Russian invasion of Ukraine

[jonnysensible]

Do you ever stop to think why Ukraine might want to join NATO?

[Shalcker]

Do you ever stop to think why Ukraine might want to join NATO?

Because it allows them to get handouts right now for pushing stories about Russian aggression - true or imagined (mostly imagined, true stories eventually run dry).

Their inclusion into NATO is still decades away at best, their only "sponsor" to that end is United States, and everyone, US included, still has no intention to defend them against Russia - but they'll gladly dump old weapons, vehicles and ships to Ukraine through loans.

[YUPPIE]

Do you ever stop to think why Ukraine might want to join NATO?

Because they don't want to be under the absolute thumb of a despotic mass-murdering hedonist whose sole interests are preserving and consolidating his wealth and power.

[Forogil]

why is there doubt Jinping or Putin have claimed over a million lives by proxy? They're probably not as direct as Mao or Stalin to be sure, but still, look at what they've done

Where are the indications it happened?
And more importantly, why would they do it?

Mao killed tens of millions in the great leap backward, due to ill-designed economic policies leading to famines while China exported food. Even if Xi wants to suppress the press he couldn't do something similar, and if the economic policies are flawed they are not that flawed. Stalin did the same, including the holodomor in Ukraine; but even if Putin did invade Ukraine I doubt that he would institute similar policies to suppress dissent.
Basically I doubt that Putin and Xi hold similar stupid economic ideas so dearly.

Under Putin a large number of dissidents have disappeared or had "accidents" like falling out of windows or tripping on poisons or knifes, but not millions.

[YUPPIE]

Under Putin a large number of dissidents have disappeared or had "accidents" like falling out of windows or tripping on poisons or knifes, but not millions.

that's not any less convincing because it's so horrendous reading that evil shit. Imagine being a recognized leader of a country and murdering a peasant that criticizes you. "Large number" no less.

I'm seriously wondering what kind of living leader can our kids even look up to nowadays.

[Orange Joe]

that's not any less convincing because it's so horrendous reading that evil shit. Imagine being a recognized leader of a country and murdering a peasant that criticizes you. "Large number" no less.

I'm seriously wondering what kind of living leader can our kids even look up to nowadays.

You talk about wanting to nuke people. YOU ARE JUST AS EVIL!!!

Thats why no one listens to your bullshit.

[PACOX]

I swear all China and Russia have to do is feed their invasion narratives to keep the US occupied.

[YUPPIE]

I swear all China and Russia have to do is feed their invasion narratives to keep the US occupied.

it's not a narrative or bluff anymore.

[Calfredd]

it's not a narrative or bluff anymore.

Only to delusional people.

[Shalcker]

I swear all China and Russia have to do is feed their invasion narratives to keep the US occupied.

US and allies can feed those narratives themselves - they have a lot of people who get paycheck for "being busy" and looking for opportunities after Afghanistan withdrawal.

At this point even Zelensky saying that evacuating US embassy is overreaction and Putin denying both invasion plans and that what he proposed was any kind of "ultimatum" doesn't change the narrative.

[Crispin]

US and allies can feed those narratives themselves - they have a lot of people who get paycheck for "being busy" and looking for opportunities after Afghanistan withdrawal.

At this point even Zelensky saying that evacuating US embassy is overreaction and Putin denying both invasion plans and that what he proposed was any kind of "ultimatum" doesn't change the narrative.

Putin saying something bears zero weight in the west. “Not our little green men” killed any ounce of credibility he had left. Can’t blame the Ukranian PM for wishing that the US do not prepare an embassy evacuation.

In the end you had 0 arguments.

If Putin hates NATO troops by Russias borders, he should probably stop invading countries. It’s not rocket science

[Kante]

Hefty plunge in the Russian MOEX 7.5% in a single day...

[Shalcker]

Putin saying something bears zero weight in the west. “Not our little green men” killed any ounce of credibility he had left. Can’t blame the Ukranian PM for wishing that the US do not prepare an embassy evacuation.

Exactly. So there is nothing Russia can say that will change your mind.

Your entire narrative is self-referential. You imagined invasion, you stocked fears, and now you're afraid of it - all while Russia have been saying "no invasion, let's just get Ukraine to stick by Minsk agreements together".

[jonnysensible]

Hefty plunge in the Russian MOEX 7.5% in a single day...

rubles eating it as well, almost at central bank intervention point.

Russian economy is well run to be fair (at a macro level anyway) and they have managed to gain significant reserves.

Still wiping out 150billion on the stock exchange is never a great move.

[Shalcker]

rubles eating it as well, almost at central bank intervention point.

Russian economy is well run to be fair (at a macro level anyway) and they have managed to gain significant reserves.

Still wiping out 150billion on the stock exchange is never a great move.

Fundamentals haven't changed; once situation clears it'll rise back up.

[Mekh]

Exactly. So there is nothing Russia can say that will change your mind.

Your entire narrative is self-referential. You imagined invasion, you stocked fears, and now you're afraid of it - all while Russia have been saying "no invasion, let's just get Ukraine to stick by Minsk agreements together".

Or Russia could simply return Crimea. It's not hard.

[Shalcker]

Or Russia could simply return Crimea. It's not hard.

Or US could f*** off from Ukraine. It isn't hard either.

[Crispin]

Exactly. So there is nothing Russia can say that will change your mind.

Your entire narrative is self-referential. You imagined invasion, you stocked fears, and now you're afraid of it - all while Russia have been saying "no invasion, let's just get Ukraine to stick by Minsk agreements together".

Imagined?

Russia invaded Crimea, partly invaded Donbass (Hey we can't control our soldiers from invading in their spare time duh). Now you've moved an invasion force on the borders of Ukraine, and we're imagining things?

It's cute how you Russians always play the victim, but it's getting fucking old. It's clear to anyone, that Ukraine does not have the means nor motivation to invade Russia, so your invasion army is shit as the role of "uuuh Ukraine might invade us!!1"


I agree that implementing Minsk is ideal, but you're ignorant, if you honestly think that NATO would respond any different, when Russia moves that many troops to the borders of Ukraine and into Belarus and tells NATO to withdraw it's troops from Eastern Europe....

Just a little mindplay so you can relate. How would Russia have acted, if NATO moved 200.000 soldiers to the borders of Belarus, and told Russia to remove it's troops from Kalinggrad and Belarus. I fucking hope you wouldnt have turned into a "Oh we're just imagining things, it's not a threat"

But run with whatever narrative that the Russian state presents for the week, you'll lie and spin as much as you like, to avoid realising Russias part in the current situation.

Not sure if Putin expects the West to fold as Obama did with Syria and his red line of chem weapons, but this is not the middle east.

If Putin actually invades Ukraine, which I doubt, then he's an absolute joke, for doing it with a year warning, letting Ukraine prepare as much as they can for it.

- - - Updated - - -

Or US could f*** off from Ukraine. It isn't hard either.

haha that knejerk "BUT THE US" reaction.

Russia is unwanted on Ukranian soil, the US is not, learn the difference.

[Shalcker]

Imagined?

Russia invaded Crimea, partly invaded Donbass (Hey we can't control our soldiers from invading in their spare time duh). Now you've moved an invasion force on the borders of Ukraine, and we're imagining things?

Yes, you are. Those forces are 200-300km away from Ukrainian borders, and every military analyst says that they aren't ready for invasion due to lack of support units.

I agree that implementing Minsk is ideal, but you're ignorant, if you honestly think that NATO would respond any different, when Russia moves that many troops to the borders of Ukraine and into Belarus and tells NATO to withdraw it's troops from Eastern Europe....

We can move our troops anywhere we want within our alliance, Belarus included, for scheduled exercises.

"Withdraw NATO troops from Easter Europe" is exact mirror of your request "Withdraw your troops from Ukrainian border" - both are considered "too close".
Are you willing to do it? If you aren't, why would it be different for Russia?

Not sure if Putin expects the West to fold as Obama did with Syria and his red line of chem weapons, but this is not the middle east.

Yes, you have even less interests there. No oil.

[Mekh]

Or US could f*** off from Ukraine. It isn't hard either.

Russia stole part of an independent nation and now tries to play the victim.

Return Crimea, you assholes.