Why do HC raiding guilds say 'no' to females?

[Soahar]

I'd like to see logs, ranks and armories of all these ''best player i ever saw and it was a girl!!!!''

And yes, they do cause more drama. This is not being offensive, this is fact.

I'd like to see a source for this so called fact of your

[Mefistophelis]

from that list I think they are at least noobs . go get another guild.

[Deleted]

because they're immature people that can't deal with the opposite sex.

[Nnyco]

group of immature boys are afraid to get outperformed by girls, i guess that summs it up pretty good

[Lobstarrr]

I'd like to see a source for this so called fact of your

Try using your common sense as source, it's evident everywhere where females are present, not just WoW guilds.

[sulfuric]

group of immature boys are afraid to get outperformed by girls, i guess that summs it up pretty good

TOP guilds. Not bottom guilds, in top guilds no one is afraid to get out preformed by anyone.

[Tearrs]

Only guilds who are not lead well enough to deal with potential drama will not accept females. Any well structured, well lead guild can easily deal with any drama that a member (male for female) can bring.

[Aaldarius]

I don't think most high-end raiding guilds (H-Madness by at least March/April) have an issue with recruiting based on gender. As much as the common belief that females would flirt their way to the top, a chunk of them do not try with the super high-end guilds. Those high end guilds usually can snuff that out pretty quickly. I have been grateful to play with women players that were very nice this expansion, not the greatest but they were reliably good. Maybe it's just a healer legendary thing.

[Tierst]

This.

Speaking from experience and not just agreement. Probably could list the amount of players I have raided with in my 7 years that were female, could definitely count them on one hand, and four out of the five were dramatic and whiny. One was not only anything but this, but also a superb player and I believe still raiding as a MT in one of our servers top guilds. Our bears sometimes cross paths.

I also found that those same 4 were part of the guild(s) purely due to partners also being there.. this led to such situations where we would lack 2 players at a time rather than one, cause even if they were available they would refuse to raid/sit on alts as there SO's weren't online.

And of course lastly, as mentioned, knowing a female is 'watching' so to speak it can bring out the worst in some players, even mature ones you wouldn't expect it from. Whatever the reason.

So in this sense wouldn't they also ban gay couples? 'Cause at that point it wouldn't matter what the gender, if it was couples in general that were causing the problem...

Either way, I've only met a handful of females while playing that were decent players - not only that but didn't have the common sense of a 5 year old.
More often than not they're manipulative, and they use their gender accordingly. It's sad, and it hurts all the others who don't shove their gender into conversations, but so many have done it, it has become a stereotype.

I don't think it really matters one way or another - I'm sure that those guilds would recruit a female if they knew them and could trust them. The problem is, that's hard to do now days (as far as on the spot recruiting). You can't really tell what someone is going to be like until you've spent some time with them.

That being said, it's still just as likely that a guy could cause just as much drama (if not in the same way). I think with females though is they tend to pit guild members against each other (he said she said) with jealousy, one up's and elaborate favors. Where as guy drama could just be a singularly isolated problem (within himself - i.e. not happy with loot, upset at another guildie for talking trash, etc) all things that are (probably) much more minor.

I've been in SEVERAL guilds over the years that have either lost a large group of raiders due to female drama, or have broken apart due to it. I have only ever heard of one or two (that are close to me or personal) that have broken up or lost members due to 'male drama'. It's ESPECIALLY bad when a female wile's her way into officer or leader positions...

But like I said, there ARE females out there who arn't like this. A lot of them are some of my closest friends. Unfortunately they are few and far in between all the rotten eggs.

[Vvulf]

I'd like to see logs, ranks and armories of all these ''best player i ever saw and it was a girl!!!!''

And yes, they do cause more drama. This is not being offensive, this is fact.

Use wowheroes. Realm: EU - Auchindoun, Mionee. From the wowheroes site links you can go to latest armory, World of Logs etc.
She's in a different guild now, but if you check the date of her Heroic Deathwing kill, you'll notice she was a raider in Silent, World Rank #8.
Aside from being a good raider in current content, she is arguably the best player in the world at soloing old content. Check it out.

[zpiff]

I think the Harsh tone in progress guilds can be too much for some female raiders.
And moste guilds fear the drama, that happens sooner or later.
We have a female raider in oure guild. and she is doing pretty well, i would go as far to say she's a really good player.
But some of the former female raiders. diten have the "Balls" to take the hit if they screwup. again and again.. same with wery young boys..
I gotta admit im the one shouting in oure guild. i cant justyfi spending houres wiping on a boss, that should have been down. 50 trys. earlyer cou some one was too proud to ask a 2'nd or 20'th time. and just keept doing what he ot she was doing. in my xp. its the female raider that does it.
I think thats some og the reasons. alot of progress guilds dont want female raiders.
But to say in a recruitment post. dont applay if your a woman. is really a bad ider. there is alot of super good female players out there.

[Crimsonfiend76]

I'd like to see logs, ranks and armories of all these ''best player i ever saw and it was a girl!!!!''

And yes, they do cause more drama. This is not being offensive, this is fact.

actually that isnt a fact but an opinion. fact is ive been in hardcore and semi-hardcore guilds going back to TBC, and most eventually imploded...and of those, all but 1 were led by men who allowed their own epeen to get in the way of what was best for the guild. in each and every case they had nothing to with female drama, but failed because the male officers and gm had more than enough drama and jeolousy to cause the guild to collapse.

my current guild is now casual-core, (i find less drama in casual raiding overall), and our current, de facto gm is female and raid lead. we happen to have a good number of females, though it helps all of them are in committed relationships so there is very little if any awkward flirtation over vent (usually only happens when we occasional get new recruits), but i digress... if anything we end up carrying certain male raiders who underperform even with getting good loot drops versus the females who come prepared, know their class, and the fight, and can be counted on.

[Saffa]

This.

Speaking from experience and not just agreement. Probably could list the amount of players I have raided with in my 7 years that were female, could definitely count them on one hand, and four out of the five were dramatic and whiny. One was not only anything but this, but also a superb player and I believe still raiding as a MT in one of our servers top guilds. Our bears sometimes cross paths.

I also found that those same 4 were part of the guild(s) purely due to partners also being there.. this led to such situations where we would lack 2 players at a time rather than one, cause even if they were available they would refuse to raid/sit on alts as there SO's weren't online.

And of course lastly, as mentioned, knowing a female is 'watching' so to speak it can bring out the worst in some players, even mature ones you wouldn't expect it from. Whatever the reason.

I, old female, feel the same way about males going through puberty tbh - our guild calls them bed wetters and we do not recruit them, whiny, drama-queens, needy, unpredictable and way too much trouble to deal with. They may play well, in-between rage-quits and tantrums but who needs them We are mainly mature players, quite a few couples, but usually the male joins because his female partner is in guild and loves it.

[Duridi]

I agree with you, the percentage isn't nearly high enough.


Edit: It's at least equivalent to the number of male players that are bad, which is at least 95%, I'd argue closer to 99%.

Yeah..., you are right. Let's just pull that over to the population as a whole.

It's less than 1% that are raiding at the current top-level, is it not?

Honestly, the female population is smaller than the male one, and I am pretty confident the % of good/bad players dedicated to raiding is pretty even amongst the genders. As mentioned, I used to play in a top guild on my server, and almost half the team were girls. We had a dramasituation once, between two of the girls. Our biggest dramagang however, were a bunch of guys between the age of 18-20 who went 10 mans together, + another male who suddenly went completely crazy over a piece of loot, after having been in the guild for a year(!!). He was kicked instantly, due to the extreme reaction.

I have also played with extremely crappy players of both genders. It's really been even all the way my entire playtime.

However, I seek down to earth players, and our guild required a high maturity rate. We had several players at the beginning of the guild which were dramaqueens, which ended up kicked. Most of them male, because it simply is more males than females to get your hands on out there. Even had a father and son in the guild at the start(the son was social and completely useless as a raider), where the father were incapable of behaving properly. The father were also not good enough to remain in the guild. He was good, but not good enough.

[notorious98]

Try using your common sense as source, it's evident everywhere where females are present, not just WoW guilds.

Says the "man" who's never been around, let alone touched, a woman. Sexism and racism are equally disgusting. Grow up a little and experience life, woman hater.

[Zantos]

Most female wow players tend to have a negative light shined on em due to how most see em. Most see women as a problem more often then not, and in my experience, this is the case. I currently raid with a healer who is a women. She doesn't cause drama or trouble. However, the guild I left had a female GM who was literally the reason the guild fell apart. I raid with another guild who's Only female hunter got called out, and she rage quit the raid, WoW, and dragged her husband out of the raid that entire week. She was all laughs and smiles until she got called out, then she snapped.

Point being, there Are women raiders who are mature and skilled. I know a few of em. That being said, there does tend to be a higher drama rate, and lower skill, for women in my experience. Most people tend to think this way about women, but will give them the benefit of the doubt and get them anyway. Anyone not getting them because they are afraid of what they will do is either a female GM who's jealous, or just too dim witted to care.

[bbr]

Take an average raid guild of 25 guys.
Progressing ok, etc,.
One falls ill, or quits, and a girl joins.

Girl goes on teamspeak.

What do you think will happen to the testosterone levels / concentration during that raid?

Tbh,. I think girls in a raid guild are just fine and good,. we had at least 4 and everyone was used to each other on TS.
There "was" the occasional drama though, catfighting as well..
A few wipes because of the girls,. but just as many if not more because of the guys.

*shrug*

If they want to discriminate, let them,.
It's silly though.

[Duridi]

Using the equivalent insult for women probably wouldn't be appropriate.

Well, you could say bitch. Dick/Bitch... aren't they quite even? .

[Soahar]

Try using your common sense as source, it's evident everywhere where females are present, not just WoW guilds.

Ah sorry I forgot to turn on my sexism today. And the hypocrisy in this post is delicious.

[Saffa]

They tend to be overemotional and cause unneeded drama. There's also the biological deficiency that plagues them once a month.

Unlike young males who have the biological deficiency 24/7