Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Doffen]

I am afraid your answer doesn't make sense. You state he is talking about Void Elf numbers, but then argue his response is vague and he doesn't have the answer. I believe you are tying yourself in rhetorical knots attempting to argue that the answer he gave wasn't an answer. Because this guy is the Senior Narrative Lead...the one they sent to talk to Polygon about the Allied races. If anyone knows the answer, he does, and he gave one.

I also refute that I am twisting his words, particularly as I have gone through his answer with a fine tooth comb and shown how the phrasing of the answer supports that Void Elves are expanding their numbers.

I did ask earlier for an explanation of his answer that covered the main points I have raised which are, again

a.) The questioner was asking where Void Elf numbers come from
b.) Moorgard's answer began with the statement that the Void Elves start as a small group, therefore leading the reader to expect their numbers have increased since that start.
c.) He talks about the Elves, not specifying Alliance High Elves or Blood Elves, just Elves, who have sought the Void Elves out to see if they can become Void Elves too (undergo a similar process).

I am still waiting for an alternative that is serious, not a 'he didn't know' or 'he decided to talk about non Void Elf elves when asked about Void Elf numbers'.

What is it you are not understanding here? I don't know if you forgot why we are having this discussion in the first place? The question is wether Void Elves are recruiting Alliance High Elves to be Void Elves. Which was your premise for this argument, that they are definitely doing so, and you base that on his answer. I have, and consistently so, said that there is no proof for that with his answer. It's a non-answer because he didn't answer the question properly, he couldn't tell IF they are recruiting other elves nor could he really say how they would do it. And most likely it is because they don't know, or are not ready to tell us properly why Void Elves are increasing in number.

The other point is that you take that statement as fact for High Elves of the Alliance being turned into Void Elves. And I have said that there is a good possibility that more blood elves and high elves of the Alliance will go in that direction, but we can't say for sure that they will, because we have no dev saying it, it's not told ingame and it's not told in a story outside the game. There is nothing you can use to proof that Alliance High Elves are being turned into Void Elves, and that's the discussion really. It's all speculation, there is no WoG telling us other wise. You using that statement as evidence for this happening, when it hasn't.

c.) He talks about the Elves, not specifying Alliance High Elves or Blood Elves, just Elves, who have sought the Void Elves out to see if they can become Void Elves too (undergo a similar process).

Here you go. Why do you really think he says elves and not Blood or High Elf? It's because he either can't say because of the story ahead, or that they don't really have a good answer for that. Like I said at least three times, it could be that there are only more Blood Elves that will become Void Elf, so the group of Alliance High Elves will stay "pure" if you like. You have been using this as an argument against Alliance High Elves as Allied Race, and you base that on a good question, that got answered vaguely. Speculate is all you do, there is no WoG stating that Alliance High Elves are being turned into Void Elf.

Hope this clear things out, because I am tired of stating that there is no WoG showing us or telling us that Alliance High Elves are going to be Void Elves, not yet at least. Is it a possibility that will happen? Sure.

[Aldo Hawk]

They are not since the Alliance stabbed them in their backs in WC III.
End of story.

Are you aware that Alliance High elves are a thing today and since World of Warcraft released?

You are delusional if you think you have putted any end on any story.

Sorry to say, but I don't find you ready enough to understand what is being discussed in here, you seem to be very proud of discussing something from an ignorant stance. And that doesn't bring anything good.

[delus]

"Word of god" is immutable. That's the whole reason for using the word "god" in it. Like Flubberpuddy mentioned in his post above yours, saying "it doesn't change, until it changes" is completely pointless since the entire point of this thread is that things do change.


Um.. sorry. There is nothing "obvious", here. Do put down your bias, please.


No, sorry. That doesn't mean anything. Because the exact same thing can be said if my hypothesis was true: they are infesting the children of Gonk with the void, regardless if the end result are living aberrations, dead aberrations, or "living but brain-dead" aberrations.


Then your point is completely meaningless because you don't know the exact process and are just drawing conclusions from inconclusive evidence based solely on your bias. It really shows how you're reaching because you're ignoring a truck-load of details and particulars in and effort make both process "similar" in nothing but their most basic concepts.

Really hope they expand upon it at a later date. Maybe there will be a quest where the second generation void elves join.

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Are you aware that Alliance High elves are a thing today and since World of Warcraft released?

You are delusional if you think you have putted any end on any story.

Sorry to say, but I don't find you ready enough to understand what is being discussed in here, you seem to be very proud of discussing something from an ignorant stance. And that doesn't bring anything good.

And the void elves are former blood elves who came back to the Alliance without hesitation.

[Aldo Hawk]

Snip.

You don't want to understand ANYTHING about the HE request.

No, stop bullshitting and twisting everything, it's super disgusting.

High elves, those that -exist-. I'm sorry if you can't understand this simple and straightforward thing. Very, very, very sorry.

Also, stop spouting nonsense about the Void elves, using red herring like that is disgusting.

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And the void elves are former blood elves who came back to the Alliance without hesitation.

Yes, that's true, what are you trying to say?

[FlubberPuddy]

But that is what I am saying, that it can change is irrelevant to the debate because at that point why even bother having a debate? They can change what they want, it's their game. What is important is that it is true right now.

The issue is that the more they do on a topic, the harder it is to justify a retcon. Saying the Eredar were always evil beings whose awfulness corrupted Sargeras and then saying they were an advanced civilization that was corrupted by Sargeras was an easy retcon, because there was nothing in game that contradicted this change until it was made explicit by the addition of the Draenei in the Burning Crusade. Who in the end cared that a few lines of text in a game manual that had no other impact had been disregarded?

However, if they were minded to go the other way NOW, and to decide that in actual fact the Eredar had been evil all along and their awfulness had corrupted Sargeras, then while they could do that, and while they have the authority to do that, to do that they would have to go against the past thirteen years of established lore including hundreds of characters, quests and multiple events spanning twenty five thousand years of Warcraft history. In other words, even though they could do it if they wanted, the reality of the game as the game is now would prevent it.

I mean, if you're talking about what's relevant and irrelevant to the debate here, then it's all irrelevant. They're not basing any decisions off of what's said here in terms of implementing Alliance High Elves or not. This is just a place for us poster to discuss.

If you want to talk about relevancy, then similar to how you express that Eredar Blizzard have established have "the past thirteen years of established lore including hundreds of characters, quests and multiple events", then we have that for Alliance High Elves.

Because regardless of being the same "race" (high elf), Blizzard has established for "the past thirteen years of established lore including hundreds of characters, quests and multiple events" that High Elves are a separate group from Blood Elves.

It's only in this recent time that they've suddenly equated "Blood Elves are High Elves" in order to focus on the recently released Void Elves. It appears as an attempt for someone trying to dust their mess under the rug as you see in some cartoons.

Now they have the authority to do this, that's not what anyone is questioning. But the game itself, the game the developers have implemented things into speak of High Elves and Blood Elves as separate entities.

Therefore, if the game they're developing is showing one thing but then they're saying another then incongruity exists and that is no fault of players.

That they recently say "if you wanna play a high elf then play a blood elf" is no different than someone before saying "if you wanna play a paladin you must play alliance" or "if you wanna play a purple tall elf you must play alliance" or "if you wanna play a straight back character you must play alliance" etc etc all in the past.

And this is why Blizzard was heavily criticized even by media members in the community with their initial High Elf response in that Q&A and probably why Alex Afrasiabi later that same year said, "yeah it's possible" when asked if Void Elves could have High Elf skin tones.

Btw if you like to imply that Moorgard's response of "they start small" equates to them recruiting more elves to turn Voidy, then Afrasiabi's "don't give up hope" should surely imply Alliance High Elf fans to not give up the High Elf endeavor aka they're still a possibility in some form.

Because I have yet to see a movement as big as the High Elf movement in terms of anything relating solely to Void Elves. Logically, what else could Afrasiabi's "don't give up hope" emphasis be relating to if not the High Elf request.

[delus]

You don't want to understand ANYTHING about the HE request.

No, stop bullshitting and twisting everything, it's super disgusting.

High elves, those that -exist-. I'm sorry if you can't understand this simple and straightforward thing. Very, very, very sorry.

Also, stop spouting nonsense about the Void elves, using red herring like that is disgusting.

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Yes, that's true, what are you trying to say?

That the blood elf and by extension the high elf ties to being a horde race are superficial.

[FlubberPuddy]

That the blood elf and by extension the high elf ties to being a horde race are superficial.

It is sort of interesting that Blizzard dances around the Blood Elves and the Alliance topic. It's like a mini plot thread that continues with the latest being the BFA Three Sisters Comic where Vereesa as one of her major truths believes the Blood Elves will come back into the Alliance.

Then we have Alleria speaking on one day Silvermoon will be back into the Alliance.

Then there is Umbric with his speech to the Void Elf player that the "Alliance is where our people belong."

Lor'themar is being shown as level-headed in regards to post Azshara Eternal Palace battle, while we have conflict against the Sunreavers and Jaina. Something Lor'themar doesn't seem to care much for or pay attention to. Then he comments how he hopes the sin'dorei will stand with him.

And while this is just the recent things shown in BFA. It is interesting that even when Blood Elves were introduced there was schism within Silvermoon with a few Blood Elves speaking against joining the Horde.

It's been a mini-plot Blizzard has carried throughout WoW, but I wonder if there's any purpose to it.

[Doffen]

but I wonder if there's any purpose to it.

For us to discuss till death splits us apart :P

[matrix123mko]

For us to discuss till death splits us apart :P

And this is great. Obelisk can become our best frenemy.

[Strippling]

Thank goodness nobody her wants that. All we're asking is to play a race that has already been part of the Alliance since day 1. We don't want blood elves. We want high elves.

Blood elves and high elves are the same race. The high elf race is already playable on the Horde. So yes, you do want a race on the alliance that is already available on the Horde. In fact, this race is a core race of the Horde.

It is about the lore.

I'm somewhat reluctant to believe that in most cases. Evidence strongly suggests it's predominantly about the aesthetics. The fact that a lot of high elfers would be happy with high elf customization options for void elves proves this, despite the fact that this would screw void elf lore and also not 'fit the bill' for the particular lore high elfers apparently want. They'd be happy to screw the lore, the identity of a core Horde race and their uniqueness, if they can just make the light skinned thalassian elf they so shallowly want to play.

False. Blood elves are the blood elves of WoW. High elves are the high elves of wow. High elf NPCs are a thing that exists in the game. The high elf group exists in the game.

False. "Blood elves are our high elves" - Chris Metzen. That is a fact. A fact dictated by Blizzard. You are just flat out wrong here, sorry pal.

Alliance high elves are an extremely small/dwindling off-shoot of the main high elven group... the blood elves. Again, in case you missed it the first time, blood elves are our high elves. I can link the video of Metzen saying this if you wish? (p.s he uses those exact words).

140% irrelevant. Because lore about more high elves can be written in the game. Worst case scenario, Blizzard can just retcon their "dying breed" nonsense. Wouldn't be the first time.

A ret-con in any case would directly impede on the Blood elves.

[Doffen]

False. "Blood elves are our high elves" - Chris Metzen. That is a fact. A fact dictated by Blizzard. You are just flat out wrong here, sorry pal.


Alliance high elves are an extremely small/dwindling off-shoot of the main high elven group... the blood elves.

You can't say it's false then in the next line say that there are Alliance High Elves on the Alliance. It's either "there are High Elves in the Alliance" or "No High Elves on the Alliance."

That quote was said in 2005, lots of things has changed. It has since the Blood Elves actually became playable for the Horde in 2007 happened a lot. These days it is known to be High Elves on the Alliance and lore for them ingame and in books, and has been for 12+ years. It has been retconned so to speak. Because after that quote, WoG shows that there are more to High Elves in the game than just Blood Elves.

Are the Blood Elves High elves though? For sure, it's the majority of High Elf lore in WoW. But there are also lore for Alliance High Elves in WoW. Using a quote like that now is just being nonsensical.

[Ielenia]

Blood elves and high elves are the same race. The high elf race is already playable on the Horde. So yes, you do want a race on the alliance that is already available on the Horde. In fact, this race is a core race of the Horde.

Saying "core" is meaningless. And rather wrong. The blood elves weren't part of the Horde when it formed. Anyways. No, we don't want a race that is currently on the Horde. We want a race that is already in the Alliance to be made playable.

I'm somewhat reluctant to believe that in most cases. Evidence strongly suggests it's predominantly about the aesthetics. The fact that a lot of high elfers would be happy with high elf customization options for void elves proves this,

Being willing to compromise when what is being asked is not going to be allowed does not mean "it's all about the aesthetics".

False. "Blood elves are our high elves" - Chris Metzen. That is a fact. A fact dictated by Blizzard. You are just flat out wrong here, sorry pal.

Then he is objectively wrong. If he said "blood elves are our currently playable high elves", then I'd concede. But the phrase, in the way you wrote it? Objectively false. High elves are a thing that exist, and are shown and treated in the game game as a completely separate group from the blood elves.

Alliance high elves are an extremely small/dwindling off-shoot of the main high elven group... the blood elves.

100% irrelevant and meaningless, considering more high elves can super easily be written.

A ret-con in any case would directly impede on the Blood elves.

Except it would not, unless you'd like to explain how it would "directly impede" on the blood elves other than making you look like a "special snowflake" by saying "my blood elf character won't feel special and/or unique anymore"?

[Strippling]

Are the Blood Elves High elves though? For sure, it's the majority of High Elf lore in WoW.

That was my point. Blood elves are high elves, and it's very clear Blizzard intended them to be THE high elves of the WoW universe. So, subsequently the high elf race is playable... on the Horde. Unless the small group of alliance high elves undergo some sort of transformation (to make them physically different) or have 1000s of years of lore separating them from blood elves, then they don't fit the criteria that the existing ARs currently fit. All existing ARs have either physically been transformed from their "parent race", have 1000s of years separating them from their "parent race", or in some cases a combination of both. High elves have neither of these. Void elves at least underwent a physical transformation.

If you want to go by the notion "welp there are some alliance high elves so they should be playable", then I reply with "there's a goblin in the SI7, thus according to your logic goblins are also a part of alliance identity. Why aren't you asking for playable goblins on the Alliance? Is it cause they're not as aesthetically pleasing as thalassian elves?".

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Saying "core" is meaningless. And rather wrong. The blood elves weren't part of the Horde when it formed. Anyways. No, we don't want a race that is currently on the Horde. We want a race that is already in the Alliance to be made playable.

So you're saying blood elves and high elves are not the same race? If so, I won't bother responding anymore as it'll seem that you don't understand the fundamental issue to this debate.

Being willing to compromise when what is being asked is not going to be allowed does not mean "it's all about the aesthetics".

"It's all about the lore!!!..... but I'll settle for high elf customizations for void elves (despite it not being lore friendly to void elves, and despite high elfers claiming void elves aren't high elves)". Yea, sorry but I'm going to call BS when I see it. It's very clear that a lot of high elfers (if not most) predominantly care about the aesthetics. Aldo Hawk is really the only high elfer I've seen who actually shows a genuine desire based on lore reasons. You, and most other high elfers I've seen on here (and other forums) pretend it's about the lore but it's so very obvious the main goal is the aesthetic. Requests by many high elfers for extra void elf customization cemented my suspicions.

Then he is objectively wrong. If he said "blood elves are our currently playable high elves", then I'd concede. But the phrase, in the way you wrote it? Objectively false. High elves are a thing that exist, and are shown and treated in the game game as a completely separate group from the blood elves.

The way I wrote the phrase is the exact way that Metzen worded it.

I don't deny that a very small number of high elves align themselves with the Alliance. I know they exist. But again, you seem to lack an understanding of the fundamental issue... blood elves are also high elves. And guess what, they are THE high elves of WoW. They are the continuation of the high elf story, of their legacy. And no amount of head canon will change this fact.

Yes, a small group of alliance high elves exist. But a bigger YES, blood elves are high elves and they are the main high elven group of WoW. They are core to the Horde, meaning the high elven race is core to the Horde. Just like humans are core to the Alliance, despite there being pockets of humans in the world that are not part of the Alliance. Some of these humans have even aided the Horde in the past and present.... but you don't see us asking for them to be playable on the Horde, Why? Cause that goes against a fundamental aspect of the game. The alliance is strongly represented by humans and the other core alliance races. The human race is a core feature of the Alliance, they're unique to the alliance. High elves as a race are core to the Horde (they renamed themselves to blood elves, but that didn't change who they are. They are the high elves of WoW) and are unique to the Horde. To maintain this identity to the Horde, but to cater to the high elf requests, blizzard introduced void elves. They were a compromise. Why were they a compromise? Because the high elven identity and uniqueness (which includes their physical features) is unique to the Horde. That's why the lead game developer told you "If you want to be a fair skinned, light haired, blue eyed elf...sorry, the horde is there waiting for you"

100% irrelevant and meaningless, considering more high elves can super easily be written.

That would be a retcon to alliance high elf lore. I thought you said you valued the lore? Or is it really about the aesthetics?

Except it would not, unless you'd like to explain how it would "directly impede" on the blood elves other than making you look like a "special snowflake" by saying "my blood elf character won't feel special and/or unique anymore"?

In lore, blood elves are the thriving thalassian society in WoW. Alliance high elves are a dying breed. To change the lore all of a sudden and say "ta daa!!! high elves are actually more numerous and we just had a ton of them hiding elsewhere" would take away from the dynamic that currently exists. Which I repeat again, the dynamic is that blood elves are the main high elven society and they're thriving and growing, healing from their heavy loss against the scourge. The dynamics of alliance high elves are that there a so few left of them, they have no real society, they have no real direction, they're a dying breed and slowly assimilating into human society. Change this current dynamic and you a) detract from the unique dynamic of the blood elves, and b) change fundamental lore of alliance high elves. I thought you claim to value high elf lore?

[Ielenia]

So you're saying blood elves and high elves are not the same race? If so, I won't bother responding anymore as it'll seem that you don't understand the fundamental issue to this debate.

The irony in this statement is almost palpable.

A "race" in its dictionary definition is not the same as "playable race" in a game. When you choose a "race" in the game, you're not playing as a member of the entire race, but rather, a member of a specific group of that race. If you play as a human, you play as a Stormwind human, not, for example, a Lordaeronian survivor. A night elf? You're a night elf from Teldrassil. You're not one of the highborne from Dire Maul. Finally, as a blood elf, you play specifically as a Silvermoon thalassian elf. Your character is not, for example, a Scryer from Outland. And you're most definitely not a high elf from the Silver Covenant, or a high elf from the Alliance.

And therein lies the issue. "Race", in game terms, is more akin to a "group you belong to" than an actual race. Your horde blood elf character definitely does not belong to the Alliance high elf "race".

"It's all about the lore!!!..... but I'll settle for high elf customizations for void elves (despite it not being lore friendly to void elves, and despite high elfers claiming void elves aren't high elves)". Yea, sorry but I'm going to call BS when I see it.

Then you need better glasses. And inform yourself on the definition of "compromise". You're acting as if just because someone is willing to compromise because they concluded the story they want will never be given to them... somehow means "it was never about the story".

The way I wrote the phrase is the exact way that Metzen worded it.

Then he is objectively wrong about the game he worked on. It can happen.

I don't deny that a very small number of high elves align themselves with the Alliance. I know they exist. But again, you seem to lack an understanding of the fundamental issue... blood elves are also high elves. And guess what, they are THE high elves of WoW. They are the continuation of the high elf story, of their legacy. And no amount of head canon will change this fact.

And what is the problem of a splinter of said "high elf story" going in a different direction? I mean, seems rather hypocritical of you to be just fine with the "high elf story" going in a different direction with the void elves... but somehow allowing the group that is actually called "high elves" in the game to take their story in a different direction... suddenly that's a big "no-no" to you?

That would be a retcon to alliance high elf lore. I thought you said you valued the lore? Or is it really about the aesthetics?

Do tell me how much the tauren lore suffered with the addition of the Highmountain tauren. Because that was a big "ret-con" by your logic.

That aside, it's not a ret-con that would negatively affect the lore. Change, by itself, is not good or bad. It doesn't even have to be a ret-con. I mean, the game even sets it up almost perfectly: the Horde has been through a civil war already, and it's currently about to go through a second one in the same generation. Who's to say there's not some blood elves who are getting fed up with being in such an unstable faction and decide to leave and join for example, the Silver Covenant?

In lore, blood elves are the thriving thalassian society in WoW. Alliance high elves are a dying breed. To change the lore all of a sudden and say "ta daa!!! high elves are actually more numerous and we just had a ton of them hiding elsewhere" would take away from the dynamic that currently exists.

And that would negatively affect the blood elf lore... how? The blood elves won't suddenly stop growing and thriving just because the high elves suddenly got a population boost. The blood elves didn't stop "growing and thriving" just because the void elves now exist.

It is not a competition between high elves and blood elves. One does not need to dwindle and die for the other to grow and prosper.

I thought you claim to value high elf lore?

I do. You apparently don't care about letting the lore grow. It's actually uncanny how much hate you must have toward the high elves to refuse them the opportunity to grow and prosper into their own thing, and actually want them to dwindle and die... just so your preferred race can feel "precious and unique".

[Aldo Hawk]

It's very unsettling to see people defending the premise that the whole setting of warcraft is solely based on racial conflict and that without it everything would loose meaning. Warcraft cannot be less Warcraft because people from the same race fight themselves. It is very Warcraft still. Seriously...

I mean, it's very unreasonable by itself. And the flaws in Pandaren aren't shared between High elf and Blood elf. Just to start, they already have reasons to break each other's skulls, they came from the same place in lore but ultimately the implementation of HE cannot be made with a starting experience in Silvermoon, isn't it? So they simply cannot share an starting point. It's just a different experience from a Blood elf or a Void elf.

It's not even a 'neutral' selection, it's a whole different section, already in the other faction and in the allied race section.

This is just... Saying they are the same as Blood elves just because they are the same race is totally unreasonable. It fits 1:1 what an independent race is, and remember that I refer it to Pandaren, who is the only non independent selection in the whole game as the race is available since the start and the faction is chosen later. For being the same, they would be the 'same' in the most superficial level. Everything else has a meaning for it to change.

Racials, voice lines, customization, classes, initial HUB, etc... Blood elves nor Void elves can't replace a High elf. The only way is to wipe them out of existence.


@Strippling You are the one saying Blood elves and High elves are different races.

[Strippling]

The irony in this statement is almost palpable.

A "race" in its dictionary definition is not the same as "playable race" in a game. When you choose a "race" in the game, you're not playing as a member of the entire race, but rather, a member of a specific group of that race. If you play as a human, you play as a Stormwind human, not, for example, a Lordaeronian survivor. A night elf? You're a night elf from Teldrassil. You're not one of the highborne from Dire Maul. Finally, as a blood elf, you play specifically as a Silvermoon thalassian elf. Your character is not, for example, a Scryer from Outland. And you're most definitely not a high elf from the Silver Covenant, or a high elf from the Alliance.

And therein lies the issue. "Race", in game terms, is more akin to a "group you belong to" than an actual race. Your horde blood elf character definitely does not belong to the Alliance high elf "race".

Then why were void elves added in place of high elves?

You're definition of WoW races doesn't correctly portray that actual dynamics of WoW races. Yes playable humans are 'Stormwindians', but up until ARs were introduced the playable humans represented the 'human race'. Just as playable orcs represented the 'orc race'. As such, the 'orc race' was and is solely unique to the Horde, and similarly the 'human race' was and is solely unique to the Alliance. The same applies for all other core races to each faction. The race selection screen doesn't say 'Stormwind humans', 'Teldrassil night elves'... it says 'humans', 'night elfs', 'orcs', etc... These core playable races represent the actual races. So, blood elves represent thalassian elves (which is what alliance high elves are).

When ARs were introduced, certain sub-factions of core races (ie playable humans represent the human race, playable orcs represent the orc race) were now available to play. But to protect the uniqueness of 'parent races' and to protect identity of both factions, each AR has been given physical differences. On top of that, the lore of each AR is significantly different to their 'parent race'. So high elves don't fit the criteria to be a core playable race, because "high elves" (ie blood elves) are already playable. They also don't fit the criteria to be an AR because they have no physical differences to blood elves (there is also no lore reasoning for them to be different) and they share practically the same history bar 15 years or so. Void elves are the only AR who share a close history with a parent race, but they were given physical differences to help them stand out.

So in saying all this, re-read your definition of 'races' again and then answer me why void elves were given in place of high elves?

Then he is objectively wrong about the game he worked on. It can happen.

You're saying Metzen's definition of blood elves is wrong? You realize he created 'blood elves/high elves' right?

That aside, it's not a ret-con that would negatively affect the lore. Change, by itself, is not good or bad. It doesn't even have to be a ret-con. I mean, the game even sets it up almost perfectly: the Horde has been through a civil war already, and it's currently about to go through a second one in the same generation. Who's to say there's not some blood elves who are getting fed up with being in such an unstable faction and decide to leave and join for example, the Silver Covenant?

I thought you wanted the high elves who never left the Alliance and never had green eyes?

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@Strippling You are the one saying Blood elves and High elves are different races.

I think you need to re-read my posts. That's twice in the last 2 weeks you've accused me of this, but I promise you if you read my posts properly you'll see that I strongly emphasize that blood elves and alliance high elves are the same race

[Aldo Hawk]

I think you need to re-read my posts. That's twice in the last 2 weeks you've accused me of this, but I promise you if you read my posts properly you'll see that I strongly emphasize that blood elves and alliance high elves are the same race

You are still the one repeating that Blood elves and High elves are the same race. Even if it's in a pure refusal of the fact, you are the one repeating it.

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Yes playable humans are 'Stormwindians', but up until ARs were introduced the playable humans represented the 'human race'. Just as playable orcs represented the 'orc race'. As such, the 'orc race' was and is solely unique to the Horde, and similarly the 'human race' was and is solely unique to the Alliance.

Is this some sort of a joke? Can you please explain this and maybe give a source on that?

Are you telling us that back in Vanilla wow... Picking a troll was just exactly like picking one of these?: https://www.wowhead.com/npc=587/bloodscalp-warrior

Oh wait a minute, these ain't Darkspear trolls.

And that is just ONE example. Do you want a link to Blackrock orcs from Blackrock mountain? Orgrimmar Orcs for sure...

Dude, just... Goddamit... Stop doing that, seriously.

Edit: I know what you gonna say. That it represented the races in the factions or something like that.

That misses the whole point. Alliance humans are not 'the human race'.

[Doffen]

That was my point. Blood elves are high elves, and it's very clear Blizzard intended them to be THE high elves of the WoW universe. So, subsequently the high elf race is playable... on the Horde. Unless the small group of alliance high elves undergo some sort of transformation (to make them physically different) or have 1000s of years of lore separating them from blood elves, then they don't fit the criteria that the existing ARs currently fit. All existing ARs have either physically been transformed from their "parent race", have 1000s of years separating them from their "parent race", or in some cases a combination of both. High elves have neither of these. Void elves at least underwent a physical transformation.

If you want to go by the notion "welp there are some alliance high elves so they should be playable", then I reply with "there's a goblin in the SI7, thus according to your logic goblins are also a part of alliance identity. Why aren't you asking for playable goblins on the Alliance? Is it cause they're not as aesthetically pleasing as thalassian elves?".

I am not asking for anything, but pointing out serious flaws in arguments. Like your points about other allied races, there is no reason that Alliance High Elves can't be an Allied Race when it comes to the looks or lore, as we see over and over that doesn't stop blizzard for making them. Only reason is the faction difference, and it's a the only reason. If they were making High Elf Allied Race for Horde(as silly as that might have been), but with other tattoos and shit like that, they would be in the same boat as HM Tauren and LF Draenei.

[matrix123mko]

I am not asking for anything, but pointing out serious flaws in arguments. Like your points about other allied races, there is no reason that Alliance High Elves can't be an Allied Race when it comes to the looks or lore, as we see over and over that doesn't stop blizzard for making them. Only reason is the faction difference, and it's a the only reason. If they were making High Elf Allied Race for Horde(as silly as that might have been), but with other tattoos and shit like that, they would be in the same boat as HM Tauren and LF Draenei.

More like Wildhammer Dwarves.

[Doffen]

More like Wildhammer Dwarves.

Dark Iron Dwarves then. I actually didn't think of them, even though I got two and they are super-cool.