Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Varx]

Yes, High Elves are associated with that. And as shown by the 3 different kinds of purple elves in the game, Blizzard clearly has the ability to create them in varying, distinct degrees. To imagine they cannot do that with fair colors is absurd.

Also if in the days of Vanilla people asked to play Elves or Paladins I'm sure they'd be told "go play Alliance". We've come a long way since towards increasing playable and customization options and there's more coming.

- - - Updated - - -



And we see that Wildhammer Dwarves, like High Elves, are a possibility for the future. So just because a more off-brand race is made playable that hasn't ruled out other models.

I bet if someone is ever able to ask for Forest Trolls they'll get a similar response, "it's possible in the future".

"Its possible in the future" i dont believe that for a second. Thats just crowd control talk a company would use to keep its customers clinging to hope and continue playing. It makes 0 sense to put all that effort to a new elf as the alliance mirror to nightborne when they could have easily just given you helves.

As for dwarves, Wh dwarves could easily just give regular dwarves additional customization through a quest like nelf black eyes. Why the hell would they be an AR. Just cuz some weeb wants his lore OCD scratched? No thanks.

[Aldo Hawk]

You're objectively wrong if you think that in-game NPC population is a 1:1 representation of the actual population in the lore.

Yeah, it happens to be more of what we can see in game.

That's why we can see laaaaaaaaaaaarge armies that are nowhere to be found in any place.

There is certainly more that what we can find in game.

[FlubberPuddy]

"Its possible in the future" i dont believe that for a second. Thats just crowd control talk a company would use to keep its customers clinging to hope and continue playing. It makes 0 sense to put all that effort to a new elf as the alliance mirror to nightborne when they could have easily just given you helves.

As for dwarves, Wh dwarves could easily just give regular dwarves additional customization through a quest like nelf black eyes. Why the hell would they be an AR. Just cuz some weeb wants his lore OCD scratched? No thanks.

Been through this hecka times already, most people don't cling onto promises in hopes that Blizzard gives them what they want. I myself was an example of this, I wanted to Demonhunters in the game so badly, didn't play from cata Firelands till Dhs were in the game pre-Legion release.

Didn't even pay attention to WoW, a friend who also wasn't playing had to tell me "did ya know Blizz announced Dhs?"

And I wouldn't look at Void Elves as "all that effort" you can certainly think that, but majority opinion is they're an "easy" palette swap from Blood Elves, just like how Nightborne could be argued to have "had more effort" put into them as they look much more different than Night Elves but it's obvious to see that more people find Void Elves more popular than Nightborne.

So it appears that an elf model closer to the original = more popular than an elf model further from the original.

And just because you like to throw more insults at random fans of different things doesn't exclude WH Dwarves as potential for the future, something no one knows how Blizzard will handle. Acting as if you do provides no merit, especially since your ideas you've shared have proven to be very terrible.

[Varx]

Been through this hecka times already, most people don't cling onto promises in hopes that Blizzard gives them what they want. I myself was an example of this, I wanted to Demonhunters in the game so badly, didn't play from cata Firelands till Dhs were in the game pre-Legion release.

Didn't even pay attention to WoW, a friend who also wasn't playing had to tell me "did ya know Blizz announced Dhs?"

And I wouldn't look at Void Elves as "all that effort" you can certainly think that, but majority opinion is they're an "easy" palette swap from Blood Elves, just like how Nightborne could be argued to have "had more effort" put into them as they look much more different than Night Elves but it's obvious to see that more people find Void Elves more popular than Nightborne.

So it appears that an elf model closer to the original = more popular than an elf model further from the original.

And just because you like to throw more insults at random fans of different things doesn't exclude WH Dwarves as potential for the future, something no one knows how Blizzard will handle. Acting as if you do provides no merit, especially since your ideas you've shared have proven to be very terrible.

Terrible why? Cuz they dont pander to wc2 elves and instead trys to capitalize on neutral elves by adding a plethora of content as a result of them. Like a new core race for the horde or more dh races, updated flyable eversong, etc.yeah so bad.

[Eurhetemec]

I'll refer you to the following, coming from Ythisens, a former Warcraft CM:
https://curiouscat.me/CadenHouse/post/843519134

"Void Elves lore wise have less people than high elves but are playable."

How do you feel personally about the idea of High Elves becoming as an allied? What did the team think about them at the time of the massive megathreads?

Personally I have no issue with them becoming an allied race, as the arguments against it are pretty hard to make.
"Blood Elves and High Elves would look roughly the same." Pandaren already do this across factions.
"Lore wise there isn't enough High Elves to justify making them a playable race." Void Elves lore wise have less people than high elves but are playable.
"There's too many elf races." It's a fantasy game... and they already exist anyway.

There isn't a good reason to me apart from just flat out saying they don't want to do them. It's hard to justify game and lore wise why they can't be playable.

I can't talk about anything internal on the conversations, I'm just referencing what's been said in Q&As.

Wow this is amazing. You made a fake Blizzard quote, for the random opinion of a community manager - so someone with no real understanding of design or the direction of WoW or the like. It's like quoting some PR guy for a corporation on his opinion about their actual business.

I thought I saw a bad, desperate argument earlier, but good golly, this beats that! Talk about desperately reaching for anything.

I don't have a dog in this race myself - I'd quite like High Elves as an Allied race but I don't really care all that much - but wow, that is not a good argument and faking it up like that is just awful.

- - - Updated - - -

And I wouldn't look at Void Elves as "all that effort" you can certainly think that, but majority opinion is they're an "easy" palette swap from Blood Elves, just like how Nightborne could be argued to have "had more effort" put into them as they look much more different than Night Elves but it's obvious to see that more people find Void Elves more popular than Nightborne.

So it appears that an elf model closer to the original = more popular than an elf model further from the original.

On what possible basis do you get the latter from the former? That's not even logical.

Void Elves have vastly better racials that Nightborne, like, hilariously better. Nightborne racials are outright bad. Possibly the worst in the game, though I may be forgetting some awful race. But let's pretend that doesn't factor in to popularity at all, I guess.

[Obelisk Kai]

You took advantage of my ban, you can lie others, but you can only lie yourself at the end.

You got yourself banned, same reason anyone gets banned. You made a post prior to getting banned, by the time I read it you were banned, I responded to it. I've done it before and I will do it again, being banned is a punishment, not a shield.

A Void Elf is everything but what a High elf is.

Is not similar, it's different.

Your delusion is strong in this one. You can't lie and expect to be taken as truth.

Hardly a lie as them being similar is the point. If they weren't similar they'd be identical, they'd be Alliance High Elves and they would be disqualified.

This keeps being only your interpretation and opinion.

"Giving that race directly to the Alliance would have blurred a lot of the lines between the two factions"- Ion Hazzikostas

I though we were talking about other popular requests in this one but the posts are too long, of course i can find those, but can you find a High Elf in Dalaran? Seems like not.

Anyway, where are any of the other race requests that were such a blast? Do you think because we can't see right now a Forest troll or an Ogre or a Wildhammer Dwarf in the selection screen means they will never be? Seriously. Omegalul.

None of those other options were ruled out.

"If you want to be a fair skinned, light haired, blue eyed elf...sorry, the horde is there waiting for you"- Ion Hazzikostas

You didn't knew what i mean and in same breath express what i have expressed, genius.

High Elves are members of the Alliance, thanks for supporting.

Ah I see why I was confused, I thought you meant real members of the various factions. The ones we can play, not the groups you pretend are major parts of the Alliance.

Dev opinion is Dev opinion and they can be wrong. As you linked below in that inverview with Ion Hazzikostas where he doesn't acknowledge major hubs of High Elves. That's wrong since we know where they are.

Dev opinion can be wrong, but when devs are wrong they can also admit their mistake and correct the mistake, as they have on minor points of lore such as when the red shirt guy corrected them on mixing up two obscure dwarves, which they were happy to change. Haven't seen anyone from Blizz come out and say Ion was wrong in the same way.

As for major hubs of High Elves...what hubs? Every settlement that contains Alliance High Elves, they are a minority. Even Dalaran, where there genuinely are a few, is a Human city. There are NO Alliance High Elf hubs. Ion in other words is correct.

Changing goalposts much? Nobody added anything about Pandaren and 'neutrality' (which is by itself a wrong word since Pandaren are not neutral when choosing a side or HE and BE are not currently neutral) being not desiderable.

So the Pandaren are the same race available to both factions and this undermines the factions according to Ghostcrawler, but this is a completely separate scenario to Blood Elves and Alliance High Elves despite the fact the end result is the same race available to both factions if you get your way. No, this retort doesn't make sense, it relies too much on the pro High Elf communities fantasy that Alliance High Elves are somehow genuinely distinct from Blood Elves beyond a penchant for the colour blue. Given the multiple times it has been cited Blood Elves are High Elves, we are talking about the exact same people here and the Pandaren are definitely a valid point of comparison.

Blood Elves and High Elves are not neutral, they are pretty much sided with their factions.

So they've skipped the first ten or twenty levels of the Pandaren experience. Which given we are talking about them being a potential Allied race they were going to do anyway. It's an irrelevant point as the end result is identical, the same race available to both factions.

This is funny because you happen to be the one who comes here saying that you are the only one with 'sources' but then doesn't acknowledge the existence of Pandaren.

There is no research to be made about this, Pandaren exists and they didn't broke anything. I know you are tired to be told about them. That doesn't make them less important or a proof subject.

Pandaren exist and diminished faction diversity, as offering the same race to both sides must have diminished faction diversity.

Alliance High Elves were rejected on the grounds they undermined faction diversity. The source being the game director.

Stating Pandaren didn't damage anything when the race you want, a duplicate of an existing race in game for the other faction, is rejected on the grounds of faction diversity clearly indicates that something did go wrong that Blizzard didn't like. And that a lot of the player base didn't like either.

Your statement 'Pandaren didn't 'broke' anything is a reflection of your own bias. Pandaren can't have damaged anything and must be a flawless example that offering the same race to both sides, because if anything did go wrong it damages your case for Alliance High Elves.

You have been told why that doesn't hold any ground. Grow up.

One of the hallmarks of maturity is accepting harsh truths.

"In short, High Elves are not playable because there are very few true "High Elves" left—far less so than Gnomes. While there are Blood Elves in much larger supply, they are busy with other pursuits alongside Illidan. You'd certainly not see them fighting side by side with the Alliance anytime soon, not after such betrayal."- Caydiem, 2005.

"In consequence, there are so few high elves left on Azeroth today that they cannot be considered a race in anything other than the biological sense. High elves do not gather in any significant numbers, nor do they act as a coordinated whole. They are a very small group of individuals scattered all over the world. As such, they do not have common opinions or goals. Indeed, modern high elves cannot even truly be said to have a culture--only a past filled with glory and regret."- Warcraft Encyclopedia

"Are there any major High Elf hubs left? -Jessie Cox "I don't think so, they've basically been assimilated into other cultures"- Ion Hazzikostas

Against this consistent drum beat driving that Alliance High Elves are too few to be viable we have...well...you saying to ignore all that. Sorry, you're biased. I'll trust the canonical sources and the developers commentary.

Playable ones. How many of them could be? Illidan followers that indulge themselves into highly self damaging training? A flying fortress?

They are classes, not races. In fact, the reason hero classes exist is that there is a specific lore rationale behind how they came about. Now, unless Alliance High Elves are going to be the next hero class, citing Demon Hunters and Death Knights as some kind of counter-example is pointless.

Enough to still exist and be seen making military effort, having civilian life, participating in certain institutions and being seen around the world.

Please what are you on about? Military effort? The Silver Covenant is a small paramilitary group and high elf 'civilian' life constitutes at best a couple of shopkeepers in Dalaran. The human majority kingdom of Dalaran.

You can't but in same breath state that the are no high elf organizations within the Alliance.

They are alliance, there is nothing you can do to change that fact, just accept it.

I easily can. There is only one high elf organization, the Silver Covenant. It is described as a 'militant core of high elves that rejects the entry of the Blood Elves into the Kirin Tor'. IF this sole Alliance high elf organization were truly a part of the Alliance, rather than Alliance aligned, why are it's members who are participating in the war doing so as part of the 7th Legion and not under the banner of the Silver Covenant?
Why is the one time the Silver Covenant did engage with the Horde when Dalaran had embraced the Alliance as a member state?
Did they all forget their uniforms and banners in the rush to war? The whole TWO of them we have seen on the battlefield?

The same way Dark Iron Dwarves were missing, the same way Ogres and Taunka are missing, the same way any form of Mag'har orc were missing, etc...

Those are examples of the game having incomplete factions. But you like to play devil's advocate and not acknowledging things or buying bullshit just to defend your opinion.

Dark Iron Dwarves, never claimed by the developers to be playable.

Mag'har Orcs, never claimed by the developers to be playable.

Taunka and Ogres aren't missing, they are in game but not playable. High Elves are playable as Blood Elves. Taunka and Ogres also have, in another crucial difference, not been ruled out.

At the moment, the Alliance is lacking a playable option that is presented as Alliance aligned, as much as the Horde are lacking Ogres for example.

When the answer to your question is a repetition of the thing you answered it is a bad question, and i'm being too kind with many of my responses.

By that logic you are also missing playable Jinyu, Frost Dwarves and Broken who have also been presented as Alliance aligned. Assuming a group's 'alignment' means it's non-playable status somehow leaves a hole in the faction that needs to be filled could be considered greedy, given the number of non playable groups who happen to match that description. Although, given none of those other options were ruled out as Alliance High Elves were, they each have a greater chance of addition.

In fact you are wrong in this one since what you were told many many times is that 'word of god' is a flawed concept since it comes from human beings that can make mistakes and there are people like you that often uses their -opinions- as facts.

Word of God is authorial intent from the creators of an artistic work. Whatever they state is truth unless contradicted by later word of god or in game events. The thing about your objection, besides being motivated by a desire to diminish what the developers say because to acknowledge it as the authority it actually is is a roadblock on your desire, is that you are predicating your objection on the clear belief that they actually are wrong.

Which is hard to fathom given that the core of their objection to Alliance High Elves is that Blood Elves ARE High Elves. Kind of hard to walk that one back at this point given the decade and a half of storytelling based on that fact.

It's nothing more than a twisted way to use the concept of -official-. Dev word is an official one since it comes from the source of the material in discussion.

Official sources can be opinionated about what they develop and not be 100% correct unless it's a clarification that they make or a retcon in the lore they develop.

Dev opinion is dev opinion, thank you very much

This is an incredibly confused passage and the only way I can interpret it is the correct way, you're still upset he said what he said and you want us all to pretend that the guy who is in charge of making the actual game is just giving us his opinion when asked a direct question in an official setting and what he says has absolutely no bearing on the future of the game.

Funny how whenever a developer, whether it's Ghostcrawler back in the day or Watcher now, answers a question in a way you don't like it's just 'opinion' or 'he's a human being and they can be wrong'.

And yes, it is definitely twisted to quote their exact words back at you. I figure it makes it harder to pretend they didn't say what they said.

You say this and then acknowledge the existance of more Thalassians than the Blood elves:

That Blood Elves are the legacy of Quel'thalas. A legacy is a heritage bequeathed to the next generation. Given that the Blood Elves have everything of value, including an actual future, they are the legacy.

The Void Elves, being something different and with the ability to increase their numbers through recruitment, have a future of their very own.

Alliance High Elves are not the Legacy of Quel'thalas. They can't be. All they have is bitterness and regret.

This is so flawed...

They appeared nearly in every expansions, with more or less exposure. That didn't dissapeared.

In fact, the fact that they added High elves at all in BfA even after all the drama with Void Elves and High elf requests it's truly interesting, isn't it?

Same small group of Elves deployed in really three instances, WOTLK, MOP and Legion and in all three occasions, Dalaran was prominent.

What is more interesting though is the sheer number of Void Elves encountered out in the world. The fact you are giddy over the, what, SIX Alliance High Elves they added just has such a desperate ring to it.

Not while there is still High elves within the Alliance.

Is this another claim with source or just your opinion/interpretation?

Void Elves are another flavour of High Elf, so they do act as a replacement. And of course it's speculation, informed speculation. Alleria is a Void Elf, the Void is one of the upcoming threats to the world...be surprising if they weren't involved in fact.

You did, and most of the time you control yourself by coming the nearest to say 'never' just in case. Because you perfectly know it is a possibility and that it has basis for it.

There is a difference between nearly impossible and impossible. Alliance High Elves are nearly impossible given the red lines laid down by Blizzard. Which is what I have said, based on what they have told us it isn't happening but who knows, MAYBE they change their minds. Of course, based on what they have told us, that 'basis' you think exists is just something you've come up with for yourself. Blizzard has to change their minds first for it to exist, you simply can't declare it exists because you want it to.

It has also been appreciated how much the inclusion of Void elves support their concept as a way to also introduce High elves.

In fact, one of the most clear is that a playable Thalassian is now in the Alliance, thus the silhouette and model is there and is also Alliance.

Silhouette and model haven't been a factor since Pandaria. Theme, aesthetic and lore are the real dividing lines.

And if we have to inject some common sense into this little diversion, that because the model is now on the Alliance side the next step is easy, they aren't going to give the Alliance a second thalassian elf, particularly a copy of the Horde elf and especially when the lore has the vast majority of thalassian elves being on the side of the Horde.

'Vocal hardcore'. What do you want, to people to shut up? good luck.

Well it would be nice if pro High Elf commentators accepted the truth of the situation so I guess, yeah I'd like that.

However, as the request for Alliance High Elves show, wanting something that is virtually certain never to happen means at some point you have to learn to live with it.

I hope the pro High Elf community can learn to live with their continuing disappointment at not getting Alliance High Elves as I have learned to live with the fact they aren't going to stop talking about it.

I also think you are very flawed. You are even starting what i knew you were going to do. Say that High Elves are not even Alliance.

That's the downward spiral your stance in here is being turned on.

No, I said the Silver Covenant isn't Alliance. The organization, not the individuals. The few Alliance high elves left are clearly alliance, the clue being in the name.

You really like to use the whole of the HErs to make a point don't you? Remember that the Alurna manifest and the discord are not a political thing, we discuss a lot between ourselves and more than a time we had to maintain disagreements. Using this idea that all of us are a hivemind is flawed.

The fact you can't even agree on what you actually want between yourselves merely means you can never be satisfied. Almost anything Blizzard would try as a compromise would fail as there would still be some of you pissed off at not getting everything you wanted.

Still, I stand by my assertion. The large numbers agitating for 'high elf' like skins on Void Elves hole the argument that it is not the aesthetic that is the driving forced behind the movement. The sheer number of posters I read backing that movement puts the lie to that. The few people who genuinely care about the lore, or at least claim to, are a fig leaf for this demand.

'Blood Elves are High Elves' High elves still call themselves High elves, the same way their race does. And they are Alliance, not horde.

The majority of the high elf race is Horde

'Void Elves are another flavour of High Elf' yet it is another flavor of High elf, the race, not the group.

And a smaller chunk of the high elf race have converted to Void Elves.

'Void Elves...give something that feels like a Blood Elf but has a unique flavour of it's own to the Alliance'. Yet they are not the High elves that still call themselves like that and are Alliance aligned.

There is no hidden meaning to it, just the interpretation that you want to give to it, and given your stance you are just gonna use them in your favor. That doesn't make it the real meaning of it or more true.

As Void Elves can turn other Elves into Void Elves, the option to roleplay as a Void Elf who never became a Blood Elf and always served the Alliance is there. The refusal to take this option, to nitpick it, merely serves to underline that 'not being Alliance aligned' is a bullshit excuse. They can be if you want your Void Elf to have been. To admit the possibility and to still feel revulsion for the Void Elves is to admit that it has always been about the aesthetic, theme and lore of a Horde race.

Faction diversity, the concept, by itself, is not only a wow thing.

Faction diversity. The meaning of it, the most simple, is 'differences between the factions'. And that can have many routes.

There is still faction diversity if certain races are in both factions, and even more if these have differences between them. And given that for now we have the exact same race without differences in both factions and nothing happened we can only conclude that there is much more than races involved in the term 'faction identity'.

We are not talking about other games, we are talking about WoW.

Nor are we talking about the other routes other games have taken, we are talking about WoW.

In WoW, the factions are predicated on their races, not ideology or any other differentiating factor.

And faction diversity is predicated on ensuring the rosters of those factions are kept as diverse as possible from each other.

Attempting to say other games did other things or that what worked elsewhere might work in WoW is as relevant to the discussion as saying Daenerys shouldn't be able to ride a Dragon in ASOIAF because Smaug proved in the Hobbit that Dragons are nasty bastards.

In other words, a complete waste of time.

You are constantly saying that you know they don't want to do neutral races because you correlate neutral races with having the same race between both factions.

What we have that is called a neutral race is the exact same thing in both factions. High elves would not be the exact same thing, they would be similar. Stating otherwise is going against the linear logic of AR getting new additions when added and the common knowledge that HE already have differences with the Blood elves as being in a different faction with everything that comes along and a record of changing their relationship with magic.

Neutral race in the WOW context is terminology for the same race is shared between the two factions. As only one race is shared, the Pandaren, everyone knows what is meant so I am not going to say 'the same race shared in both factions' when neutral race is a much easier way of communicating that.
That is what Alliance High Elves would be as they are identical to Blood Elves. You saying they are similar is, firstly, wrong as we have been told Blood Elves are High Elves and secondly disingenuous as you imply that 'similar' is acceptable. Void Elves have been declared as being 'similar' to Blood/High Elves, another flavour of High Elf, and here you are arguing they aren't good enough.

You make stuff up with unrelated concepts or twisting things to just add where there is nothing.

No, you have it backwards. I was quite satisfied with Ion's very brief 'Blood Elves are High Elves, the Horde is waiting for you, Void Elves are another flavour of high elf for the Alliance'. It is the insistence of your side of the debate in trying (and failing) to prove him wrong that has led us to this depth of unnecessary detail.

I didn't said it isn't important. I said it is not as stagnant as those who opposes HE say it to be.

Stagnant implies it is a negative, which it is not. The developers prize faction diversity for good reason. Faction diversity is your enemy because it blocks Alliance High Elves. You have an innately selfish reason to undermine one of the core pillars of the game.

Well this is again your opinion and interpretation since this is not a fact.

It's easy to see that it comes from your biased view of Blood elves being High elves and thus by a wishful manner state that 'HE' (mixing and confusing race name and group name) are playable.

It's also your opinion that the HE AR it's a 'shift of that magnitude'. How dramatic.

'Blood Elves are High Elves' cannot be a biased view as all evidence supports that assertion. Is stating the Earth is round being biased towards a flat earther because the evidence happens to agree with the person stating the world is round?

I'm pretty happy with my -Sin'dorei- Aldo Hawk and i already play with the Alliance in BGs thank you very much.

Also, High elves are not Alliance. That's what you said, why did you wrote Alliance High elf yourself now?

Again, the organization and not the individuals.

Void elves are everything but a High elf of the Alliance, that's why they are still requested and you can repeat that they are another flavor all you want that it will not become true.

I don't need to repeat it for it to become truee, because they are another flavour of high elf. It is true regardless.

Whelp, you should work on that, since you have been presented plentiful information about the matter and still repeating this.

I've been presented with fan art and your opinions.

I don't see any High elf in the Alliance selection screen, only this strange thing that resembles them in a vague way.

Why are all these people asking for HE if they are playable? Because Blood elves aren't Alliance, Void elves are everything but a High elf and High elves are presented within the Alliance.

Look on the Horde side for the blonde, fair skinned Elf that reflects the trope. The Void Elf resembles them because they are a variant, and the people asking for them are doing so because they can't take no for an answer.

If your answer to them expecting anything in a Blizzcon is making fun i don't have anything kind to say.

It used to cause this topic to go quiet for six months until the announcement of the next Blizzcon set it going again. Maybe as 9.0 moves away from the Allied race system that period of peace will return, that is what I would like to see.

Void elves replacing High elves is your interpretation.

And an accurate one given their representation in game and the fact 'informed speculation' can easily predict a future for Void Elves in the narrative.

Should you trust Ion if he tells you something that you, with your own eyes can see it's not true? Of course not, that's naive.

Except he has said nothing that isn't true. Just because you badly want to discredit him doesn't mean you can, or have.

This has been discussed so much times i can't even bother anymore. He didn't denied their existence nor stating they will never do it. Move along.

Nobody said he was denying their existence. He was explaining why they weren't happening.

[Ielenia]

So the Pandaren are the same race available to both factions and this undermines the factions according to Ghostcrawler, but this is a completely separate scenario to Blood Elves and Alliance High Elves despite the fact the end result is the same race available to both factions if you get your way.

You can ask just about any 3D modeler or graphic designer worth their salt that works in the game industry, and they'll tell you one thing: the character model matters a hundred times more than what colors the textures on said models are. Why? Because a character's silhouette is more important than the colors of their skin or hair.

Which is why it's bollocks to say that the void elves are "physically different enough" because they have purple skin or purple hair. The color of their skin means little because their silhouette is the exact same as the blood elf silhouette. Night elf and nightborne have some slightly, very minor silhouette differences, but it's still the same silhouette.

Which is why the "giving high elves to the Alliance would blur faction lines/identity" is a load of bull since they gave the thalassian elf silhouette to the Alliance anyways.

[FlubberPuddy]

On what possible basis do you get the latter from the former? That's not even logical.

Void Elves have vastly better racials that Nightborne, like, hilariously better. Nightborne racials are outright bad. Possibly the worst in the game, though I may be forgetting some awful race. But let's pretend that doesn't factor in to popularity at all, I guess.

We were talking about looks. But if you're going to focus on racials then it just adds more to the pile of "people aren't playing Void Elves because they like the Void aspect".

If Void Elf popularity is occurring from people picking them for things like racials, or thin male body types, being an elf warlock on alliance side, etc then it becomes more and more clear that their thematic isn't the deciding factor but these other things.

This then minimizes the whole Void aesthetic which is being touted by lots here as if that's why Void Elves are successful.

And a person can like both the Void aesthetic and racials etc but we're not seeing that as often as people like you bringing up other reasons for why they picked a Void Elf. Heck, even people who pick them and say "there's the closest thing to a High Elf on Alliance" are also throwing their lot into that pile.

- - - Updated - - -

I just hope at least one or all of Blizzard's 4300 employees see the thought you put into your posts HERE. You obviously have a lot of innovative ideas, and I think you deserve to be heard.

Thanks, but this is a community effort. I'm not creative enough to have thought up the styles that other members have done in the OP and elsewhere like official forums. Very much appreciated.

[BlueRemedy]

You can ask just about any 3D modeler or graphic designer worth their salt that works in the game industry, and they'll tell you one thing: the character model matters a hundred times more than what colors the textures on said models are. Why? Because a character's silhouette is more important than the colors of their skin or hair.

Which is why it's bollocks to say that the void elves are "physically different enough" because they have purple skin or purple hair. The color of their skin means little because their silhouette is the exact same as the blood elf silhouette. Night elf and nightborne have some slightly, very minor silhouette differences, but it's still the same silhouette.

Which is why the "giving high elves to the Alliance would blur faction lines/identity" is a load of bull since they gave the thalassian elf silhouette to the Alliance anyways.

It's great that Blizzard feels so strongly about model variety when they have one robe in the game, fifteen years later.

[Strippling]

Which is why the "giving high elves to the Alliance would blur faction lines/identity" is a load of bull since they gave the thalassian elf silhouette to the Alliance anyways.

That is your opinion. On the other hand, Blizzard have stated that high elfs would blur faction lines. That is a fact sealed with Blizzard's signature..

You're entitled to your opinion, but in this case your opinion is flat out wrong.

- - - Updated - - -

The Alliance version of High Elves are Void elves.

I think it couldn't be more clear than that.

Fixed that for you.

- - - Updated - - -

I'll refer you to the following, coming from Ythisens, a former Warcraft CM:
https://curiouscat.me/CadenHouse/post/843519134

"Void Elves lore wise have less people than high elves but are playable."

How do you feel personally about the idea of High Elves becoming as an allied? What did the team think about them at the time of the massive megathreads?

Personally I have no issue with them becoming an allied race, as the arguments against it are pretty hard to make.
"Blood Elves and High Elves would look roughly the same." Pandaren already do this across factions.
"Lore wise there isn't enough High Elves to justify making them a playable race." Void Elves lore wise have less people than high elves but are playable.
"There's too many elf races." It's a fantasy game... and they already exist anyway.

There isn't a good reason to me apart from just flat out saying they don't want to do them. It's hard to justify game and lore wise why they can't be playable.

I can't talk about anything internal on the conversations, I'm just referencing what's been said in Q&As.

That is the opinion of a CM (former) on the matter. On the other hand, the game director of WoW stated they are too few in number and don't have any significant society anymore.

So we have the opinion of a CM versus the official statement of the game director. I know which one would "stand better in court".

[Ielenia]

That is your opinion. On the other hand, Blizzard have stated that high elfs would blur faction lines. That is a fact sealed with Blizzard's signature..

And so you would consider a filthy, rat-infested, mold-ridden restaurant "pristine clean" if the statement saying so had the owner's signature?

You're entitled to your opinion, but in this case your opinion is flat out wrong.

No. This time, if there is a "wrong opinion" in this subject, it's Blizzard's. Faction identity has been "blurred" already because Blizzard gave the Horde the night elf silhouette and gave the Alliance the blood elf silhouette.

Any argument about "blurring faction lines" after this point is just a load of bull, just like a restaurant owner claiming his restaurant is clean when there's rats walking everywhere and the place smells like mold.

[Goldielocks]

That is the opinion of a CM (former) on the matter. On the other hand, the game director of WoW stated they are too few in number and don't have any significant society anymore.

So we have the opinion of a CM versus the official statement of the game director. I know which one would "stand better in court".

This same ex-CM in a later Q&A on that site also admitted that faction identity is important.

[Strippling]

And so you would consider a filthy, rat-infested, mold-ridden restaurant "pristine clean" if the statement saying so had the owner's signature?

Your analogy is not comparable at all. Blizzard aren't hiding anything... there is nothing to hide. The matter at hand is that high elfs are already playable and Blizzard recognize this, thus officially declaring that playable high elfs on the Alliance would blur faction lines (given the race is already playable on the Horde).

No. This time, if there is a "wrong opinion" in this subject, it's Blizzard's.

Lmao!

That's all I can say. smh

[Ielenia]

Your analogy is not comparable at all. Blizzard aren't hiding anything... there is nothing to hide.

And neither is the restaurant owner in my example. All the rats and mold are in plain sight. He, just like Blizzard, is saying something that is verifiably not true. You can see that by the fact that Horde has the night elf silhouette and the Alliance has the blood elf silhouette.

Lmao!

That's all I can say. smh

Of course. Can't argue against facts.

[Strippling]

Can't argue against facts.

And here you are, trying to argue against facts that Blizzard have stated.

- - - Updated - - -

This same ex-CM in a later Q&A on that site also admitted that faction identity is important.

Oh interesting, thanks for the share. I'll have to re-read it as I must have missed that

[Aldo Hawk]

Fixed that for you.

Don't fix what's not broken.

It's not my problem that you can't understand that the High elves of the Alliance are the High elves. Void elves became everything but a High elf. They don't even came from a High elf group.

You are only playing devil's advocate just to go against the HE request, there's no honest argumentation in what you did with that quote modification.

[Ielenia]

And here you are, trying to argue against facts that Blizzard have stated.

Except they stated no facts regarding this issue. They simply stated an opinion that is verifiably wrong.

[Strippling]

Don't fix what's not broken.

It's not my problem that you can't understand that the High elves of the Alliance are the High elves. Void elves became everything but a High elf. They don't even came from a High elf group.

You are only playing devil's advocate just to go against the HE request, there's no honest argumentation in what you did with that quote modification.

Your whole argument relies on the premise that blood elfs aren't high elfs.. which is completely and utterly wrong.

"Blood elfs are our high elfs" - Chris Metzen. Blood elfs were designed to be the continuation of the high elf legacy, the next chapter of their story. The high elfs who align with the Alliance are fragment of this main high elven group (the blood elfs), they are not "High elves of the Alliance are the High Elves". The high elves in WoW ARE the blood elfs, that is where the story has taken them. It's not my problem you can't understand that the blood elfs (high elfs in the Horde) are the high elf fantasy in the WoW universe. That is the direction Blizzard decided to take them.

So no, I'm not playing devil's advocate just to go against HE. I'm trying to preserve the blood elven identity which for every intent and purpose IS the high elven identity. Blood elfs ARE our high elfs. Blood elfs ARE the continuation of high elfs, of everything the high elven society has been threw. The high elfs in the Alliance (what little there are of them) rejected their kin, and Blizzard left them behind as a group of "by-gones", a group clung to the past with no future of their own (as pointed out by Elisande). By requesting "high elfs in the Alliance", you're asking that Blizzard redefine the direction and focus they took with high elfs following TFT. We saw this direction manifested in the blood elfs. High elfs in the Alliance does nothing but take away from the high elven fantasy of WoW, which IS the blood elfs.

To me (and apparently to Blizzard), it would do the blood elfs a massive disservice if you took away from their uniqueness, just to implement high elfs for a few alliance players. High elfs have no right to do that, hence why they have remained as small story props to the blood elfs from time to time.... not full blown focus on them exclusive of blood elfs. Blood elfs are our high elfs, it's as simple as that. Hence why playable high elfs on the alliance would blur faction lines.

Oh and void elfs did come from a high elf group... they came from blood elfs, who are high elfs.

- - - Updated - - -

Except they stated no facts regarding this issue. They simply stated an opinion that is verifiably wrong.

Ythisens stated an opinion on the issue, an opinion which you and other pro helfers have used as "support". On the other hand, the WoW game director stated facts on the issue. Facts that you seem to deem as "opinion" simply because they go against your agenda.

[Eurhetemec]

I don't disagree with any of that FlubberPuddy. I don't think the void aspect is huge in their appeal. But let's be clear that the High Elves would be similar. People would be picking them to play slim males and elegant females that WoW humans don't offer. Not because they actually like the specific High Elf aesthetic.

However I suspect High Elves would not be able to be Warlocks (not with the Blood Elves existing), and I doubt their racials would be as good. Which would limit their popularity somewhat.

If you wanted to create a megapopular race you have to ignore some people here and go with the often suggested High Elf style appearance options for Void Elves, as you get the class options and racials of VEs but also bring in the small but meaningful number of people who just don't want to be a shade of blue!

I would say again that I support HEs as a separate Allied race but I think cosmetics for VEs are something we could see a lot sooner. It's like the Wildhammers - I'd love to have them as an Allied race but cosmetics would do.

[Niffo]

High Elves as races are coming, they just waiting for the right moment.