you'd also say Selune has nothing to do with Elune.

Yes some where that was barren and devoid of life, had some gods show up and make the Sun and then had a war which involved another god throwing the moon at it only has minor differences from what we are getting in dragon flight your right.